Suicidal male on Stockport viaduct 19 Jul 18

[ChrisHogan]

This appears to have started this morning at 5.30 am and is expected to go on until end of service. NRES suggesting a single trespasser on the line between Stockport and Heaton Chapel. Causing widespread disruption on West Coast and in northern England. Strangely nothing on national media about it.

 

[Highlandspring]

Suicidal male threatening to jump off the viaduct, arrived at 0530 and still there now. Judging from the information I’ve read this look like a very difficult one for the BTP and the medical staff on site to resolve.

 

[Antman]

I heard about this early this morning and I'm amazed it's still going on.

I might be a bit cynical but I can't help wondering if it's an attention seeker wanting to cause as much disruption as possible, if they were intent on suicide wouldn't they just do it?

 

[The Planner]

Suicidal male threatening to jump off the viaduct, arrived at 0530 and still there now. Judging from the information I’ve read this look like a very difficult one for the BTP and the medical staff on site to resolve.

One way of putting it considering what he turned up with!

 

[LOL The Irony]

He's been reported by passengers on passing trains to be drinking alcohol, throwing things at those trying to help, waving at passing trains and sticking the v's up at people.

 

[Jonfun]

I heard about this early this morning and I'm amazed it's still going on.

I might be a bit cynical but I can't help wondering if it's an attention seeker wanting to cause as much disruption as possible, if they were intent on suicide wouldn't they just do it?

Not necessarily. Look at things like "suicide by cop", where someone deliberately goads the police into shooting them dead.

For people who've never suffered depression it's very difficult to relate to what it feels like. Some days you might feel normal. And some days you might feel numb. Some days, you'll feel the most excrutiating pain like the hottest fire you can imagine burning through every single muscle in your body.

Taking deliberate risks is a known side effect of depression. Things like deliberately crossing the road without looking because you don't really care if you get run down by a HGV. It isn't an active attempt at suicide, you just do it because psychologically it feels like it puts you in control and if you die as a result thats that. It's no different in this case, lying on a viaduct wall drinking the contents of your fuel tank might kill you, might not. He most likely won't even care.

 

[ChrisHogan]

The problem with this incident was the widespread impact on the network. Sheffield was screwed up when I went through at 10 am and 2 pm with the Hope Valley disrupted. Virgin's thinned service plus XC's Manchester-Banbury services being disrupted screwed up the Coventry corridor. I hope this was a truly unique incident and won't be repeated in a hurry.

 

[Antman]

The problem with this incident was the widespread impact on the network. Sheffield was screwed up when I went through at 10 am and 2 pm with the Hope Valley disrupted. Virgin's thinned service plus XC's Manchester-Banbury services being disrupted screwed up the Coventry corridor. I hope this was a truly unique incident and won't be repeated in a hurry.

Exactly and it's quite ridiculous that one individual is able to cause this much disruption.

 

[Parallel]

I assume ATW's Manchester - South Wales services were diverted as they haven't been calling at Stockport.

 

[The 39 Steps]

In situations like this, when the trespassers are unco-operative, could police marksmen not use tranquilizer darts? It would avoid the "suicide by cop" scenario. I expect that when the individual is presented with the invoice for the delay they will feel suicidal again.

 

[muz379]

In situations like this, when the trespassers are unco-operative, could police marksmen not use tranquilizer darts? It would avoid the "suicide by cop" scenario. I expect that when the individual is presented with the invoice for the delay they will feel suicidal again.

He is laying on top of the parapet . Even if this was the normal way of dealing with this situation which it isnt . There is a massive risk that on falling unconscious he could fall off .

Then of course the shock or anger from the dart hitting him could make him jump . Tranquillizers dont work instantly .

 

[tsr]

Options have been explored to remove the individual, including the fire service assessing if he could be extracted by crane.

 

[Dr_Paul]

Ten o'clock in the evening and he's still up there, according to the local paper. It's been a long day for everyone concerned. It's fortunate that diversionary routes are available for many services.

 

[The 39 Steps]

I was not aware he was lying on top of the parapet until it was mentioned in post #11. It is reported that he is drinking alcohol so he may well fall off anyway. As for the use of tranquilizers if could be used when trespassers are running around the track, for example in station areas. I guess tranquilizers can have a modified dose. Alternatively ask him what his favourite drink is and supply it with the tranquilizer therein.

 

[Highlandspring]

Tranquilizer darts? Pure Hollywood. He’s apparently been drinking petrol for the last 3 hours so that in itself is likely to bring things to a natural conclusion sooner or later.

 

[Llanigraham]

Exactly and it's quite ridiculous that one individual is able to cause this much disruption.

I note that you criticise but don't give us a way that you would safely bring the situation to a close.
And I presume you have no experience of depression or mental illness.

 

[muz379]

I was not aware he was lying on top of the parapet until it was mentioned in post #11. It is reported that he is drinking alcohol so he may well fall off anyway. As for the use of tranquilizers if could be used when trespassers are running around the track, for example in station areas. I guess tranquilizers can have a modified dose. Alternatively ask him what his favourite drink is and supply it with the tranquilizer therein.

He may well fall off if he falls unconcious from drinking , but that would be of his own doing

There are no tranquillizer darts for humans .Sedatives delivered via intramuscular injection take at least 10 minutes if not longer to become effective . And lets face it even the most skilled marksman is not going to be able to reliably hit a vein with a tranquilizer dart to effect a quicker sedation .

He wont be administered any other substances to render him unconscious in any other way either . Regardless of the rights or wrongs of the situation he is afforded a duty of care . Giving him substances to render him unconscious whilst he is in a precarious position would not be upholding that duty .

 

[_toommm_]

The worst is that there is still no replacement transport between Manchester and Stockport after the incident has been on going for 18 hours. Network rail bods at Manchester telling people to Macclesfield to get a train to Wilmslow then Northern may provide taxis. Awful show imo

 

[LOL The Irony]

The worst is that there is still no replacement transport between Manchester and Stockport after the incident has been on going for 18 hours. Network rail bods at Manchester telling people to Macclesfield to get a train to Wilmslow then Northern may provide taxis. Awful show imo

Yeah. Can't they just terminate the services at Stockport and get Stagecoach to run some replacement buses? The guy is on the Viaduct so I can't see why they can't.

 

[Signal Head]

Yeah. Can't they just terminate the services at Stockport and get Stagecoach to run some replacement buses? The guy is on the Viaduct so I can't see why they can't.

Apparently over three hours into the incident there were no proper replacement buses arranged. Also, ticket acceptance on local buses was requested, but refused.

I would imagine, after being there for around 20 hours, tiredness will soon take its course, at which point he'll either fall off, or be 'removed'.

 

[bussnapperwm]

I assume ATW's Manchester - South Wales services were diverted as they haven't been calling at Stockport.

Losing up to 15 minutes in the process

Apparently over three hours into the incident there were no proper replacement buses arranged. Also, ticket acceptance on local buses was requested, but refused.

Surely TfGM could have got involved in forcing operators to accept valid tickets on reasonable routes, unless they were the ones refusing

 

[muz379]

Apparently over three hours into the incident there were no proper replacement buses arranged. Also, ticket acceptance on local buses was requested, but refused.

Surely TfGM could have got involved in forcing operators to accept valid tickets on reasonable routes, unless they were the ones refusing

I think its a tough one , the incident started at 5:30 and by the time it become apparent it was going to be a long one it was peak time . Local buses operating from Stockport to Manchester have their own peak time passenger flows as well . Not great for bus companies and their passengers if people further on their routes into Manchester cannot board because the bus is full of displaced rail passengers leaving Stockport .

 

[158756]

Losing up to 15 minutes in the process



Surely TfGM could have got involved in forcing operators to accept valid tickets on reasonable routes, unless they were the ones refusing

The issue, as always, will be money - obviously there's some to be made from displaced rail passengers, but there's also the problem that it rail traffic was diverted en masse to the bus with no extra capacity Stagecoach's paying, repeat customers wouldn't be able to get on. As far as I'm aware TfGM don't have the power to make Stagecoach carry passengers or run more buses for free.

I suppose it's also possible Stagecoach were offered the money but didn't have the vehicles or staff to put on more buses.

 

[Starmill]

Surely TfGM could have got involved in forcing operators to accept valid tickets on reasonable routes, unless they were the ones refusing

TfGM wouldn't have any influence over a bus company on the subject.

 

[Bungle965]

The man has been removed, after er... falling asleep.
Sam

 

[Antman]

I note that you criticise but don't give us a way that you would safely bring the situation to a close.
And I presume you have no experience of depression or mental illness.

Not really, do you?

Do you really think it's acceptable for one individual to cause so much disruption? Obviously I wasn't there so I'm not in a position to say what should have been done, seems he drunk himself into oblivion and eventually fell asleep.

 

[AlterEgo]

It’s not exactly clear how the situation played out (I don’t have access to control logs). Was he on the parapet from the outset?

 

[craigybagel]

I assume ATW's Manchester - South Wales services were diverted as they haven't been calling at Stockport.

Northbound they mostly still went through Stockport, running at extreme caution post the viaduct on the Down Slow, the line furthest from the individual. Southbound they went via Styal - which normally would actually be slightly quicker then Stockport but owing to the amount of trains using that route and disruption, they were held up behind other trains.

It’s not exactly clear how the situation played out (I don’t have access to control logs). Was he on the parapet from the outset?

He was indeed, same spot throughout. Very difficult to see what else could have been done given the precariousness of his position - and they couldn't even get a cherry picker to him, as was one of the earlier plans.

 

[YorkshireBear]

I wonder if the cost to the taxpayer of this incident could be factored into busiess cases for investing in loval social services and mental health....

For him to be up there with petrol which he drank, butane gas which he kept sniffing and having police negotiators, his doctor and his family all fail to talk him down he is clearly a very troubled individual and hopefully he will get suitable help and not just be fobbed off by our ever underfunded and understaffed care system.

 

[jfollows]

I was puzzled that the BBC appeared either to ignore or embargo this story completely, both on the Web site and in its news broadcasts that I saw, although the Manchester Evening News covered it throughout the day, much as it could anyway. The BBC seemed to think that people who might be affected could discover this themselves through other routes, and maybe that's generally true nowadays, but it seemed strange that such a major disruption appeared to go unreported.