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Suicidal male on Stockport viaduct 19 Jul 18

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Llanigraham

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Not really, do you?

Do you really think it's acceptable for one individual to cause so much disruption? Obviously I wasn't there so I'm not in a position to say what should have been done, seems he drunk himself into oblivion and eventually fell asleep.

Yes I do have experience of suffering from Clinical Depression, following an injury at work that is likely to mean me losing a finger. I look forward to your apology.

Whether I feel it acceptable or not is immaterial. There is no humane, safe or quick way of dealing with this type of situation, and frankly some of the suggestions on here are disgusting.
 

Esker-pades

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The problem is that mental health cases where it has got to such a point that death is considered the only option (as appears to be the case here) are very difficult to deal with. There is no quick nor easy solution to it.

Certain suggestions/comments show a severe ignorance as to the bahaviours of those with severe depression and further, those who are prepared to die by suicide. Especially any that are "why hasn't he just gone and done it" or along those lines.
 

backontrack

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And some are also losing their sense of priority.

If there's a chance of a life being lost, then ALL THE TRAINS CAN WAIT. Virtue Ethics, people.
 

xc170

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Mental illness/depression/whatever - he's still caused mass disruption for thousands of people and wasted the valuable time of the emergency services.

This could have been resolved in an hour if we hadn't become so soft.
 

backontrack

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Mental illness/depression/whatever - he's still caused mass disruption for thousands of people and wasted the valuable time of the emergency services.

This could have been resolved in an hour if we hadn't become so soft.
The emergency services? Oh yes, the emergency services who should have let this man die because they had more convenient lives to save elsewhere. :rolleyes:
 

AlterEgo

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And some are also losing their sense of priority.

If there's a chance of a life being lost, then ALL THE TRAINS CAN WAIT. Virtue Ethics, people.

How long should the trains wait for? Philosophical question.

You can use virtue ethics to justify suicide, as well. :)
 

CHAPS2034

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I was puzzled that the BBC appeared either to ignore or embargo this story completely, both on the Web site and in its news broadcasts that I saw, although the Manchester Evening News covered it throughout the day, much as it could anyway. The BBC seemed to think that people who might be affected could discover this themselves through other routes, and maybe that's generally true nowadays, but it seemed strange that such a major disruption appeared to go unreported.

The BBC were covering it in travel reports on National Radio all day although it was just referred to as trespass. I thought there were some sort of guidelines now recommended that the details of things like this were kept quiet at least whilst the incident was on going?

I had to go to Shrewsbury from Cheadle Hulme yesterday morning. Luckily I have a bus that goes to Wilmslow (130 Arriva) approximately hourly and I caught that - and the driver was accepting train tickets.

The bus was 15 late and so was likely to just miss the connection at Wilmslow. Luckily the train was also delayed coming up along the Styal line and the connection was made.

Coming back at 8pm, I was amazed to discover the incident ongoing. However the ATW was on time and when we got back to Wilmslow, the train was routing via Stockport. The stopper was in the siding at Alderley, so I waited for that to arrive and arrived home only 5 late - and that was because it was late leaving Alderley after being delayed to let a diverted Pendo in front.

But it certainly disrupted thousands of journeys yesterday.

Don't bank on it. He did exactly the same thing a month ago, so give it a month or so and he will be back.

Don't remember this but I have been away a bit. If this is the case perhaps he should be sectioned to get more intensive help?
 

backontrack

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How long should the trains wait for? Philosophical question.
I genuinely don't know. But a day's delay certainly doesn't seem out of the question if it could prevent a life from being lost.
You can use virtue ethics to justify suicide, as well. :)
Perhaps. But that is dependent on the circumstances. The fact is that this individual didn't kill themselves. The facts also suggest that they were acting irrationally - an important distinction to make.
 

MichaelAMW

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And some are also losing their sense of priority.

If there's a chance of a life being lost, then ALL THE TRAINS CAN WAIT. Virtue Ethics, people.

What a shame the same doesn't go for the roads, where we seem to accept nearly 2000 deaths a year and they are left essentially unsupervised for people to break the law as they please. I don't say that just to drift the thread but to point out that in one situation we go to extraordinary lengths to deal with the well being of one individual whilst in others we apparently don't care at all about thousands. It's this disparity that actually makes it quite difficult to decide what society should "put up with" when it comes to preventing harm and death in a specific situation, because there's already such a wide range of responses in different circumstances. The fact is that many people act in ways that are dangerous and harmful, to themselves or others, simply on the grounds that they can't or won't wait.

I genuinely don't know. But a day's delay certainly doesn't seem out of the question if it could prevent a life from being lost.

Ditto.
 

backontrack

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What a shame the same doesn't go for the roads, where we seem to accept nearly 2000 deaths a year and they are left essentially unsupervised for people to break the law as they please. I don't say that just to drift the thread but to point out that in one situation we go to extraordinary lengths to deal with the well being of one individual whilst in others we apparently don't care at all about thousands. It's this disparity that actually makes it quite difficult to decide what society should "put up with" when it comes to preventing harm and death in a specific situation, because there's already such a wide range of responses in different circumstances. The fact is that many people act in ways that are dangerous and harmful, to themselves or others, simply on the grounds that they can't or won't wait.
When did I ever pass comment on roads?
 

DarloRich

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Mental illness/depression/whatever - he's still caused mass disruption for thousands of people and wasted the valuable time of the emergency services.

This could have been resolved in an hour if we hadn't become so soft.

oh dear. Another silly posting: Let him jump. Sod the people who have to witness the situation and then pick up the bits.
 

Llanigraham

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Mental illness/depression/whatever - he's still caused mass disruption for thousands of people and wasted the valuable time of the emergency services.

This could have been resolved in an hour if we hadn't become so soft.


What do you suggest? Shoot him?
 
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AlterEgo

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What a shame the same doesn't go for the roads, where we seem to accept nearly 2000 deaths a year and they are left essentially unsupervised for people to break the law as they please. I don't say that just to drift the thread but to point out that in one situation we go to extraordinary lengths to deal with the well being of one individual whilst in others we apparently don't care at all about thousands. It's this disparity that actually makes it quite difficult to decide what society should "put up with" when it comes to preventing harm and death in a specific situation, because there's already such a wide range of responses in different circumstances. The fact is that many people act in ways that are dangerous and harmful, to themselves or others, simply on the grounds that they can't or won't wait.

I don't think this illustrates the point you think it does. Many times, roads are closed in similar circumstances because someone is threatening to jump from a bridge, or is walking down the middle of the M1.
 

Antman

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Yes I do have experience of suffering from Clinical Depression, following an injury at work that is likely to mean me losing a finger. I look forward to your apology.

Whether I feel it acceptable or not is immaterial. There is no humane, safe or quick way of dealing with this type of situation, and frankly some of the suggestions on here are disgusting.

I'm sorry to read about your accident at work but I'm not sure what else I've got to apologise for?

Honestly, does somebody intent on taking their own life really bring a picnic along with them? Beer, sandwiches etc.

I've not read anything disgusting on this thread but it seems impossible to discuss some subjects without somebody taking offence.

Just for the record, a member of my extended family took their own life a few years ago so I'm certainly not unsympathetic.
 

bramling

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oh dear. Another silly posting: Let him jump. Sod the people who have to witness the situation and then pick up the bits.

People pick up pieces from fatal incidents all the time. Some people, perhaps many or even most, may find it distasteful, however there’s no right or wrong answer to the question of what to do in this situation, simply a personal judgement on what the “right” thing to do.
 

8089

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Honestly, does somebody intent on taking their own life really bring a picnic along with them? Beer, sandwiches etc.

It seems totally nonsencical, and that's the big problem. If that's what depression does, how can anyone make sense of it? Its such a volatile thing.
 

EM2

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But this individual clearly was thinking rationally.
How were they? Your own argument is that someone intending to take their own life doesn't take a picnic. So they were not thinking rationally.
However, it's not unlikely that when this person set out that morning, with their food and beer, they had absolutely no intention of doing what they did. Packed up their picnic, ready for who knows what, maybe a day at the cricket or even trainspotting. But for some reason, something happened and they decided against that and on a different course of action instead. Not for any reason that you or I might, but for some other, seemingly irrational, reason.
 

8089

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If I'm to believe some individuals here, it just isn't and there's no knowing why. I think the problem here is the spectrum of irrational actions in these situations is really quite wide than a lot of us understand.
 

farleigh

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Where has it been reported that he was either suicidal or depressed?
Not denying it but can't find any evidence online
 

Esker-pades

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Mental illness/depression/whatever - he's still caused mass disruption for thousands of people and wasted the valuable time of the emergency services.

This could have been resolved in an hour if we hadn't become so soft.

OK. Firstly, how could it have been resolved faster? I trust specialist teams who's job it is to talk people in such a situation away from it to do it in the best way to preserve the most life as that is the aim. Secondly, a waste of emergency service time? Isn't this exactly the sort of thing that the emergency services are there to deal with?
 

pemma

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Secondly, a waste of emergency service time? Isn't this exactly the sort of thing that the emergency services are there to deal with?

Emergency services are supposed to be prioritise cases. If you fall over and break your ankle you might have to wait a while for an ambulance as you're in an uncomfortable situation rather than a life and death situation. Likewise a burning block of flats will get priority over a hay shed being on fire.
 

pemma

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I feel I should a link to Forum Guidelines on this kind of thing here:

https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/service-disruption-threads.160272/

It has now been reported by a reputable national media outlet.

BBC News said:
Train passengers in Greater Manchester faced disruption to rail services while police dealt with a man on a viaduct in Stockport.

British Transport Police said its officers were called to reports of a man on the track at 05:30 BST on Thursday.

Some lines between Manchester Piccadilly and Stockport were blocked and subject to delays.

It took emergency services almost 24 hours to bring the man to safety.

Network Rail said the line was cleared at 04:20 BST and British Transport Police Greater Manchester later tweeted that the "trespass incident" at Stockport was "resolved".

"We would like to thank the public for their support and understanding as we tried to bring the man to safety as quickly as we could," Network Rail added.

The incident led to significant disruption with some trains diverted.

Virgin Trains, which operates services between Manchester and London Euston, did not serve Stockport and Macclesfield stations while the incident was ongoing and instead ran a bus service between Macclesfield and Wilmslow.

Trains are now running as normal.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-44893447 so within forum rules it can now be discussed. Yesterday morning it shouldn't have been discussed unless people needed advice about alternative travel arrangements.
 
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