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Discussion in 'UK Railway Discussion' started by theironroad, 16 Mar 2018.
Last time: 538 turnout
This time: 483 turnout
Number entitled to vote remained the same.
RMT to strike on
Friday 22nd February
Saturday 9th March
Saturday 16th March
There has also been a large intake of Guards recently, which would have offset the 'entitled to vote', if some have joined the RMT.
Worth pointing out that guards that are still within their 6 month probationary period are advised that striking within 6 months is advised against and are unlikely to be part of the Union by that stage either.
Internal news letter alleges that SWR are offering the same deal as Northern... which is clearly incorrect as SWR are promising to roster, where as ARN are guaranteeing all trains in service will have a guard... naughty.
I've heard at interview some are told not to join a union
Anyway regarding SWR this BBC quote doesn't make sense..
A spokesperson for SWT (sic) said: "We have repeatedly committed to rostering a guard on all our services - the same assurance that seems to have been sufficient for the RMT to suspend its strikes elsewhere in the country only yesterday.
But the same number were entitled to vote or is that bit of previous stats wrong?
I support guards on all trains but I also don't support the twisting of stats.
Either someone doesn't understand what has happened in the north; have been misinformed or they are lying.
I wonder which it is or is their another possibility not thought of.
Oh if they’ve made that quote public then that’s even worse. As infobleep says, it’s either someone not understanding the northern deal, or someone is intentionally not telling the truth to try and convince/turn those that don’t know the whole truth against the RMT. I know which one my money is on.
After my post I suddenly thought perhaps they aren't lying.
After all if there is a guard on every train in the Northern deal then thee has to also be a guard rostered on every train.
So they are not lying but giving a fulse impression.
However no doubt its probably just a statement, which the BBC print without question and if they were to try and aks for clarification SWR might not have anyone avilable to answer.
SWR do have meet the manager events so maybe someone could ask a manage about it.
Well, anyone who thought that the guards had been defeated will be stirred by this news. These three days of action are going to bring SWR to its knees!
The cynical might suggest that, whatever your opinion on the cause of the dispute, this is an utterly pointless gesture that will just piss off passengers and give the guards some extra days off, whilst changing SWR's position not at all, but I say them, ye of little faith! Those brave guards are risking everything for you. To victory!
Number of RMT members eligible to vote in the September 2017 ballot - 805, of which 504 were in favour of strike action
Number eligible in this month's ballot - 753 (425 in favour of strike action)
Total number of SWR guards - 900+?
Regardless of the rights and wrongs of the dispute, why would SWR do anything apart from sitting back and waiting?
Either the RMT goes for a big escalation to force the issue or continues on a path to irrelevancy.
How did the number of guards in the Northern ballot change over time?
There was no requirement for fresh ballots every six months as the first ballot took place before the TU Act became law so we'll never know.
In normal service any SWR train without a guard would be cancelled as per the northern deal, only difference is they’re seeking to negotiate an exemption during disruption, which I’m pretty sure they’ve stated openly all along.
For Class 701s only.
Well it wasn't openly stated in the BBC quote. So either the BBC misquoted them or they were ecnomincal with their statement to the BBC and others.
I see what you mean about that particular statement not directly mentioning any disruption clause ,however as far as I understand they’ve proposed to roster a fully qualified guard on all their services which so far is a better offer than the as yet undefined second person’s role on Merseyrail, whose strike the RMT were willing to suspend a long time ago, but as it’s primarily about preserving the bargaining power that goes with stopping trains, almost everyone knows that particular statement is unlikely to change anything.
SWR have always said a fully qualified Guard will be rostered on all their services. The issue is the definition of "disruption" that would allow the 701s to run without a Guard. Amongst other fears are:
SWR will cut back on Cover duties in the Suburban area;
A Guard going sick might not have the duty covered if their work was all booked for 701s;
Guard's booked a duty all on 701s could be asked to swap onto an uncovered duty involving mainline work (conditional on route/traction knowledge) because the 701 could operate DOO; and
It's the slippery slope for the next franchise when there is a high chance 158s/159s/442s/444s/450s will all be replaced so this method of working just gets expanded (RMT would argue they are setting a precedent but don't want any change to the role).
For various reasons SWR senior management have not built up trust with the RMT over these changes. Furthermore they were not DfT mandated but simply part of the First MTR bid plans. Stagecoach was not going to make these changes.
Either way, won't these 701s be built with bodyside cameras (would be pointless not to)and if so, could it be considered a lost battle for RMT. I know the 707s have bodyside cameras but SWR have only ever been talking about 701s from my knowledge.
I find it slightly annoying that RMT genuinely have some sort of argument that's not just "DOO is dangerous, it's evil's work. We get what we ask for" which is all I've ever seen of them myself.
A sad fact of life is that people on here do a better job of explaining the argument than the RMT.
A quick q for purely selfish reasons.
What’s the next earliest date that there could theoretically be strikes announced for.
In particular could there be strikes called for the 23rd and 30th March?
Having previously had no alternative but to travel on one of the “strike Saturdays”, it’s not an experience either myself or my (disabled) wife would want to repeat for several reasons.
Many thanks in advance.
The RMT must provide 14 days notice, you will be safe for Saturday 23rd March if no strikes have been called by the night of Saturday 9th March, I'm sure you get the point!
The RMT should employ someone to handle the media, ie press releases and radio interviews to try and get the public on their side and that it "isn't all just about the doors".
If I’m correct in my understanding , it’s already been explained on here that due to their current national policy the RMTs NEC wouldn’t approve any deal involving DOO regardless of how small or however trustworthy the negotiators were on both sides
It's probably more of a case of SWR not building trust with its staff. Otherwise why would guards at depots such as Salisbury and Bournemouth vote to strike against proposals that don't affect them?
Isn't it just simple solidarity? Thin end of the wedge and all that.
I'm sure that's right. Plus the fact that if you've been on strike several times already, you feel a kind of momentum and you're likely to say to yourself "Why give up now? Let's keep going" even if, at the same time, you might have a deep down feeling of doubt about the final outcome.
Heart-warmingly 1970s but continuing for so long? Only on the railways.
They're probably taking heart from what happened at Northern.
I wonder what's being said to the man who started all this and said he wanted these unions off "his" railway? If I were SoS I'd be asking for an accounting - all this pain and what has been achieved?