SWR Repaints and Refurbishments

[Bletchleyite]

Hopefully the massively OTT “SWR” lettering will also get kicked into touch...

First just can't get away from overbranding things. Once upon a time it was seemingly a competition as to how many instances of the pink "F-in-circle" could be stuck on things and in how inappropriate a place they could be stuck.

The logo and lettering (either SWR or South Western Railway written out in full) should appear at most once on each vehicle. More and it looks very stupid.

 

[spark001uk]

I really thought SWR was going to be a breath of fresh air, with a clear vision going forward. Instead we get no sense of direction, inability to cope in a crisis, insufficient communication, and a generally lax approach to franchise commitments. I see so many tweets from pax asking for SWT back, something I really didn't think I'd ever see!
FWIW I personally think the 442 repaint is about the best they've come up with so far.

 

[lewisf]

Maybe inverse is the wrong word, but they were suggesting the Dark Blue colour all over with Grey doors.

That would look so much better. I remember seeing a picture of one of the refurbed 442s cropped with just the front third of the driving car showing and thinking how good it would look if the whole train was dark blue.

 

[43096]

I really thought SWR was going to be a breath of fresh air, with a clear vision going forward.

You honestly thought First would make it better? That's one of the best laughs I've had all year!

 

[spark001uk]

You honestly thought First would make it better? That's one of the best laughs I've had all year!

No but I thought MTR would make it more punctual.

 

[fgwrich]

I really thought SWR was going to be a breath of fresh air, with a clear vision going forward. Instead we get no sense of direction, inability to cope in a crisis, insufficient communication, and a generally lax approach to franchise commitments. I see so many tweets from pax asking for SWT back, something I really didn't think I'd ever see!
FWIW I personally think the 442 repaint is about the best they've come up with so far.

I completely agree with you. IF, if they managed to bring some sort of management team that turned FGW around from the combined mess it was under Ms Forster into the the once decent, award winning franchise, that it was post disastrous rebrand then we could have been on to another winner. Instead we've got a franchise which lacks direction, looks and feels confused and doesn't seem to know which direction it wasn't to go. In short, it feels like a franchise in lurch now.

That would look so much better. I remember seeing a picture of one of the refurbed 442s cropped with just the front third of the driving car showing and thinking how good it would look if the whole train was dark blue.

Well, there is a fairly large number of First Group "Golden Wonder" Blue tins of paint lying around somewhere since 2015...

 

[fgwrich]

Sticking with confusion and the refurbished units, it appears that some of the refurbished 444s have had a minor alteration to the SWT livery. One has had the blue dots denoting it’s first class shortened, while others have not creating an overstretch.

Then again, on the refurbished 159, the now Yellow band starts later than the First Class section does due to the slant in the livery.

As for the stupidly large SWR lettering and “Ski Challet” logo will also get the boot. It looks awful on the 442 / 444s where in the middle, we are subjected to a stupidly oversized version.

 

[swt_passenger]

Sticking with confusion and the refurbished units, it appears that some of the refurbished 444s have had a minor alteration to the SWT livery. One has had the blue dots denoting it’s first class shortened, while others have not creating an overstretch...

444019 is the one I mentioned last week, the external markings are still two bays too long, and causing passenger reluctance to use the extra standard seating area. The text on the windows visible from inside seemed the main reason.

 

[43096]

I completely agree with you. IF, if they managed to bring some sort of management team that turned FGW around from the combined mess it was under Ms Forster into the the once decent, award winning franchise, that it was post disastrous rebrand then we could have been on to another winner. Instead we've got a franchise which lacks direction, looks and feels confused and doesn't seem to know which direction it wasn't to go. In short, it feels like a franchise in lurch now.

The turnaround of FGW's performance was orchestrated by Andrew Haines, who sadly left (but is thankfully back in the rail industry running NR). FGW/GWR has gone backwards since then as "Hapless Hopwood" might have been good as an Ops Director but he has been over promoted to MD. In turn, Worst promoted Andy Mellors from Engineering Director of GWR (where he oversaw the worst performing TOC fleet in the country) to MD of one of the biggest and most complex franchises (SWR). It was never going to go well.

 

[Goldfish62]

Sticking with confusion and the refurbished units, it appears that some of the refurbished 444s have had a minor alteration to the SWT livery. One has had the blue dots denoting it’s first class shortened, while others have not creating an overstretch.

Then again, on the refurbished 159, the now Yellow band starts later than the First Class section does due to the slant in the livery.

As for the stupidly large SWR lettering and “Ski Challet” logo will also get the boot. It looks awful on the 442 / 444s where in the middle, we are subjected to a stupidly oversized version.

It's a real mess. SWT liveried units would have looked better with the SWR name the same size as and just covering the SWT name. The oversized white lettering looks like it's been done by a five year old, although it appears that it's some branding agency called "ForPeople".

 

[Goldfish62]

The turnaround of FGW's performance was orchestrated by Andrew Haines, who sadly left (but is thankfully back in the rail industry running NR). FGW/GWR has gone backwards since then as "Hapless Hopwood" might have been good as an Ops Director but he has been over promoted to MD. In turn, Worst promoted Andy Mellors from Engineering Director of GWR (where he oversaw the worst performing TOC fleet in the country) to MD of one of the biggest and most complex franchises (SWR). It was never going to go well.

My friends at GWR do not speak highly of Mellors to say the least, but reckon Hopwood is OK. Their issue with Mellors is that he has a knack of winding up staff when he doesn't need to.

 

[Kite159]

I only noticed today that the quiet coach on the refurbished 159s (at least on 159006 & 159010) has shifted to the composite coach by the marking on the doors...

... But not by the stickers inside, which are still in the other driving coach.

 

[spark001uk]

That 159 above's livery version does look a great improvement imo, the diagonal stripes were a bad idea. But that logo though.....

 

[swt_passenger]

That 159 above's livery version does look a great improvement imo, the diagonal stripes were a bad idea. But that logo though.....

Liking the international standard yellow stripe for First Class. Other livery designers please note.

 

[fgwrich]

Liking the international standard yellow stripe for First Class. Other livery designers please note.

Indeed, GWR Take note! If Great Anglia bring back the red stripe denoting Catering, then using the widely recognised yellow band first First Class be done. GWRs thin silver stripe is even less noticeable than the silly blue lines VTEC used. I rather like SWRs "Splash" around the doors.

Incidentally, the 07:35 from Basingstoke had 3 different versions in it's consist this morning. 159/1 in SWT v3, 158 in SWR version 1, 159 in SWR version 1 and 159 in SWR Version 3. I was also surprised to see an 11 car consist as well!

 

[Helvellyn]

Incidentally, the 07:35 from Basingstoke had 3 different versions in it's consist this morning. 159/1 in SWT v3, 158 in SWR version 1, 159 in SWR version 1 and 159 in SWR Version 3. I was also surprised to see an 11 car consist as well!

Do you mean 07:29 from Basingstoke? That is the 10-car diesel. There is no 07:35 (but an 07:36 12-car 450 stopper).

Also one of the 159s must have been running as a two-car. There is no way an 11-car diesel would be in service because it would be too long for all platforms.

 

[SWRtrain_fan]

Can someone please send a picture of the standard class area of a fully refurbished 450? Thanks

 

[fgwrich]

Do you mean 07:29 from Basingstoke? That is the 10-car diesel. There is no 07:35 (but an 07:36 12-car 450 stopper).

Also one of the 159s must have been running as a two-car. There is no way an 11-car diesel would be in service because it would be too long for all platforms.

That's the service, apologies I've been on nights this week so my times are a little out (and very much half asleep on the 07:05 from Reading). Im pretty sure It's been a 11 car both yesterday and this morning - with a 159 at the front, 158, 159, 159. I don't think there was any coaches missing from it - the rear 2 159s were as per normal, and the front one has been a SWT liveried version both days this week. Unfortunately I'm not on tomorrow morning so can't check.

 

[superalbs]

Can someone please send a picture of the standard class area of a fully refurbished 450? Thanks

 

[MatthewRead]

View attachment 56850

That doesn't look any different to the other refreshed units.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

That doesn't look any different to the other refreshed units.

Relocated first class, removed guard’s cab and blue grab handles

 

[lewisf]

That doesn't look any different to the other refreshed units.

The handholds are blue instead of orange.

 

[Benjy3000]

Any idea as to why the grab poles are still orange by the doors and if they are going to also be changed to blue?
Also if the Stagecoach blue cladding is going to be changed like in the concept art?

 

[swt_passenger]

Any idea as to why the grab poles are still orange by the doors and if they are going to also be changed to blue?
Also if the Stagecoach blue cladding is going to be changed like in the concept art?

Welcome.
127 units, 4 carriages, a pole at each of 8 doors at least. There’s also all the doorway grab handles. Cost? Labour and materials you could be looking at a couple of hundred thousand easily. What else might that buy?

 

[swt_passenger]

That doesn't look any different to the other refreshed units.

What were you expecting?

 

[Goldfish62]

Welcome.
127 units, 4 carriages, a pole at each of 8 doors at least. There’s also all the doorway grab handles. Cost? Labour and materials you could be looking at a couple of hundred thousand easily. What else might that buy?

You may as well say then why do the refurb at all? If it is only a couple of hundred thousand to do the whole lot that's peanuts. No, must be some other reason I'd have thought.

 

[Trainfan061193]

In all honesty, I much prefer this livery without the stripes. It especially sits well on the 159s. The 442s look good as well. I also wonder when they’re going to start repainting the 444s/450s.

 

[swt_passenger]

You may as well say then why do the refurb at all? If it is only a couple of hundred thousand to do the whole lot that's peanuts. No, must be some other reason I'd have thought.

If they’ve set a cap on the overall refurbishment cost it might be the optional extra, is what I’m thinking.

 

[Train Boy]

If they’ve set a cap on the overall refurbishment cost it might be the optional extra, is what I’m thinking.

The quoted figure is £50m.

"The £50m refurbishment programme is designed not only to improve the environment in which passengers travel, but also to increase seating capacity in standard class accommodation to meet the ever-growing number of passengers on one of Britain’s busiest railway networks. Siemens, which built the existing fleet of trains, is carrying out a complete refurbishment of the train interiors, providing as-new interiors and increased seating capacity to help us deliver on our commitment to boost peak seats at Waterloo by 30% by December 2020."

 

[RyanA-T]

Personally I feel changing all the poles as well as door button surrounds from orange to the same blue used for the seat hand grabs would make a huge difference to the trains, and really feel as if there has been a refurbishment rather than just new carpets and seat covers. I know first class is being moved or re-sized, buffet and guard office removed and a few new seats added but it still feels as if the refurbishments are ‘half-done’. The orange just doesn’t look right!