tacho rules on buses

Status
Not open for further replies.

TheWalrus

Established Member
Joined
6 Oct 2008
Messages
1,811
Location
Exeter
Hi

I'm wondering if anyone out there knows that if a route is 33.4 miles long with a journey time of 1hr20mins, will tacho rules apply to drivers or would you be able to get away without tachos?

Cheers
 
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R

RailUK Forums

Welshman

Established Member
Joined
11 Mar 2010
Messages
2,774
Some companies seem to circumvent the rules by breaking-up previously long, through journeys into several sections, and showing the sections as "guaranteed connections" in their timetables, when in fact its often the same bus and driver throughout.

This seems dishonest - either we sign up to the EU regulations or we do not.
 

mbonwick

Established Member
Joined
26 Oct 2006
Messages
6,191
Location
Kendal
I think the example you've given should be possible under UK domestic rules (ie. no tacho).

It's all very well saying we are circumventing EU rules - but remember that in doing so operators are still playing by UK domestic rules which have been around for longer, are easier to work to and make more sense.
Just think how expensive it would be to have every driver for a large company (eg. First/Stagecoach) equipped with a tacho card to follow EU rules to the letter.
Every other EU country plays the system - so why shouldn't we for a change?!
 

Ivo

Established Member
Joined
8 Jan 2010
Messages
7,307
Location
Bath (or Southend)
As Welshman says, some operators push the rules by breaking journeys up into "separate" routes that in practice form one continuous journey.

An example of this you may be familair with is the 66 from Swindon to Oxford, which "breaks" at Faringdon.
 

TheWalrus

Established Member
Joined
6 Oct 2008
Messages
1,811
Location
Exeter
Some companies seem to circumvent the rules by breaking-up previously long, through journeys into several sections, and showing the sections as "guaranteed connections" in their timetables, when in fact its often the same bus and driver throughout.

I am fully aware of this as many bus services in my area operate like this, including the one I use.

I'm pretty sure the time is ok, but I'm concerned the distance is over the limit to where tacho rules apply. What are the distance and time limits?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
An example of this you may be familair with is the 66 from Swindon to Oxford, which "breaks" at Faringdon.

I am aware of this one, I used it on Saturday for the second time :)
 

TheWalrus

Established Member
Joined
6 Oct 2008
Messages
1,811
Location
Exeter
Not sure on time, but the distance is 50mi.

Swindon-Trowbridge is 32.4 and time is roughly 1hr20mins. So maybe my example wouldn't work :?

Unless it's done on the round trip of continuous driving, in which case Trowbridge-Swindon would be 2hr40 and 64.8miles.

And what if there is a break before the return trip? Eg 1hr20 then a 20min break then 1hr20 back?
 

cainebj

Established Member
Joined
1 Nov 2008
Messages
2,620
Location
UK
It would need a tacho. The limit is 50km, which is approx. 31 miles. Distance is calculated from point A to point B, rather than a round trip of A-B-A (i.e. a destination up to 50km from base).
Time is irrelevant with if they need a tacho or not, but is relevant for drivers hours.
 

Ivo

Established Member
Joined
8 Jan 2010
Messages
7,307
Location
Bath (or Southend)
Swindon-Trowbridge is 32.4 and time is roughly 1hr20mins. So maybe my example wouldn't work :?

Unless it's done on the round trip of continuous driving, in which case Trowbridge-Swindon would be 2hr40 and 64.8miles.

And what if there is a break before the return trip? Eg 1hr20 then a 20min break then 1hr20 back?

In my experience the 49 never waits in Trowbridge because it's always late :shock:

I had no idea it was that long.
 

TheWalrus

Established Member
Joined
6 Oct 2008
Messages
1,811
Location
Exeter
It would need a tacho. The limit is 50km, which is approx. 31 miles. Distance is calculated from point A to point B, rather than a round trip of A-B-A (i.e. a destination up to 50km from base).
Time is irrelevant with if they need a tacho or not, but is relevant for drivers hours.

I have an example which I worked out is 32.9miles which ran without a tacho. How does that work? Is it done by the most direct route or by all the places it travels via?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
In my experience the 49 never waits in Trowbridge because it's always late :shock:

I had no idea it was that long.

Not when I've seen it or been on it! It does only have about 5mins turnaround at Trowbridge, Manvers Street though.
 

richw

Established Member
Joined
10 Jun 2010
Messages
9,725
Location
Liskeard
Devon and cornwall falmouth to newquay is a good example of playing the rules.
Route 88 falmouth to truro, where it becomes 88a truro to newquay.
Falmouth to penzance is also broken at helston, on some journeys where the bus calls round extra villages, as it is on the edge of the 50km before calling at extra villages slightly off route.

Sent from my HTC Sensation Z710e using Tapatalk 2
 

trentside

Established Member
Associate Staff
Senior Fares Advisor
Joined
14 Aug 2010
Messages
3,310
Location
The back cab
Stagecoach East Midlands have a number of services with 'guaranteed connections'. It confused quite a few people initially, but it seems to have sunk in now. The wording on the timetables has recently been changed to state that the split doesn't require a change of bus and is simply there because of 'DfT regulations'.
 

cainebj

Established Member
Joined
1 Nov 2008
Messages
2,620
Location
UK
I have an example which I worked out is 32.9miles which ran without a tacho. How does that work? Is it done by the most direct route or by all the places it travels via?

It is calculated by the exact route it takes, but doesn't include any duplcate stretches, like if you have to go around a one way system to get to a bus station, then around the one way system again to get to where you want to go.
There is a thing called manual entry, which can allow a non-tacho bus to work a route that needs a tacho, but it should only be used in the event a tacho fitted vehicle isn't available.
 

TheWalrus

Established Member
Joined
6 Oct 2008
Messages
1,811
Location
Exeter
It is calculated by the exact route it takes, but doesn't include any duplcate stretches, like if you have to go around a one way system to get to a bus station, then around the one way system again to get to where you want to
so would this include travelling up a 2 mile long section of road to reach a village then travelling back over the same section, then continuing its normal route?
 

anthony263

Established Member
Joined
19 Aug 2008
Messages
5,667
Location
South Wales
Yes I know Stagecoach south wales have split service 172 Aberdare-Porthcawl at Bridgend with a seperate service 72 running between Bridgend & Porthcawl although it is the same bus & driver.

Stagecoach south wales service X4/T4 Cardiff - Merthyr - Newtown/Herefrod via Brecon or Abergavenny use buses which are fitted with tachographs and the drivers only work those routes.
 

Schnellzug

Established Member
Joined
22 Aug 2011
Messages
2,926
Location
Evercreech Junction
It gives rise to this silly situation whereby nearly every longer distance route round this way dosn't say that it's going to where it actually goes; viz. Wilts & Dorset 184 Weymouth-Salisbury says "Blandford, connection for Salisbury", and is 183 between Bladnford & Weymouth, First 31 Weymouth-Axminster only claims to be going as far as Bridport, & the X53 likewise.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Top