Taking bread knives on european trains

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Mark_Lester

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Not something I was too worried about, till I read the thread on the Eurostar.
http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?t=64218

We are planning on doing quite a bit of picnicking, and as such had planned to bring several bread knives.
We wont need them till we leave Brussels, so we'll just work out where to get them there, but is this just a UK border anti-terror thing ?. Do the Scandinavians for instance think that carrying knives on trains is a security risk ?. What about the Thalys, or all the euro-nights we're getting. We probably wont be getting the knives out till we leave Amsterdam on the Borealis, but we need to know if we are going to have to live on sliced bread for 2 weeks!.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
so the thalys lists "blades" also.
http://www.thalys.com/be/en/services/before/luggage-animals
in general we're only going to be getting these out in sleeper compartments that we've booked entirely, but I just didnt consider this as "carrying an offensive weapon".
 
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Mark_Lester

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Spanish HiSpeed operator AVE do a knife arch and bag bomb check.
Thanks.
I guess we can make it back without the knives by the time we get to Barca, but we really will need them between Copenhagen right round to Geneva,
I'm planning to pop into a branch of blokker in Brussels and pick up a couple in there and leave them in the packaging till we leave Amsterdam.
 

Schnellzug

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Well, quite right too. We all know how likely it might be that Terrorists could break into the cab, stab the driver, take over the controls and drive at full speed into the buffers. We should all be greatful that the heroes responsible for Protecting us are doing such a sterling job.
 

HSTEd

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Well, quite right too. We all know how likely it might be that Terrorists could break into the cab, stab the driver, take over the controls and drive at full speed into the buffers. We should all be greatful that the heroes responsible for Protecting us are doing such a sterling job.
"Take this train to its SCHEDULED DESTINATION!"
 

Mark_Lester

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It's not a 'UK border anti-terror thing' - carrying such a knife, in public, would almost certainly be classed as an offensive weapon.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Knife_legislation
They are bread knives, no policeman in Christendom is going to arrest you for having a bread knife in your rucksack,
But no airline anywhere is going to let you take anything like that into the hold these days either.

The AVE searches for instance, are not body searches I'm told. so plenty of scope for bringing a few stanley knives (box cutter in non English), it's really a bomb search, Spain is severely traumatized by the Madrid railway bombings.

I think the Thalys will be fine, especially if we dont take them out of the packaging. The laws are intended for switch blades and I'm sure thats how they'll be interpreted, we're a bunch of middle aged boys and girls sat down cutting bread for Pete's sake.
 

tony_mac

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They are bread knives, no policeman in Christendom is going to arrest you for having a bread knife in your rucksack,
I am afraid that the police aren't always that open-minded.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1266170/Disabled-caravanner-prosecuted-keeping-penknife-car-use-picnics.html
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/3165489/Gardener-arrested-and-taken-to-court-for-carrying-work-scythe-in-van.html

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/4379766.stm

If you are found with it then you will have to prove that you have a good reason for carrying it. It's quite possible that 'I need it to cut bread' would not be considered a good enough reason.

It's your choice, and it will probably be fine, but is it worth the risk?
 

Mark_Lester

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those are fantastic Tony, thanks. In fairness the last 2 got thrown out and I suspect Mr Knowles was a bit arsey when pulled.

we're not going to be giving UK Border control the option, we'll pick up the kitchen utensils in Brussels.
If we get them confiscated by rail staff we'll just buy some more at the next stop. I can't see this being a problem as long as we stick to our compartments which is when they are going to be brought out.
AVE do full bag checks and may take them of us, but frankly they are looking for bombs, and we'll most probably by sick of the sight of sarnies, even fancy continental ones, by that time anyway.

I checked and most of Europe do not have laws about anything other than obviously offensive stuff like flick knives etc.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
I am just about to set off on a flight and started thinking gain about how crap this is of eurostar, IO mean I can take a disassembled kalashnikov on a a flight as long as it's in the hold of course, so I bothered to read the damn instructions again
http://www.eurostar.com/UK/uk/leisure/travel_information/before_you_go/prohibited_items.jsp
you CAN take samurai swords and such like on the eurostar, they have to go in the hold though!, which I didnt realise it had, though yo have to arrange it.
so cancel all this nonsense about buying bread knives in Brussels, we just need to contact them "well in advance" to arrange for a bag with the weapons to be stored in.
I also noticed that it says that you can only have 5 units of alcohol, so if you want to take a bottle quality scotch to your mates on the mainland then hard luck. What are these people trying to do ?.
 

tony_mac

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That page seems to suggest that large knives are not allowed at all, but swords may be accepted if you arrange it in advance. Let us know what they say!

The alcohol thing is complete rubbish, a single bottle of wine is well over their limit. I don't think I've ever been to France without bringing back a bottle of wine.

I assume that they are trying to stop people getting drunk on board, but that's just ridiculous.
 

4SRKT

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I never bring my bread knife on any train if I can help it. She doesn't like cranks, and moans all the time if I stick my head out of the window, so it's best if we pursue our separate interests, well.......separately.
 

Oscar

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The alcohol thing is complete rubbish, a single bottle of wine is well over their limit. I don't think I've ever been to France without bringing back a bottle of wine.
I had to take someone in Germany a large bottle of whisky from a friend at Christmas and no-one at Eurostar batted an eyelid.
 

Mark_Lester

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I had to take someone in Germany a large bottle of whisky from a friend at Christmas and no-one at Eurostar batted an eyelid.
As tony says, it's obviously utter rubbish, so why the hell put it on the rules.

On reflection, I guess these rules are all about football/stag parties. If you are nine sheets to the wind and/or carrying half a crate of stella, then you, or at least your portable bar, wont be going. You'd think that they'd have stuck in something about singing songs and generally upsetting anyone on a weekend break package or in first.

I'll get a letter of acknowledgement about the bread knives off them in case they pull a face about that so they can stick them in "the hold", (previously known as the guards van), and we have a contingency anyway (resupply in brussels). We will have had a toast at the John Betjeman as part of the full monty English breakfast, (it's also the birthday of the most well heeled chap in the gang as it happens) so I'm sure most of us will be getting the first of very many helpings of 40 winks during this opening leg.
But I do plan to be carrying a bottle of sloe gin as this island's entry in the eurovision hooch contest.
 
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WatcherZero

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True story, my grandmother was on a flight from Coffs Harbour to Sydney on QantasLink and they gave her a complementary sewing kit. She made the connection for the Qantas flight to Singapore and they confiscated the sewing needles as a potential weapon! That was back around 2002.
 

Chris999999

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I have never taken a bread knife on a train, but I have regularly travelled with my Swiss Army knife (less than 3 inch blade) in my luggage along with a pair of scissors (nearly 5 inches with a very pointed end). Bread knives usually have rounded ends so are probably less dangerous unless the intention is to saw someone to death.

Neither Eurostar nor AVE (Spain) have ever taken any interest after Xraying my luggage.

I think that as long as you are not waving these items around you will not have any trouble. After all, what can you achieve on a train? "I am hijacking this train. Take me to Cuba." It just doesn't work.

Even without these items, if I really wanted to stab anyone, this can easily be achieved with a ballpoint pen, a filed down toothbrush handle or comb.
 

JonathanP

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If you don't need the knife to be especially sharp, there is a simple solution, get a plastic knife as sold for use with non-stick baking tins. I have taken one of these on Eurostar without problems, though I did have to explain what it was to the bag screener. :roll:
 

Mark_Lester

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If you don't need the knife to be especially sharp, there is a simple solution, get a plastic knife as sold for use with non-stick baking tins. I have taken one of these on Eurostar without problems, though I did have to explain what it was to the bag screener. :roll:
Well it's true (as I just discovered) such things do exist, but I don't fancy my chances of cutting nice thin slices of bread with one.
Eurostar claim that if we let them know in advance they can "store it in the hold", so I fully expect, despite being armed with a signed letter from Eurostar, that they'll just confiscate them and we'll have to repurchase in Blokker in Brussels.
 

Eagle

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Well it's true (as I just discovered) such things do exist, but I don't fancy my chances of cutting nice thin slices of bread with one.
If it's a baguette you can make a decent job of it with kitchen scissors.

Although my dad was once stopped from entering the Natural History Museum because he had a large pair of paper scissors in his bag (he keeps all sorts of random crap in there).
 

Chris999999

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Have a look at the Batard Bread and Picnic knife. It is a folding knife with a 6 inch serrated blade and more importantly a corkscrew.

It won't look like a knife on an Xray.
 
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