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'Tangmere' failure on Cumbrian Mountain Express today - 21st September

12LDA28C

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It seems that 34067 'Tangmere' failed in serious fashion at Ormside on the return leg of today's CME (1Z87 1418 Carlisle - Euston) with a detached piston rod and pierced cylinder. The train was taken back to Carlisle by 47802 although it got no further, being cancelled there with tour participants heading home on Avanti services.
 
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YorkshireLass

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It seems that 34067 'Tangmere' failed in serious fashion at Ormside on the return leg of today's CME (1Z87 1418 Carlisle - Euston) with a detached piston rod and pierced cylinder. The train was taken back to Carlisle by 47802 although it got no further, being cancelled there with tour participants heading home on Avanti services.
Can confirm. Tangmere detached from the train and dumped in a siding at Kirkby Stephen. 47802 took the train back to Carlisle but was found to have incurred wheel damage in a tunnel on the way back to Carlisle. 86259 summoned from Preston to take the train back down South but with 47802’s wheel damage the train would not be permitted to exceed 60mph, therefore passengers decamped to the Avanti service to get home the same day we set off.
 

peteb

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I was following this on real time trains. After detaching Tangmere did the train go to Hellifield then back to Carlisle? RTT suggests it did but in that case I wonder why it didn't go to Carnforth from Hellifield?
 

12LDA28C

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I was following this on real time trains. After detaching Tangmere did the train go to Hellifield then back to Carlisle? RTT suggests it did but in that case I wonder why it didn't go to Carnforth from Hellifield?

There was no path available to Carnforth due to late night engineering possessions I believe.
 

YorkshireLass

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I was following this on real time trains. After detaching Tangmere did the train go to Hellifield then back to Carlisle? RTT suggests it did but in that case I wonder why it didn't go to Carnforth from Hellifield?
Train went back from Kirkby Stephen to Carlisle after detaching Tangmere. NR wouldn’t let the train leave until Tangmere had limped into the siding. Train couldn’t continue to Hellifield as there was no way to get 47802 on to the front of the train at Kirkby Stephen (or so we were told) hence the need to go back the way we came.
 

merry

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Train couldn’t continue to Hellifield as there was no way to get 47802 on to the front of the train at Kirkby Stephen (or so we were told)
Whilst there are crossovers at both Kikby Stephen and Appleby, a run round of the diesel would have involved two wrong direction moves through the block sections. It takes time to set such moves up and control authority is required as it is an emergency-only action. An MoM might also be required. So the line would have been blocked for a longer time, making a return to Carlisle preferred, and perhaps the wiser choice.
 

Wyrleybart

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It went back to Carnforth as 5Z67 hauled by 47802
Incidentally the youtube videos of this move seem to be scurrying along with no "clatter" from under 47802. I am wondering whether WCR had a fitter or techie at Carlisle to check 47802 over to see if it did sustain any damage.
 

Harvester

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Train went back from Kirkby Stephen to Carlisle after detaching Tangmere. NR wouldn’t let the train leave until Tangmere had limped into the siding. Train couldn’t continue to Hellifield as there was no way to get 47802 on to the front of the train at Kirkby Stephen (or so we were told) hence the need to go back the way we came.
How times have changed since 1980 when Leander was stuck at Kirkby Stephen on a southbound CME, some way behind failed 40179 on an up freight. BR allowed Leander to detach, cross over and run wrong line to get ahead of the failure. After crossing back to the up main 5690 reversed back, hooked up to 40179 and hauled it and the freight south to a siding at Garsdale.
 

merry

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How times have changed since 1980 when Leander was stuck at Kirkby Stephen on a southbound CME, some way behind failed 40179 on an up freight. BR allowed Leander to detach, cross over and run wrong line to get ahead of the failure. After crossing back to the up main 5690 reversed back, hooked up to 40179 and hauled it and the freight south to a siding at Garsdale.
A slightly different scenario in 1980; Leander will have been an assisting engine (run as 1Z99), in one of the exact scenarios for which wrong line working rules are designed. Not permitted for convenience... which is what running round constitutes.
Whilst there is another way to do the run round (shunt the train to down platform, run round right line), that might have required detraining all passengers (because the trailing crossover will usually not have facing point locks) and blocking the down line as well for a half hour minimum.
Whatever solution was used, it would be operationally messy. I reckon the chosen solution this time was, sadly, the most robust and simple operationally, even if boring and disappointing.
Worth considering how the delay affected available crew hours too, continuing might have pushed too close to the maximum.
 

david1212

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Can confirm. Tangmere detached from the train and dumped in a siding at Kirkby Stephen. 47802 took the train back to Carlisle but was found to have incurred wheel damage in a tunnel on the way back to Carlisle. 86259 summoned from Preston to take the train back down South but with 47802’s wheel damage the train would not be permitted to exceed 60mph, therefore passengers decamped to the Avanti service to get home the same day we set off.

Why would the train not been permitted to run at more than 60mph if hauled by 86259 from Carlisle to Euston?
The possibility of wheel damage also to the stock?
 

skyhigh

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Why would the train not been permitted to run at more than 60mph if hauled by 86259 from Carlisle to Euston?
The possibility of wheel damage also to the stock?
Risk of damaged wheel damaging the track. It is a rule book instruction. (Assuming the defective loco would have gone with it).
 

david1212

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Because 47802 would have been on the rear of the train to Euston.
Risk of damaged wheel damaging the track. It is a rule book instruction. (Assuming the defective loco would have gone with it).

I was presuming that with 86259 hauling 47802 would not be required.

Following on if 47802 was on the outward leg from Euston rather than added at Preston and Tangmere had not failed for 47802 around 450 miles of planned dead running plus the ECS mileage.
 

Mcq

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Anybody know what the plans might be for this much loved engine?
 

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