• Our booking engine at tickets.railforums.co.uk (powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!

The Beginning of the End of Sainsbury's ?

Status
Not open for further replies.

yorksrob

Veteran Member
Joined
6 Aug 2009
Messages
38,818
Location
Yorks
Obviously it's always bad news when job losses occur, particularly at a time of national distress, so the loss of 3,500 jobs at Sainsbury's is to be particularly decried.

However, I wonder if this marks a more fundamental problem for the company in relation to its customer base. Ultimately the supermarket has always been positioned at the higher end of the mainstream supermarkets. The news that they are to close fresh meat, fish and deli counters must surely put them at a major disadvantage within their own middle band competitors ?

Does this move not bring them nearer to the austere German discounters, to whom customers so inclined will have already defected ?

One suspects that they've overstretched themselves with the purchase of Argos, but even so, it seems fool hardy to damage your core product.

Perhaps it's at board room level where the dismissals need to take place !
 
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R

RailUK Forums

Ianno87

Veteran Member
Joined
3 May 2015
Messages
15,215
The deli counters etc. I'm convinced are basically loss leaders for the supermarkets, basically a sop to try and replicate the experience of "traditional" butchers etc.

I used to work in a large supermarket store, and the revenue they brought in per staff member employed was very low, compared to say fresh food or produce. I'd be surprised if they so much as broke even on them.

I think supermarkets would be stronger without them, and I can see competitors generally following suit. I don't think that the counters are a major influence on people choosing one particular supermarket over another.
 

Xenophon PCDGS

Veteran Member
Joined
17 Apr 2011
Messages
32,269
Location
A semi-rural part of north-west England
One suspects that they've overstretched themselves with the purchase of Argos, but even so, it seems fool hardy to damage your core product.

Would they have gone ahead with the Argos project unless their top staff and their consultants had fully considered all aspects of implications of the purchase upon the company balance sheet especially with the current market conditions being what they are.
 

najaB

Veteran Member
Joined
28 Aug 2011
Messages
30,692
Location
Scotland
I used to work in a large supermarket store, and the revenue they brought in per staff member employed was very low, compared to say fresh food or produce. I'd be surprised if they so much as broke even on them.
I've gone to the actual butchers more often than I've gone to the meat counter in my local Tesco, despite it being out of the way to go there. I suspect I'm not alone in that regard.
Would they have gone ahead with the Argos project unless their top staff and their consultants had fully considered all aspects of implications of the purchase upon the company balance sheet especially with the current market conditions being what they are.

Market conditions change.
 

WelshBluebird

Established Member
Joined
14 Jan 2010
Messages
4,923
Aren't most of the jobs lost from stand alone Argos stores? So not Sainsburies core business and were probably at risk anyway thanks to internet shopping etc. Also in terms of Argos they have said they are hoping to open some smaller stores within larger Sainsburies outlets - so carrying on from where they have started anyway, and indeed them doing that is probably linked to the fact that stand alone stores are having a harder time making money in todays work - even before COVID. As for the deli counters etc - certainly when I shopped there for about 10 years (from 2009 until last year) - the counters weren't used much at all anyway.
 

Gloster

Established Member
Joined
4 Sep 2020
Messages
8,289
Location
Up the creek
Mike Coupe, who led Sainsburys’ takeover of Argos, is now in charge of Track and Trace. (Insert you own joke here.)

EDIT: He is only in charge of the Test part. (There are so many jobs for the boys and girls that you lose track of things, just like them.)
 

najaB

Veteran Member
Joined
28 Aug 2011
Messages
30,692
Location
Scotland
Obviously, but the business consultants employed are well aware of matters on a long-term basis that enable them to move matters onwards with their customers.
Tell that to former employees of BHS, Woolworths, Thomas Cook, et al.
 

Ianno87

Veteran Member
Joined
3 May 2015
Messages
15,215
Obviously, but the business consultants employed are well aware of matters on a long-term basis that enable them to move matters onwards with their customers.

I don't think anybody reasonably predicted Covid, or could reasonably have done so.
 

hexagon789

Veteran Member
Joined
2 Sep 2016
Messages
15,715
Location
Glasgow
The news that they are to close fresh meat, fish and deli counters must surely put them at a major disadvantage within their own middle band competitors ?

Tesco is to do the same having already dropped most stores to having the counters open only Wed-Sat.
 

GB

Established Member
Joined
16 Nov 2008
Messages
6,457
Location
Somewhere
Think it will take more than the loss of the in-store Argos counters and the fresh meat/fish counters to end Sainsbury's.
 

FQTV

Member
Joined
27 Apr 2012
Messages
1,067
Part of the rationale for the Argos takeover was to reduce the costs of the Argos operation; specifically to close some or many standalone stores and bring more Argos branches into Sainsbury supermarkets themselves.

Today's announcement would appear, like a lot else that's happening at the moment, to be either an acceleration of that plan or, possibly, just an opportune moment to do it.

It should be noted, also, that having the Argos branches within Sainsbury's stores during the spring allowed those Argos branches to stay open for click and collect. That meant that Argos did much better (or less badly) than it would otherwise have done.

The separate closure of the fresh counters follows a strategy that Tesco has been following for the last couple of years at least.

Never let a good crisis go to waste.....
 

yorksrob

Veteran Member
Joined
6 Aug 2009
Messages
38,818
Location
Yorks
Would they have gone ahead with the Argos project unless their top staff and their consultants had fully considered all aspects of implications of the purchase upon the company balance sheet especially with the current market conditions being what they are.
Tesco is to do the same having already dropped most stores to having the counters open only Wed-Sat.

So possibly everyone dropping down to the lowest common denominator, with the supermarket experience going back to something like the 1980's.
 

GB

Established Member
Joined
16 Nov 2008
Messages
6,457
Location
Somewhere
Surely when all said and done this is probably a good thing (except for those staff that are directly affected). Not only does it allow for more retail space but more importantly further increases the importance of local butchers/fish mongers.
 

Darandio

Established Member
Joined
24 Feb 2007
Messages
10,674
Location
Redcar
So possibly everyone dropping down to the lowest common denominator, with the supermarket experience going back to something like the 1980's.

If we could go back to having more independent butchers and greengrocers on the high street, going back to something like the 1980's works for me.
 

RT4038

Established Member
Joined
22 Feb 2014
Messages
4,180
So possibly everyone dropping down to the lowest common denominator, with the supermarket experience going back to something like the 1980's.

If their customers (or a significant proportion of them) are voting with their feet, i.e. not prepared to pay for a higher standard, then what option do they have?
Still plenty of deli counters open, in every Eastern European shop! (about 8 in my town)
 

yorksrob

Veteran Member
Joined
6 Aug 2009
Messages
38,818
Location
Yorks
If we could go back to having more independent butchers and greengrocers on the high street, going back to something like the 1980's works for me.
If their customers (or a significant proportion of them) are voting with their feet, i.e. not prepared to pay for a higher standard, then what option do they have?
Still plenty of deli counters open, in every Eastern European shop! (about 8 in my town)

I suspect that there may be different clientelle who have the time or inclination to go searching around lots of different shops for their food shopping.
 

Crossover

Established Member
Joined
4 Jun 2009
Messages
9,247
Location
Yorkshire
Mike Coupe, who led Sainsburys’ takeover of Argos, is now in charge of Track and Trace. (Insert you own joke here.)

EDIT: He is only in charge of the Test part. (There are so many jobs for the boys and girls that you lose track of things, just like them.)

We're in the money, The sky is sunny........
 

Ianno87

Veteran Member
Joined
3 May 2015
Messages
15,215
Sainsburys were forbidden to join forces with one of the other top supermarkets in recent years, as it was said such an amalgamation with them would post a detrimental threat to Tesco in terms of market share.

Not just to Tesco, but the supermarket and convenience 'market' in general with one excessively dominant company.
 

Ianno87

Veteran Member
Joined
3 May 2015
Messages
15,215
When the amalgamation was forbidden, is it not the case that Tesco still had a larger market share than the combined market share of the other two companies?

Tesco currently stands at about 26%.

Sainsbury's plus Asda would be about 29%
 

Bald Rick

Veteran Member
Joined
28 Sep 2010
Messages
29,070
Sainsbury’s are fine. In my near two decades of shopping there I have never once used the fresh meat or fish counter. In the couple of years they have had an Argos in the store I have used that several times - and done so at the same time as doing the weekly shop instead of making to make a separate trip to an Argos store, saving me time and money (on petrol & parking).

Whilst one person’s experience does not make a trend, I think this is precisely what Sainsbury’s have been experiencing, so it is not surprising. I note that not withstanding the job losses, Sainsbury’s will have been a net recruiter this year.
 

yorksrob

Veteran Member
Joined
6 Aug 2009
Messages
38,818
Location
Yorks
I am an occasional user of the deli counter. I may make a a few special visits to it while its still there.
 

transportphoto

Established Member
Associate Staff
Quizmaster
Joined
21 Jan 2010
Messages
4,570
The only thing I use Sainsbury’s counters for is the Pizza… that, I shall miss - but I’ll get over it! Sad reality is that this is business, things have got to be financially justifiable!
 

birchesgreen

Established Member
Joined
16 Jun 2020
Messages
5,044
Location
Birmingham
The deli counters etc. I'm convinced are basically loss leaders for the supermarkets, basically a sop to try and replicate the experience of "traditional" butchers etc.

Depends where the deli counter is, my wife used to work on the deli counter at Canary Wharf Waitrose and that counter bought in a lot of revenue, though counters at other branches less so.
 

hexagon789

Veteran Member
Joined
2 Sep 2016
Messages
15,715
Location
Glasgow
So possibly everyone dropping down to the lowest common denominator, with the supermarket experience going back to something like the 1980's.

They lose too much money. As I understand it Tesco are to keep the pizza and hot food counters as they make money but the delicatessen, meat and fish counters do not
 

Bedpan

Established Member
Joined
4 Feb 2010
Messages
1,286
Location
Harpenden
Our local Sainsbury's counters closed several months ago but then our local Sainsburys is one of the worst that I've ever shopped in.
 

yorksrob

Veteran Member
Joined
6 Aug 2009
Messages
38,818
Location
Yorks
They lose too much money. As I understand it Tesco are to keep the pizza and hot food counters as they make money but the delicatessen, meat and fish counters do not

It will be interesting to see what such changes do to market share.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Top