The Great Circular European Railway Challenge

[Mark_Lester]

I love it when a plan comes together.

On a less positive note SNCB don't seem to have an enquiries e-mail and want to charge 30p per minute if you call their Multilingual Contact Centre. I shall keep looking.

it's only for a 2nd quote, i think 35 sods to brussels has to be as good as it gets.
here is aida's german website
http://aida.at/

for budapest we are now looking for some kind of bag drop facility
oooh, check this out, make sure you've got the sound on
http://www.locomotive-hostel-budapest.com/
30 euro sheckles for a double room, between a dozen or more that's got to be cheaper, and on the whole quicker, than using the station left luggage.
anyway, with a name like that it's almost nailed on as a feature.

 

[Glenmutchkin]

for budapest we are now looking for some kind of bag drop facility
oooh, check this out, make sure you've got the sound on
http://www.locomotive-hostel-budapest.com/
30 euro sheckles for a double room, between a dozen or more that's got to be cheaper, and on the whole quicker, than using the station left luggage.
anyway, with a name like that it's almost nailed on as a feature.

Great spot. Love the sound effects. Looking down their home page they even list luggage storage. For 3-4 hours in the afternoon there must be some kind of deal to be done here.

 

[mickpop]

I love it when a plan comes together.

Happy New Year guys!

Ok, I'm still here and following this thread but rapidly getting lost in the minutae [not a suburb of Budapest I think?]. Thinking of buying a set of those reins you attach to babies so you can drag me round and I don't need to bother about the schedule although after what I ate and drank last night I might need a wheelchair or wheelbarrow. Anyway I resolve to try harder in 2012.

 

[Mark_Lester]

Happy New Year guys!

Ok, I'm still here and following this thread but rapidly getting lost in the minutae [not a suburb of Budapest I think?]. Thinking of buying a set of those reins you attach to babies so you can drag me round and I don't need to bother about the schedule although after what I ate and drank last night I might need a wheelchair or wheelbarrow. Anyway I resolve to try harder in 2012.

Happy new year Mick.
Dave's pet name for the project is The Disorient Express, with over 25 destinations to juggle it's very appropriate and I will most probably have that as the t-shirt.
But there's plenty of scope to do your own virtual railroading. This fine detail is going to go on for months. I aim to get the whole plan in place, including provisions, tram numbers, the whole shebang, by mid summer and have an accurate price tag, not that I'm going to be bloody well held to that of course .
I've mailed hostel locomotive, I'm happy to pay the full 30 bucks for the afternoon as long as they dont mind us mullering a room and bathroom and having a whole bunch of us turning up in what is obviously a dinky little establishment. I haven't checked the station but it's got to be at least 3 or 4 euros a bag, and will take us half an hour to get them all back.

 

[Donbacsi]

I was once stuck in Vienna for two weeks. It would seem to me the prime photo op is the Cathedral. Dash off the train and beeline for that Gothic pile for your pics. Then you should have plenty of time and choices to have your breakfast of heavily-breaded, greasy schnitzles, saurkraut and huge tankards of beer before the dash to the next station. As we say in America, "The Breakfast of Champions." Vienna really isn't that difficult...boring, but not difficult. And before anyone dumps on me for putting the knock on Vienna...wait till you get to B-pest. You will kick yourselves for not allocating more than an extra two hours there. Most people would much rather sleep over there than some grotty town in the Balkans.
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Bag storage at Keleti: The last time I used them, it was about 35p per locker. As you leave the platform there will be down stairs right in front of you. Careful on these as they can be slick even in dry weather. Turn left and on your immediate left there will be a wall of lockers. It shouldn't be a problem for everyone to jam all their junk into one of these simultaneously. Likewise for pick up. Ten minutes tops. Better I think than roaming around looking for the hostel. Bear in mind, the language (street signs, etc.) is virtually indecipherable.

 

[Mark_Lester]

35p?, when were you last there. We will have 12+ rucksacks, if you can fit all those into one locker then you could offer them as secure parking space
what about showers ?, is there an easy option to go have a quick shower. That's probably only for me but I do like a rinse when it's available.

I am about to start maneuvering back to good ol' blighty now, but while we've got your attention we should really work out Buda and Pest.
for food to go purposes, we'd ideally like to get all this near the station about 6 o'clock. A supermarket that sells the full range of sausages, especially fire sausage, with a decent selection of alcohol, or with a liqour store near by with a really good selection, would be ideal.
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this looks fun, not far on the other side of the river, there's two lines up to this park.
http://www.subways.net/hungary/budapest/cog/cog.html
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it gets better, line 1 one the metro is a world heritage site.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Line_1_(Budapest_Metro)

ah, found out what the line down fro this furnicular (I'm not even going to attempt to even spell some of this stuff) that wiggles through the park, it's this
http://www.gyermekvasut.hu/english/chrw_home.php
everyone is going to think we've gone bananas, but hang on guys, they have steam services!, runs down the hill at 3pm.

http://www.michaeltaylor.ca/Ind/child-490056-a-mt.shtml
it's got to be done.

 

[Glenmutchkin]

http://www.michaeltaylor.ca/Ind/child-490056-a-mt.shtml

I read the name of this link and thought OMG - where is this going? The eastern bloc used to have a lot of Children's railways but I think that most have gone to Woodhamski's.

Did you spot that Subway Line 1 passes the House of Terror. Probably have to skip this for lack of time though.

Even if lockers at Keleti are cheap I dread to think how much small change we would need immediately on arrival in a non-Euro country.

It's beginning to look like Budapest is going to be one of the highlights of this jaunt.

 

[Mark_Lester]

I'm currently shacked up in the joys of Tune hotels in KLIA LCCT, the funniest thing about this room is the green arrow pointing to mecca, anyone who can work out how to pray in this room deserves eternal redemption.

I'm going to make contact with this toy train when I get back and see if we can org an extra carriage for us all on the 3 o'clock steamer, and anything else special.

I'm hoping this park with the children's railway has got a decent caf' at the top where we can do sausages and steam, and beverages, i'm sure it does. it would mean the less rail mental in the gang can chill out while the boiler brigade do their inspection drill.

I havent looked into what the unesco worthy bit of line 1 is, but there is obviously a station we need to do somewhere.

I think I have another "old man of steam" to accompany you two, he's one of my best buddies common law father in law. I'll confirm in the next few days.
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it's £105 for your own carriage, the idea being that you can have a party in it in a siding fir as long as you want .but that still only works out double the ticket. I mailed them anyway.

 

[Donbacsi]

Probably not a good idea to take the Cog for numerous reasons. How about this?
http://www.tripadvisor.com/Attraction_Review-g274887-d276877-Reviews-Funicular_Siklo-Budapest.html
More to follow.
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WOW! A lot of questions!!!
First, yes, B-pest will be one of the highlights (if not the greatest highlight) of your trip. After eating boiled tree bark and braized pine cones in Norselandia, and greasy sausages with mustard in Teutonland, you will be stunned when you get to B-pest. It is literally where East meets West: the food, the colors, the spices, music, architecture...be prepared to shift gears. This was the most highly prefered post for both the German and Soviet armies. It is the bread basket of Europe...everything grows there in abundance. I spit a plum pit out the door of my kitchen there 3 years ago and it is now a fruit bearing tree.
Food: My understanding was you would have Portmanteu waiting at the platform with cases of Kinley Tonic, Ginger Ale, wine, jams, pickles and all the long-term provisions to see you through. No? If you do the shopping properly you could get enough to carry you through to Milan. The other option is to eat olives and goat cheese from Istambul to Italy. Up to you. There is a Tesco close to Keleti, but that seems a bit of coals to Newcastle for you. I would not pass up the Central market. There is a grocer downstairs where few tourists go. In addition, there is the stinky Hall of Fishes (fresh and smoked, cavier, etc.) and just beyond, the glorious stinky Hall of Pickles. I recommend a stop there to get at least one "Dinnye" (baby watermelon pickle) for each member. This will be the only chance in your life to get a picture of you eating an entire watermelon in one bite! Of course, there is a vast range of other pickles to cart onboard for the trip.

 

[Mark_Lester]

We'll do the market, I just saw a thing on that Hostel Locomotive website that there was something closer but it's two birds with one stone.
My wife is Russian origin FYI, you dont need to sell me on pickles, though I admit none of us had heard about water melon (dont pull a face you two, you're both having one).

Probably not a good idea to take the Cog for numerous reasons

can I have 1.

ideally I'd like to to the siklo just one way, get a tram down the other side.

So something like

Line 1
Siklo
Cog
Childrens

They got back to at the Children's Railway, yes it's about 100 quid. For that we get the heritage carriage on the back of the steam engine. The steam engine runs down the hill at 3pm.
There doesnt seem to be much in the way of eateries up there, which is a shame cos we could have set up camp there. The carriages are available for parties, we could bring some food with us but we're going to be doing a 2 day picnic after this so it would be nice to have some hot food.

oh bugger, wakey wakey Lester, we dont get into Budapest till 2:45, no way can we get to the children's railway in time.
and the steam engine is only weekends.


paying for a private steaming is going to be a lot more than 100 sponds but I'll ask. As it is we are looking at doing the above plan in reverse, get to the bottom of the children's railway for 4pm. do that, then down the cog, and then down the siklo, but that sucks, it's the wrong way round, you want to go up rack railways not down. and we need to be back at the market for 5 anyway, it shuts at 6. I think the castle rack isnt going to make it.

we might be able to rob yet more time from Vienna - Bratislava
hmf, would mean leaving at 7:50. so forget sit down breakfast, we'd have to take it to the train. feasible I guess. gets us to Budapest for 12:35, so plenty of time. Would be better then to find a take away breakfast near Sudbahnhof then else we'll have cold coffee by the time we get on the train.

the above then works, steam and all, but we need to synch for a weekend day in Budapest

i'll go ask what a summer timetable looks like.
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ah, fiddle sticks.
market shuts at 3 on Saturday and is shut on Sunday.

so we cant have our pickled water melons and eat them. we need tue-fri to get the 6pm closing of the hall. (fits great with a 19:10 departure). I've mailed Albert at the Children's railway to ask him f the summer timetable is any longer, and if they do weekday steamers in the summer.
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I answered that myself, they dont have this years sumer timetable but they have last years, and no fancy trains in the week, [sob]
http://www.gyermekvasut.hu/english/timetable.php?2011-07-28

 

[Glenmutchkin]

Good to see that you got back safely. Shame about the children's railway but there are flights from Edinburgh-Budapest so a cultural break might be in order.

If pickled watermelon is anything like pickled lemons count me in.

Have been slightly pre-occupied over the last 24 hours finding somebody to come and replace my ridge tiles. At least mine only moved a bit - my neighbour was woken by the sound of some of his tiles crashing onto the roof of his car.

Did I tell you that there only appears to be a chair car option between Berlin and Warsaw?

 

[Mark_Lester]

Did I tell you that there only appears to be a chair car option between Berlin and Warsaw?

no you didnt. blast.
what about if we book it straight through from earlier ?. I assume the bed doesn't get eaten up like in India. We'll need to crash out, otherwise Warsaw isnt going to be worth the effort.

if we're not going to get steam, and we aint, (and even if we did it wouldnt really be enough for the likes of you and mick, you'd need to come back and do it proper) then we might not even need the reserved carriage, but I'll check what the weekday demand is like.

twas windy when I got here, it was a good job I had the M4 all to myself at 1 in the morning, I was gripping the wheel like rowan arkinson with matchsticks in his eyes.
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this, "can you get into a sleeper carriage at 4 in the morning" is a key. I was assuming we'd have to pay the full whack, but I guess you just arent allowed to come in and wake everyone up at that time.
So if that's the case we're losing Warsaw [more sobbing].
Can someone fill me in on what the rules are on this ?

 

[Glenmutchkin]

There is an option of Copenhagen dep 18.10 Berlin ostbahn Arr 04.34 on train CNL50473 which has couchettes and sleepers. Then get original train at 05.02 to Warsaw from Berlin Ost. Source DB Bahn search Copenhagen-Warsaw.

You won't get much chance to go raving in Berlin with these timings. According to the Berlin thread on this site Berlin Hauptbahnhof is one of the great wonders of the world and we'd miss that as well.

 

[Mark_Lester]

There is an option of Copenhagen dep 18.10 Berlin ostbahn Arr 04.34 on train CNL50473 which has couchettes and sleepers. Then get original train at 05.02 to Warsaw from Berlin Ost. Source DB Bahn search Copenhagen-Warsaw.

You won't get much chance to go raving in Berlin with these timings. According to the Berlin thread on this site Berlin Hauptbahnhof is one of the great wonders of the world and we'd miss that as well.

Don't like that either.
if there's no way, even if we manage to have just the right number of people to have our own sleeper carriage, to get into beds out of Berlin then we're going to have to leave Warsaw for the GCEERC. The Warsaw detour was always slightly mental. I think we're looking at everyone in a dorm (or whatever, I dont mind slicing personal bookings for that, they've got a range of room sizes) and getting either the 10:45, down to Prague, or even the 12:46.
this still leaves us with way to much time on our hands. That prague-vienna sleeper works great, but 9 hours in prague could result in liver failure after a night on the razz in berlin. I wonder if there is something between berlin and prague we could do.

i found this,
http://www.discoverczech.com/jindrichuv-hradec/narrow-gauge-railway.php4
it's great, but is on the czech ausria border area, we want germany/czech area.
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Bingo!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pressnitz_Valley_Railway
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well it would be good, it's exactly where i wanted ti to be, but you dont seem to be able to get there on the train.
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there's this, near dresden
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lössnitzgrundbahn

there's direct trains from berlin to dresden, and then dresden to praha

 

[Glenmutchkin]

D
well it would be good, it's exactly where i wanted ti to be, but you dont seem to be able to get there on the train.

Operates weekend and holidays only so it might get a bit complicated. Looks brilliant though.

If we drop Warsaw we are going to struggle to get the 18,000 km. Plenty of time to snooze between Warsaw and Ostrava.

 

[Mark_Lester]

we will loose loads of time yes, not good. but we've got a fantabulastic list of capital cities so I can bear the loss of mileage.
we'll have to think about it all, but sleeping upright isnt going to work imho, we'll be too shagged to do anything at the stops.

see this dresden find above.

 

[Glenmutchkin]

The seats are recliners Berlin - Warsaw.

Dresden looks pretty good too. We could use a bit of time in Prague - have you ever been to the Black Ox - It's a tram ride up towards the castle but well worth it. Lady G voted it the best pub in Prague 2 years running despite the ladies toilets.

 

[Mark_Lester]

The seats are recliners Berlin - Warsaw.

Dresden looks pretty good too. We could use a bit of time in Prague - have you ever been to the Black Ox - It's a tram ride up towards the castle but well worth it. Lady G voted it the best pub in Prague 2 years running despite the ladies toilets.

the train out of prague is midnight.
I did prague 20 years ago, it's a superb place.

we can get the 10:45 out of berlin, so we can go to bed after 2 and still get plenty of shut eye and a sausage for breakfast.
get to dresden just before 1.
time for another ausage
do the afternoon train to radeburg and back
http://translate.google.co.uk/translate?hl=en&sl=de&tl=en&u=http://www.loessnitzgrundbahn.de/
back in dresden for 5 and ht prague for 7:30 pm.

 

[Glenmutchkin]

OK. One vote here for the Lobnitz Dachshund.
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There is a thread on here about Vienna-Bratislava. It contains this

If you travel to Bratislava from Vienna by train, your ticket allows you free use of public transport within Bratislava on your day of arrival.

 

[Mark_Lester]

OK. One vote here for the Lobnitz Dachshund.

OK, that's a done deal then, none rail nuts can have a few hours off and do Dresden if they want.
Looked up the Black Ox, looks superb. 3 hours in there will do the job. We'll need to know exactly what we are doing as we fall out of the place though.

Ah, Tram 22 is a recommended route anyway. So tram 9 to the natioinal theatre, then a 22.
sun doesnt set till after 9 at that time of year so we'll get a nice view.

We'd need to leave no later than 11, preferably 10:45 to avoid disasters, to retrace out steps, based on this http://www.dpp.cz/en/, which doesnt work unless you've got all the wierd accents, so you'll need to look up stuff on wiki then curt and paste.

For a lot of the places where we need local spondoolies, I am going to at least estimate some costs, hungary for instance I aim to work out exactly what it wil take, and get the stuff out before leaving home.

Obviously working out how much a dozen people are going to spend in 3 hours in a pub in prague is a dark art.

ah, the black ox shuts at 10, that solves that potential cock up then. no way do they take plastic though, and I'm not even sure we should turn up with half a tonne of rucksack either. In view of the "dont **** off the locals" comments in the pub guides, perhaps we should predetermine how much of the glorious velkopopicky we should all allow ourselves and hence the budget,
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oh just seen the Bratislava free travel, great.saves time and money, presumably we just blag it with the passes.

 

[Glenmutchkin]

I'm not sure if the Black Ox does grub in the evening. At lunchtime it does wonderful sausages with pickled cucumber and mustard. There are some great views over the city from nearby.
I had assumed that we would need to store bags at Hlavni nadrazi in Prague wherever we decided to go for vittles.
The Prague tram system is brilliant. We will need to work out whether individual trip tickets or 1 day passes will be better for us.

Actually there is a funicular up to a big park within walking distance of the Ox but I guess that it is likely to be busy in summer. It was snowing when we went on it and it was pretty quiet.

Forget what I said about Bratislava public transport. We will be on the passes when we get there.

 

[Mark_Lester]

just looking closer at this and the prague arrival and options for our new germanic feature in dresden at this lobnitzgrundbahn with their 3 steam engines.

would you two prefer to have more time to look at the steam enguns at the yard, or go all the way on this railway ?, half the trains stop half way at moritzburg. We could get the 08:45 out of Berlin, so should probably hit the sack no later than 2am in Berlin. which can get you to radabuel Ost as early as 11:30. we can then do the 12:56 steam train, but it only goes half way, and back for 14:00. actually you've then another 45 minutes at the bottom to look at th'engines again, so you've time to see a little of dresden on arrival, then get into prague at half past 5. giving us plenty of time to deposit the bags, the classy authentic pubs shut at 10, so take an hour getting back to the station then get the bags back, and I'm sure we'll be able to have another swifty at central station before getting on the vienna train,
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I've changed the route, can you give me our new depleted berlin-desden-prague kilometerage. I know this is a humongous hit to both distance and speed, but I just dont think that day would have been feasible unless we could just crash straight out on that sleeper, and the pay backs are 3 fold. It's still an 8:45 dep from Berlin, after a near midnight arrival the night before and then some intoxicating behaviour, then what looks like a stonking steam day aand then prague, we're hardly lounging about.

we're now into Prague at 5:30 pm. We're only going half way up the Drseden narrow gauge, but we've 3 1/2 hours in Dresden from arrival to final departure, so folks can do something else if they fancy. infact I wil probably hang about in Dresden on arrival for an hour, but if you could go straight to the whats-it-bahn. we get an oblig 45 minutes there at Radebeul Ost as well after the run, so it should be feasible to do a short sharp tram ride to the old quarter on impact at Dtesden, and still do the steam.

we're up to 47 trains now, including these 3 attractions in Budapest. Don, what's wrong with this Cog. I know the Children's railway has seen better days, but we're a bit railway loopy you see. The fact that it's threatened with closure is all the more reason for going to see it and these kids in their Thunderbirds outfits.

I'm going to detail any trams we are doing that are in themselves tourist attractions, e.g. route 22 I think it is, up the hill in Prague, Same in Lisbon, there's the classic sight seeing tram, but also at least 2 funiculars that we'll nail down as official parts of the route.

and yes, I'm awfully jet lagged.

 

[Glenmutchkin]

Dresden sounds good to me as long as it isn't going to drive the rest of the team bonkers. Not sure where Mick has got to or what his view is.

For Prague as long as the weather is good I would suggest that we do tram/funicular/walk/Black Ox/tram 22 back into town. Need to fit a meal in here somehow. I've got a photo of the funicular somewhere which I will send you.
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According to IDOS Berlin -Dresden is 192km. Dresden - Prague is 193 km. This doesn't include any Dachshund mileage. I'll check against Thomas Cook when I found out where Lady G has tidied it to.

 

[Mark_Lester]

Dresden sounds good to me as long as it isn't going to drive the rest of the team bonkers. Not sure where Mick has got to or what his view is.

For Prague as long as the weather is good I would suggest that we do tram/funicular/walk/Black Ox/tram 22 back into town. Need to fit a meal in here somehow. I've got a photo of the funicular somewhere which I will send you.
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According to IDOS Berlin -Dresden is 192km. Dresden - Prague is 193 km. This doesn't include any Dachshund mileage. I'll check against Thomas Cook when I found out where Lady G has tidied it to.

the only issue on what we do up and down to Strahov is the daylight, it will be daytime when we get to the Black Ox and dark when we leave.
I guess the rack should be done uphill anyway, so I make that

Ditch bags

Walk to I.P. Pavlova

Tram 22 to the bottom of the funicular

Lanovka (which I think is just czech for funicular)
walk across the park

there's a number of eateries marked on Pohorelec, also other pubs if the black ox, which gets #1 rating on every drinnking guide I've found, is already stuffed (we should aim for not a weekend) Ceherno vola shuts at 10

tram 18 down to Staromestka

obligatory photo shoot of the astronomical clock, hopefully that tower is lit up enough

then tube or walk back to station

--------------------------------

I'm looking at a 30 minute tram ride round Dresden.
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http://www.private-prague-guide.com/frequently-asked-questions/luggage-storage-and-lockers-prague/

Luggage lockers are available in all of Prague’s train stations, but they’re not secure and should be avoided.

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if the black ox is just too packed then it's not been a waste of effort, we'd want to go up to Strahov anyway, but I would like a plan B where we can get the Velkopovicky.
Indeed if the pubs back in town open later and serve grub we could abort the black ox at 9ish and have a second session nearer the station and get the twilight as we go back down the hill.
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this place, virtually in the station, wants just over £25 for a room
http://vesta.prague-hostels.cz/
so we can just do that.

 

[Glenmutchkin]

Indeed if the pubs back in town open later and serve grub we could abort the black ox at 9ish and have a second session nearer the station and get the twilight as we go back down the hill.

Sounds about right. Solves the daylight thing. I hadn't spotted that we were now getting into Praha that early. We need to do something to occupy time besides drink or we will be comatose. Did you see the pic of the Astrological clock in Prague complete with skeletons and stuff. To get the full effect you need to be there on the hour. Might be a bit difficult to schedule.

We probably will want 24 hour passes for travel in Prague. Just over £4 each.

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this place, virtually in the station, wants just over £25 for a room
http://vesta.prague-hostels.cz/
so we can just do that.

Sounds good.

 

[Mark_Lester]

Sounds about right. Solves the daylight thing. I hadn't spotted that we were now getting into Praha that early. We need to do something to occupy time besides drink or we will be comatose. Did you see the pic of the Astrological clock in Prague complete with skeletons and stuff. To get the full effect you need to be there on the hour. Might be a bit difficult to schedule.

We probably will want 24 hour passes for travel in Prague. Just over £4 each.


Sounds good.

yes thanks, I know the clock, I would go back regularly to watch it.
I think the time will fly by.
The pass will be well worth it for convenience alone.

this place is 150m from the black ox
http://www.klasternirestaurace.cz/meal-selection.html
it's vast, but if we've got a squeaky clean plan we could even book I guess. Anyway, about 7 quid for a plate of sommat and an urquell.

we can then hit the Ox, have one or two there, then get the #18 down the hill, timing it for 9 O'clock, then go to the as yet to be determined plan B establishment for a further beverage, get the bags (we'll probably be incontinent by then) and to the platform for 11:30 which I guess is when we'll be able to board.

and yes Mike, we're both quite mad, but it's such fun!.
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with the time we have in Dresden on impact, we can get, for 2 euros, a 3 or a 7 up to carolplatz just on other side of the Elbe. (8 mins, one of them every 5) Then an 8 the short distance back to Theaterplatz via the Augusterbrucker bridge.(4 mins, every 10) Walk through the old city (about 5 or 600 m) via the Frauenkirche (20 mins) and then get the 3 or 7 back (5 mins every 5).
I estimate 35 to 60 mins max. We've got 75 to play with. If things were slipping already by the time we got the #8 at carolplatz you just stay on the #8 tram back to the station and you just lose the walk through of the old city and miss the Frauenkirche (you may be able to glmpse it actually) but you get the theater and palace.

 

[Glenmutchkin]

That pub guide site is amazing

Did you spot this one for Stockholm - are we going to be anywhere near it? The smilies here are a bit disappointing. IM does a beer tankard. :Beer

http://www.europeanbeerguide.net/stckpubs.htm#akkurat

At the risk of starting a controversy the best tram back into town from the Ox is 22 or 23 change at Malostranski onto the metro or tram 18 over/under the river then hoof it to Old Town Square for the clock.

 

[Mark_Lester]

That pub guide site is amazing

Did you spot this one for Stockholm - are we going to be anywhere near it? The smilies here are a bit disappointing. IM does a beer tankard.

http://www.europeanbeerguide.net/stckpubs.htm#akkurat

At the risk of starting a controversy the best tram back into town from the Ox is 22 or 23 change at Malostranski onto the metro or tram 18 over/under the river then hoof it to Old Town Square for the clock.

ok, if the 22 is the one to get down the hill, i just noted that it's the 18 to cross the river.

as it happens, yes we are due on the sketch we've got so far for stockholm to go very near to this pub, as it's where this is
http://www.urbandeli.org/hem/
which is who I am planning to get to make up a picnic with a few of these in it
https://www.google.com/search?q=smo...C&biw=1680&bih=843&sei=VbwFT43kL9DJ8gP8nOD4Bg

but of course it will be breakfast time. and in any case, judging by the trouble I'm having in liquidating property in Oldham we'd have to double the trip budget for 10 minutes in there.

 

[Donbacsi]

My faithful companion, Scooter, the gourmet wonderhound, votes for the Dachshund!

 

[Glenmutchkin]

ok, if the 22 is the one to get down the hill, i just noted that it's the 18 to cross the river.

We could stay on the 22/23 a bit further then walk into the city across the Charles Bridge - another cultural icon in the bag.

as it happens, yes we are due on the sketch we've got so far for stockholm to go very near to this pub, but of course it will be breakfast time.

I'm getting confused already. I had the Copenhagen times fixed in my mind.

I looked at the guy's beer guide for Brussels but basically he says he has passed because so many others have already done one. We don't really have time to go searching for geuze bars down dodgy looking alleys anyway.
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My faithful companion, Scooter, the gourmet wonderhound, votes for the Dachshund!

Don, Perhaps Scooter might like to audition for the role of GCERC Official Mascot.