The rapid rise of fare dodging in Switzerland

[Bletchleyite]

Well seeing as I had one guard refuse to read my coupon, and just say "no" when I asked him to, I'll take my experience over this essay, it feels every month I go, the staff get worse

Refuse to read what coupon and in what context?

 

[bahnause]

SBB is simple. The ticketing is simple, with no confusion over routeing (it's printed on the ticket), and the rule is that you must have one before you set foot on the train regardless of what sale options are available (so it's prudent to carry both cash and card as there are at least in theory no exceptions at all in "eye" self-check areas - basically if the TVM is broken the station is closed unless you buy on your phone or already have a ticket).

The purchase process must be completed before the train departs. Whether this is done on or outside the train is not relevant. In case of a broken TVM: Just Call the number printed on every machine.

 

[nwales58]

The mods are free to split the thread if they wish, but it is wrong to let false information go unchallenged.

I’ve corrected my diabetes-addled-brain wrong post.

Mods: feel free to delete my tangential post.

 

[Bikeman78]

In any country you get more crime in larger towns/cities than in rural areas. You can leave your front door unlocked in a typical rural Scottish village, you couldn't in Glasgow, say (no bias against Glasgow there, just picked two Scottish places).

Even in cities, the risk is fairly low. I have left my house unlocked a few times. I once left my car unlocked for a week whilst I was away. Nothing happened. It was still there when I got back.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Even in cities, the risk is fairly low. I have left my house unlocked a few times. I once left my car unlocked for a week whilst I was away. Nothing happened. It was still there when I got back.

I've done both of those things in the UK (unintentionally) and was lucky. I'd agree in CH that's more likely though!

 

[alex17595]

Refuse to read what coupon and in what context?

Probably a FIP coupon?

I came back a couple of weeks ago from Switzerland and my coupon was only questioned once because for each dated box you get 48 hours.
I just pointed to the text on the front which explains it and it was accepted.

I also used my FIP card with the half fare discount once and had no issues with that.

 

[Krokodil]

Probably a FIP coupon?

I came back a couple of weeks ago from Switzerland and my coupon was only questioned once because for each dated box you get 48 hours.
I just pointed to the text on the front which explains it and it was accepted.

The other way around, I had to put straight a TIL RPI who made a Swiss visitor date another box. Having "Valid on the entered day and on the next" printed in four languages didn’t seem to compute.

 

[MatthewHutton]

I'm sure I'm not the only forum member to have seen plenty of people brazenly barge through LU ticket gates, knowingly in full view of LU staff, who they no doubt know are told not to intervene.

Probably some people did have a valid ticket and lost it.

Japanese gates are normally defaulted to open and close if your ticket isn't valid or you don't insert one. I once did push through one - the way we were using the system we were buying the cheapest ticket and using the "adjust" machine (basically an excess) to pay up to the correct fare before exiting - this is a bit simpler than trying to understand the fares and is generally how tourists were traditionally advised to do it.

However what we had done was gone in and ridden round a loop, exiting at the same station, something it couldn't cope with and it wouldn't take the excess fare. With no staff visible there was no option but to push through as the machine wouldn't take any extra fare - I did think someone would come out of a door somewhere and stop me, but nobody was there and nothing happened aside from a loud alarm that we presumed was intended to embarrass any evader into not doing it, a bit like how a burglar alarm works.

We had every intention of paying (and thought it would just excess up to the maximum from that station) but it just wasn't a scenario the system had been designed for. (Oyster by contrast does charge a fare and let you out if you do a same station exit e.g. if you go all the way round the Circle Line, I seem to recall it's different depending on how long you leave it).

I thought historically before the cost went up hugely you would buy the rail pass for Japan.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I thought historically before the cost went up hugely you would buy the rail pass for Japan.

Not for local journeys around Tokyo.

 

[peteb]

The great thing about the Netherlands style touch in, touch out system, is that provided your bank card works then it acts as your ticket when checked. I can't see why that system can't be used in Switzerland, as it's a relatively small country. However I guess the ability to check tickets on board a train requires a good mobile internet connection (perhaps difficult in mountainous terrain, not a problem in NL!) and maybe the number of tunnels in Switzerland would also be a problem.

There must be very few people who don't have a bank card these days.

 

[MatthewHutton]

The great thing about the Netherlands style touch in, touch out system, is that provided your bank card works then it acts as your ticket when checked. I can't see why that system can't be used in Switzerland, as it's a relatively small country. However I guess the ability to check tickets on board a train requires a good mobile internet connection (perhaps difficult in mountainous terrain, not a problem in NL!) and maybe the number of tunnels in Switzerland would also be a problem.

There must be very few people who don't have a bank card these days.

The swiss have pretty good phone signal on their railways in general. In the tunnels they have 4G (and presumably 5G) throughout that is good enough to do a group video call.

 

[kacper]

The great thing about the Netherlands style touch in, touch out system, is that provided your bank card works then it acts as your ticket when checked. I can't see why that system can't be used in Switzerland, as it's a relatively small country. However I guess the ability to check tickets on board a train requires a good mobile internet connection (perhaps difficult in mountainous terrain, not a problem in NL!) and maybe the number of tunnels in Switzerland would also be a problem.

There must be very few people who don't have a bank card these days.

Upon inspection the card details can be stored, and checked at a later date if not able to be validated. Many networks do this, and if your card is found to not have been tapped you get charged. (TfL charges you a max fare, Manchester tram charges you £50 I believe - according totheir website)

 

[Taunton]

The article explains there is a cultural difference, although does not explain why fare dodging is getting higher. Switzerland has been next to Germany and France for a very long time and there have been cultural differences for a very long time!

I discussed this with a Swiss a while ago, along with tickets checked every train, and indeed trams as well, and their response to me was that almost all Swiss are scrupulously honest, but few have low level jobs, hence a large number of "Gastarbeiter" (I actually thought that expression was from the past). They pointed out which country is immediately to the south of Switzerland ...

 

[Austriantrain]

The article explains there is a cultural difference, although does not explain why fare dodging is getting higher. Switzerland has been next to Germany and France for a very long time and there have been cultural differences for a very long time!

I would think that being geographically close to Germany is not a factor: German-speaking Switzerland is culturally very different and separated from its German-speaking Neighbours, as every German or Austrian moving to Switzerland will soon find out, and not only because they won‘t understand a word.

The same cultural distance does not exist in French-speaking Switzerland towards France - while they are very proud of being Swiss and not French, I suppose change social behaviours cross over much more quickly.

 

[rg177]

German-speaking Switzerland is culturally very different and separated from its German-speaking Neighbours, as every German or Austrian moving to Switzerland will soon find out, and not only because they won‘t understand a word.

Indeed, a friend of mine from Hamburg (though has lived in Yorkshire for the best part of eight years) said he just ended up speaking English and playing hapless tourist when in Zürich. He's a native German but said the dialect and general behaviour of some was completely foreign to him.

 

[rvdborgt]

Indeed, a friend of mine from Hamburg (though has lived in Yorkshire for the best part of eight years) said he just ended up speaking English and playing hapless tourist when in Zürich. He's a native German but said the dialect and general behaviour of some was completely foreign to him.

I've never needed to use English in Switzerland. Most Swiss north of the Röstigraben can speak understandable German (with an accent but that's no problem).

 

[DanielB]

I've never needed to use English in Switzerland. Most Swiss north of the Röstigraben can speak understandable German (with an accent but that's no problem).

Exactly the same observation for me. And they will certainly understand German.
Only used English in the Italian speaking cantons as I don't speak Italian, for the French part my limited understanding of French was usually sufficient.

 

[DeverseSam]

Indeed, a friend of mine from Hamburg (though has lived in Yorkshire for the best part of eight years) said he just ended up speaking English and playing hapless tourist when in Zürich. He's a native German but said the dialect and general behaviour of some was completely foreign to him.

Given that the “highest” German is in Hannover which is not far from Hamburg, surely they would be able to understand him perfectly though!

 

[800001]

Well seeing as I had one guard refuse to read my coupon, and just say "no" when I asked him to, I'll take my experience over this essay, it feels every month I go, the staff get worse

Done Switzerland, many times over the last 2-3 years. Maybe on about 30-40 SBB trains, and only had one rather nasty ticket examiner due to me not being able to find my City pass.

I’ve found all other on board staff to be friendly and helpful, as are the station and ticket office staff.

 

[Austriantrain]

Given that the “highest” German is in Hannover which is not far from Hamburg, surely they would be able to understand him perfectly though!

Of course the Swiss understand other German speakers. And if they are of a mind, they will be understandable too. It‘s just that when they speak among themselves, we won‘t understand anything (it basically is a different Language, just not a written one). And I suspect they like it that way.

 

[rvdborgt]

Given that the “highest” German is in Hannover

Technically speaking, the highest German is somewhere in the south of the German-speaking area. Possibly Wallis or the few Italian communities south of Zermatt...