Ticket types likely to die off soon

TheSel

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More people might buy Rovers or Rangers if they knew such things existed. They receive very little publicity / advertising, even at stations -- maybe a leaflet in a rack on a few of the larger stations - if you are lucky.
And all-line rovers were greatly devalued when peak hour restrictions were imposed.
Absolutely agree. One that sees virtually NO publicity is the 'Northern Explorer 55 West Day Ranger' which isn't even listed on Northern's own 'Rangers and Rovers' page - but if you know it exists, you can find it detailed here
 
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JonathanH

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More people might buy Rovers or Rangers if they knew such things existed. They receive very little publicity / advertising, even at stations -- maybe a leaflet in a rack on a few of the larger stations - if you are lucky.
And all-line rovers were greatly devalued when peak hour restrictions were imposed.
Again they go in the 'things only people who understand rail fares' bracket which annoys 'normal' (especially peak time) travellers.
 

317 forever

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Absolutely agree. One that sees virtually NO publicity is the 'Northern Explorer 55 West Day Ranger' which isn't even listed on Northern's own 'Rangers and Rovers' page - but if you know it exists, you can find the it detailed here
Thank you for mentioning this. It is certainly cheaper for over 55s than a Lancashire Day Ranger for example.
 

Ianno87

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Again they go in the 'things only people who understand rail fares' bracket which annoys 'normal' (especially peak time) travellers.
And even if there was more publicity and an increase in sales, they will still remain a marginal, niche source of revenue.
 

Mcr Warrior

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Thank you for mentioning this. It is certainly cheaper for over 55s than a Lancashire Day Ranger for example.
Not much in it after applying Railcard discount, and of course the Lancashire Day Ranger product is available from 0845, rather than 0930, and is valid on other TOCs, not just Northern.
 

Ianigsy

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I think some day rangers will eventually end up as a fare cap rather than an actual ticket, particularly in ex- PTE areas where it's easier to set maximum fares
 

Hadders

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Instead of saying that Rovers and Ranger tickets should be withdrawn because they're a niche product that only enthusiasts understand why not promote them so that nore people become aware of them.
 

Ianno87

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Instead of saying that Rovers and Ranger tickets should be withdrawn because they're a niche product that only enthusiasts understand why not promote them so that nore people become aware of them.
I haven't said they *should* be withdrawn. I said that there is a likelihood they *may* be withdrawn, as they are seldom if ever particularly "core" products for any operator. Even giving them some marketing won't fundamntally change this, as they are irrelevant tickets for 99% of passengers which just want singles and returns.
 

Llandudno

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Absolutely agree. One that sees virtually NO publicity is the 'Northern Explorer 55 West Day Ranger' which isn't even listed on Northern's own 'Rangers and Rovers' page - but if you know it exists, you can find the it detailed here
There is also the little known North Wales Day Rover ticket valid on virtually all buses and trains in North and parts of mid Wales. This ticket is broken down into different travel zones and includes travel by rail to
Bidston, Chester and via Shrewsbury to the Cambrian Coast

Needless to say, you can’t buy them from unstaffed stations or at TVMs, but train guards and bus drivers can, if they know how to, issue them!

Most bus drivers look at you aghast when you show them your TfW Bog roll ticket though!
 

py_megapixel

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I haven't said they *should* be withdrawn. I said that there is a likelihood they *may* be withdrawn, as they are seldom if ever particularly "core" products for any operator. Even giving them some marketing won't fundamntally change this, as they are irrelevant tickets for 99% of passengers which just want singles and returns.
Indeed. For example, someone who lives in Slough and commutes to London could buy a Thames Branches Ranger, but they wouldn't do this even if they knew that they could because they most likely only want to do one round trip between Slough and Paddington. No amount of marketing will change that.

Rangers and rovers are designed for several trips in a short time in the same area, which is quite an uncommon scenario outside the enthusiast community.
 

JBuchananGB

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Absolutely agree. One that sees virtually NO publicity is the 'Northern Explorer 55 West Day Ranger' which isn't even listed on Northern's own 'Rangers and Rovers' page - but if you know it exists, you can find the it detailed here
Now I know it exists, I might find a use for it. My wife doesn’t travel enough to justify a Senior Railcard, so there may be trips from Southport where that over 55 Ranger will be useful. Always assuming the Merseyrail shop can figure out how to sell it!
 
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More people might buy Rovers or Rangers if they knew such things existed. They receive very little publicity / advertising, even at stations -- maybe a leaflet in a rack on a few of the larger stations - if you are lucky.
And all-line rovers were greatly devalued when peak hour restrictions were imposed.
Correct.

I only found out about the West Midlands Day Ranger on board a service one Sunday morning from a friend who was happening to be working Guard duties on the service I was from - as I was going from Worcester - Crewe he mentioned that this ticket type existed and I could use it to stop off en route on my return home via Wolverhampton and Birmingham to avail of a couple of decent pubs as well as saving a hefty chunk of change in the process.

I now use the Day Tripper on Sundays when I’m travelling out from Sandwell to places like Coventry etc where I also need to get a bus somewhere after alighting the rail service. As it works out that I get the rail portion for unlimited travel for around £2 on top of the normal cost of the NX Bus Day Ticket as opposed to the £9-odd it would cost if I purchased the rail fare separately to the bus.
 

Class442Fan

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If I was to hazard a guess/what I would like to see I think this may have the way for the end of 'returns' and a move to single leg pricing like PAYG, and (this is more what I would like to see rather than predict) Railcards - especially digital ones - moving to a subscription service, like Amazon Prime. Can you imagine, pay £7.99 a month and get 34% discount. Not travelling? Unsubscribe.
 

Jozhua

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Definitely agree rover's and rangers may dissappear, especially if current circumstances hold up.

Generally capacity in the network is pretty constrained, apocalypse or not and the aim is probably moving people from other modes, not necessarily inducing more journeys for the sake of it!
 

TheSel

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Now I know it exists, I might find a use for it. My wife doesn’t travel enough to justify a Senior Railcard, so there may be trips from Southport where that over 55 Ranger will be useful. Always assuming the Merseyrail shop can figure out how to sell it!
I can tell you from experience the vast majority of the staff in the Southport 'M To Go' (i.e. ticket office) do indeed know about this ticket - although I make sure I have a printed copy of the relevant page from the GB Rail Rover Guide, quoting the details below, just in case.

Name: Northern Explorer 55 West
Code: NSW
Group: I526 Northern Ex 55 W
 

Adam0984

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What ticket types are likely to cease to exist over the next few years?

I do wonder if OLR Northern might abolish the Duo fares that Arriva introduced. Also I wonder about the future of PlusBus given the amount that it relies on cooperation of bus companies.

I also think that credit-card sized tickets are likely to go very soon, given that there seems to be an enormous push towards electronic tickets.

Any other thoughts?
Just to add to the original post the Duos were first introduced by First North Western and slowly crept to other west routes and across the pennines
 

cactustwirly

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Paper travelcards (inboundary at least) can’t be with us much longer. Even the outboundary version has been rendered somewhat redundant of late. For all but the most extreme all day bashing that covers all six zones PAYG is always better value.
I don't see how an outboundary travelcard has been made redundant, especially as it is still much cheaper then buying a separate return + PAYG, especially if you have a railcard.
 

miami

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Railcards - especially digital ones - moving to a subscription service, like Amazon Prime. Can you imagine, pay £7.99 a month and get 34% discount. Not travelling? Unsubscribe.
They are already, just an annual subscription (like Amazon Prime) rather than monthly.

Still the fact 30-65 year olds generally can't benefit
 

JonathanH

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30-60. senior railcard at 60
I suspect the reason that hasn't changed with the increase in State Pension Age because bus pass qualification remains 60 in London, Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland but otherwise it is a bit of an anomaly as 'Bletchleyite' noted above, particularly given validity at peak time outside the South East.
 

HORNIMANS

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With regards to rovers and rangers like day returns ar leisure tickets for famiilies and anyone who likes travelling by train. IF the they get rid of them then they should get rid of season tickets as well.
With the Anglia rangers problem it was the case that the fares were the same for several years so had a bit of catch up.
 

Ianno87

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With regards to rovers and rangers like day returns ar leisure tickets for famiilies and anyone who likes travelling by train. IF the they get rid of them then they should get rid of season tickets as well.
On what logic? The proportion of journeys made by season ticket is magnitudes higher than journeys made on rovers/rangers.

*However* in the world of post-Covid part-time commuting, some form of "Pay as you go" commuting may be more appropriate.
 

paul1609

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It would be really interesting to know whether more travelcards from Reading or Northampton are bought with or without a Network Railcard by people in the relevant bracket. I suspect more are bought without.

That would put Network Railcard in the 'things only people who understand rail fares' bracket that upsets the normal passenger who thinks their train fare is too high.
From the Kent Coast or Marshlink where the undiscounted off peak travel card is pushing £ 50 I'd say its quite a high percentage. Its especially popular amongst regular leisure travellers football music theatre etc.
I think the danger of withdrawal would be people changing mode and taking the easy drive via the M2./M20 to North Greenwich which has ample parking for the tube.
 

Bletchleyite

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On what logic? The proportion of journeys made by season ticket is magnitudes higher than journeys made on rovers/rangers.

*However* in the world of post-Covid part-time commuting, some form of "Pay as you go" commuting may be more appropriate.
The TfL model (or some variant of it) would apply itself perfectly to just about all city commuting, London or otherwise. If you didn't want to use a card, you could perhaps be able to purchase an e-ticket priced in the same way.
 

Ianno87

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The TfL model (or some variant of it) would apply itself perfectly to just about all city commuting, London or otherwise. If you didn't want to use a card, you could perhaps be able to purchase an e-ticket priced in the same way.
In London it's surprising how often a season ticket does *not* make sense for commuters simply doing one journey each way for 5 days a week.
 

LNW-GW Joint

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Not much in it after applying Railcard discount, and of course the Lancashire Day Ranger product is available from 0845, rather than 0930, and is valid on other TOCs, not just Northern.
This ticket also carefully lops off Hebden Bridge from the Lancs Day Ranger map, which takes away the option of using the fast Blackpool-York and Leeds-Manchester services for a Liverpool-Preston-Hebden Bridge-Manchester-Liverpool circuit which is one of my preferred trips on an LDR (often all on Northern services).
But it does usefully combine the Lancs and Cheshire options.
 

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