Trams Connected with NR

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Simming

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Are any of the Tramways in this country connected to NR metels? I Think Manchesters and NET are, although that might just be a mistake in the Quail Map.
 
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Lewisham2221

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I can't be certain but I believe NET runs on it's own rails that for a section of the route are right next to NR tracks.

With relation to Manchester Metrolink, again there are several places where Metrolink runs on it's own tracks next to NR tracks, although I think there may be sections where the tram runs on NR tracks.
 

Guinness

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The Metrolink or any Light Rail System is permitted to run on NR tracks. If there was an accident the tram would be history. Plus its illegal.

There allowed small branch lines of NR.
 

Simming

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like a connection of some sort, between the trams lines, and NR metels, Like what they have on the LUL in some places
 

jd

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Simming said:
I was on about tramways connected to NR, not running on NR ;)
Surely if it joins onto NR at some point then that is a connection? ;)


Does anyone know if the Midland Metro connects to NR anywhere? It runs parallel from Snow Hill > The Hawthorns...
 

Lewisham2221

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Aah right, I understand now.

NET has a connection with Nottingham Station at it's Station Street Terminus. I seem to remember it also has a connection or two during the section where it runs paralell to NR, can anybody confirm?

Metrolink certainly connects with NR at Piccadilly and Victoria in the City Centre and also in a few other places IIRC.

jdan - There is a connection with NR at Jewellery Quarter.
 

Nick

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Marv said:
NET has a connection with Nottingham Station at it's Station Street Terminus. I seem to remember it also has a connection or two during the section where it runs paralell to NR, can anybody confirm?
Station Street, Bulwell and Hucknall.

Afaik, All Light Rail systems....minus Blackpool connect with NR.
 

joy54.gen

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I think he means track connections? If so I know the Metrolink has connections, there was a topic on uk.railway recently
 

Craig

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Although it's not a tram, the Tyne and Wear Metro is connected to NR at Pelaw. Metros run on NR track between Pelaw and South Hylton. There are also plans to replace the current two single tracks (one NR, one Metro) between Pelaw and Jarrow with double track although it's not clear who would control it. Also the Metro used to be connected to the mainline at Benton, British Rail used to run trains over the Metro tracks to Fawdon and Callerton.
 

clagmonster

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The Manchester Metrolink has a connection with BR at Victoria, although it is unelectrified. It also has a connection to the ELR to the south of Bury, through which you could get to BR at Castleton. There is parralal running at Altringham, althiough I'm not sure whether there is a physical connection.
 

tramboy

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No, NET is not connected to NR at all...it shares alignment with NR from Wilkinson Street (where the depot is) to Hucknall...Bulwell has one NR platform and a NET island...seperated by a fence!

Cheers

Dave
 

bunnahabhain

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No Tram systems are connected to National Rail at all, the only one I can think of where there may be a possible connection is Snow Hill on the Midland Metro, I cant remember if I saw a connection there or not.
 

Met Driver

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Jamie C. Steel said:
No Tram systems are connected to National Rail at all, the only one I can think of where there may be a possible connection is Snow Hill on the Midland Metro, I cant remember if I saw a connection there or not.
Nope, there's no physical connection at Snow Hill.
 

Nick

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Jamie C. Steel said:
No Tram systems are connected to National Rail at all, the only one I can think of where there may be a possible connection is Snow Hill on the Midland Metro, I cant remember if I saw a connection there or not.
Almost right.

I've done my research, as promised. No UK Tram/Light Rail system apart from the Newcastle based Tyne and Wear System (connection with NR at Pelaw - Metro then continues on NR tracks to South Hylton).

Manchester Metrolink also is the exceptition for it does have in two NR conenctions! Firstly on the Bury line after Manchester Victoria and secondly just before Altrincham Station. Both are single track.

Nick.
 

47205

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Hi,

The link behind Baron Street at Bury has been remover because of Loading Gauge Problems, Heywood is now used :)
 

NumptyDriver

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manchester metrolink has connections at victoria east junction (this can only be used under possession arrangements, the points are clipped, scotched and padlocked in the normal position), and also at altrincham. I've no idea when either were last used.

Metrolink does run on network rail infrastructure between deansgate junction and altrincham, under network rail signalling by deansgate junction 'box (they don't seem too hot at stopping at red 'uns though - the spad figures for the metrolink line are pretty alarming considering how few signals there are on that small stretch) although the trams and trains do not mix - they each have their own line. The metrolink (former 'down') line is worked as a single line in itself, next to the former 'up' line which is another single line used for heavy rail.
 

ChrisCooper

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Quail does show a crossover from the Robin Hood line to NET at Bullwell South Junction, where both become single track. I've done NET a few times, and used Bullwell stop, but I can't confirm or deny the existance of the crossover. The same book also shows a crossover from NR to Mancester Metrolink between Altrincham and Navigation Road. Altrincham is the only bit of Metrolink I havn't done, so again I can't comment on if its correct. No link is shown between NR and Midland Metro. Crossovers from Tram systems to NR are feasable though, since they would allow easy stock transfer (not trams, but maintenace stock etc). Mixed running is possible aswell, in the same way mixed running occurs between LU or Newcastle Metro and NR, although some form of SPAD prevention would have to be fitted to the trams, and the speeds of NR trains would have to be low enough for all SPADs to be stopped within the overlap by TPWS, with of cource all signals being fitted with TPWS (the tram SPAD prevention system would probably only have to be fitted where head on collisions were likely, as the powerful brakes on trams would make rear end collisions very unlikely (and no worse than a rear end collision with another tram or a large road vehicle if one did happen). TPWS could be used though for trams aswell.
 

tramboy

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There is no connection to NR from NET, the tram line simply shares the alignment from Wilkinson Street to Hucknall.

Crossovers are possible, but will never be common in the UK, one because we have incredibly preventative H+S laws, and two because the government will not put money into Light Rail. Mixed running between trams and trains will also not really occur, as once again H+S leads to laws which says that light rail cannot mix due to the difference in weights and impact forces.

However, even though we're being left years behind, the continent does do both, I give you crossovers which are in service in Nantes, as well as complete shared running of LRVs and heavy rail in Karlsruhe, on the S-Bahn system there, which runs on street through the city before branching out to run on the railway lines to places upto 50km away.

Regards

Dave
 

ChrisCooper

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Thanks for confirming the lack of NET connection. I was sure their wasn't one, but was going on what Quail said. Unless anyone comes up with hard evidance for a crossover, we'll have to assume Quail got it wrong (It wouldn't be the only thing).
Mixed running between light and heavy rail is possible as long as their are safeguards to prevent trains hitting each other, basically TPWS for NR and something similar for the light rail system, with speeds for both being low enough so that any SPAD will be stopped in the overlap. This is what is in place on the shared sections between Newcastle Metro and NR and most LUL and NR shared running (although LU is technically heavy rail, a mainline train hitting a tube train isn't going to leave much left of the tube train). The only risk of a collision is then from derailments, but you've got the same risk where parallel running occurs. You are right though that it is unlikely, if only due to the fact that the future of light rail systems is uncertain.
 

Dereklouw

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Manchester Metrolink uses old BR track formation from a point between Cornbrook and Trafford Bar to Altrincham. ("Old" is the word for some of it - bullhead 60' jointed rail which has an interesting effect on the trams running at 50 mph). The NR line from Stockport to Chester joins at Deansgate Junction, south of Timperley, north of Navigation Road. The line through Navigation Road is twin track, Metrolink using one single line, NR the other.

The NR and Metrolink track single just north of Navigation Road, and both then double just south of Navigation Road. There are two level crossings, north and south of Navigation Road. NR Deansgate Junction box controls the two single track sections and the level crossings. The box presumably controls the Metrolink double track into Altrincham.

The trams and NR trains do not use the same track.

There is a double track crossover between the NR tracks and Metrolink a few yards north of Altrincham. The crossover is convential NR rail, without the height extensions on the check rails required for tram use, and is not, in any event, electrified.

The crossover is there to enable PW trains to move from NR to Metrolink should PW work be required on the old BR section to Trafford Bar. It does not look like it has been used for a while.

Metrolink has a central "turnback" siding south of Timperley, installed, apparently, so that Metrolink could terminate there were there problems on the NR section through Navigation Road and seems to be under the control of Metrolink rather than the NR Deansgate Junction box. The turnback siding is long enough to stable a number of trams, if required.

It is used quite regularly (as I can testify, after being turfed out at Timperley) when Metrolink goes pear-shaped, as happens equally regularly. I (so far) havn't seen it used for NR failures.

Metrolink can also reverse on the single track section at Navigation Road, and do that ocassionally when pear-shaped, presumably with the assistance of Deansgate Jcn box.

The NR line has an hourly service, Metrolink (usually) a 6 minute interval service. I wonder about the work requirements on the point motors and the level crossing barrier motors.

Some of that a bit off topic - the answer, though, is that there is a fixed link between the Metrolink line and NR just north of Altrincham.
 
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