61653 HTAFC
Veteran Member
The suggestion of extending Huddersfield to Castleford through to York often comes up, though it's somewhat off topic for the TP Upgrade.
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Transpennine Route Upgrade and Electrification updates
- Thread starter GRALISTAIR
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And there is even a thread for this: https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/my-idea-extend-huddersfield-castleford-services-to-york.201225/
Well there might be a case for Huddersfield-Wakefield K-Normanton-Castleford-Church Fenton-York electric service perhaps with one stop in Wakefield for fast trains as the current route via Leeds seems to attract more stopping stations (eg White Rose and East Leeds/Thorpe Park), which can only further congest/slow down the service.
They really should be tram stops if Leeds City Council/WYCA could ever get their act together.
59CosG95
Established Member
TransPennine Wiring East Progressometer Post 2.0 - accurate to 22/03/21.
Route announced as 'to be wired' in CP6: Church Fenton - Colton Jct.
All mileages from Manchester Victoria unless stated otherwise. Bridge mileages are approximated where noted.
Going forward, changes will be shown in blue; this reflects readability improvements from the mod team.
1. Neville Hill East Jct (HUL4 18m 25ch) to Micklefield Jct (HUL4 10m 64ch; CFM 15m 63ch) - TBC. Expected to be electrified.
2. Micklefield Jct (HUL4 10m 64ch; CFM 15m 63ch) to Church Fenton North Jct (NOC/CFM 10m 36ch) - TBC. Expected to be electrified.
3. Church Fenton North Jct (NOC/CFM 10m 36ch) to Colton Jct (NOC 5m 41ch/ECM4 182m 79ch)
Electrification work underway.
Southern limit of OLE confirmed to be short of Church Fenton Stn itself due to
a) HS2 Phase 2b works; and
b) the Common Ln Underbridge/Rose Lane UWC situation (i.e. "Steventon with S&C")
With completion scheduled for October 2022; steelwork up in May 2021 & wires up in Jan 2022.
All piles presumed installed.
S1 Monobooms up over Colton S ladder. 8 S1 TTCs (3 boomed) and a UKMS Std portal also up; TTCs only up over the Normanton lines at present.
5 S1 TTCs up and boomed on the Normanton side south of Colton Ln O/B. The lone S1 Monoboom leg up on the Leeds side has now been paired with its doppelganger, and boom installed.
South of Brumber Hill Bridge, almost all S1 TTCs appear to be up and boomed (on the Up Normanton Side) as far as signals Y745 (DL)/Y742(UL)/Y747(DN)/Y44(UN). A S1 Monoboom, close to the trackman's hut on the UN side, is now fully boomed, and its adjustable leg struts are also present & correct. Its overlap compadre, 3 spans south, only has the Normanton side mast up.
A handful of masts (UKMS standard I think) are up between the Normanton lines on the old site of Bolton Percy station.
Between Ulleskelf & CF north Jn, around 20 or so masts (mainly S1 TTCs) are up on the Up Normanton side. Oddly enough, a standard UKMS mast (either a PF double channel or a UC - it's hard to tell from a telephoto shot) is up north of the current CF726/CF724 gantry. This makes me think that the crossover at CF North Jn could be repositioned for higher speed running.
At Church Fenton North Jn, 4 masts (all on the Up Normanton side) have gone up south of the signal gantry supporting signals CF726 (UN) & CF724 (UL); these are 2 no. Tensorex Monoboom Anchor masts sandwiching a pair of S1 style hook-and-pin TTC masts. This must be for an overlap - potentially the southern limit of works.
Track Sectioning Cabin to be built in Church Fenton.
Compounds established at:
Church Fenton;
Ulleskelf;
Bolton Percy (Oxton Lane);
Braegate Lane;
Earfit (Eartfitts?) Lane;
Copmanthorpe (Moor Lane);
Tadcaster Road, Copmanthorpe (by A64); and Dringhouses (Model Railway).
(N.B. All dates are subject to alteration, whether due to COVID-19 or otherwise)
Do let me know if I've missed anything!
Route announced as 'to be wired' in CP6: Church Fenton - Colton Jct.
All mileages from Manchester Victoria unless stated otherwise. Bridge mileages are approximated where noted.
Going forward, changes will be shown in blue; this reflects readability improvements from the mod team.
1. Neville Hill East Jct (HUL4 18m 25ch) to Micklefield Jct (HUL4 10m 64ch; CFM 15m 63ch) - TBC. Expected to be electrified.
2. Micklefield Jct (HUL4 10m 64ch; CFM 15m 63ch) to Church Fenton North Jct (NOC/CFM 10m 36ch) - TBC. Expected to be electrified.
3. Church Fenton North Jct (NOC/CFM 10m 36ch) to Colton Jct (NOC 5m 41ch/ECM4 182m 79ch)
Electrification work underway.
Southern limit of OLE confirmed to be short of Church Fenton Stn itself due to
a) HS2 Phase 2b works; and
b) the Common Ln Underbridge/Rose Lane UWC situation (i.e. "Steventon with S&C")
With completion scheduled for October 2022; steelwork up in May 2021 & wires up in Jan 2022.
All piles presumed installed.
S1 Monobooms up over Colton S ladder. 8 S1 TTCs (3 boomed) and a UKMS Std portal also up; TTCs only up over the Normanton lines at present.
5 S1 TTCs up and boomed on the Normanton side south of Colton Ln O/B. The lone S1 Monoboom leg up on the Leeds side has now been paired with its doppelganger, and boom installed.
South of Brumber Hill Bridge, almost all S1 TTCs appear to be up and boomed (on the Up Normanton Side) as far as signals Y745 (DL)/Y742(UL)/Y747(DN)/Y44(UN). A S1 Monoboom, close to the trackman's hut on the UN side, is now fully boomed, and its adjustable leg struts are also present & correct. Its overlap compadre, 3 spans south, only has the Normanton side mast up.
A handful of masts (UKMS standard I think) are up between the Normanton lines on the old site of Bolton Percy station.
Between Ulleskelf & CF north Jn, around 20 or so masts (mainly S1 TTCs) are up on the Up Normanton side. Oddly enough, a standard UKMS mast (either a PF double channel or a UC - it's hard to tell from a telephoto shot) is up north of the current CF726/CF724 gantry. This makes me think that the crossover at CF North Jn could be repositioned for higher speed running.
At Church Fenton North Jn, 4 masts (all on the Up Normanton side) have gone up south of the signal gantry supporting signals CF726 (UN) & CF724 (UL); these are 2 no. Tensorex Monoboom Anchor masts sandwiching a pair of S1 style hook-and-pin TTC masts. This must be for an overlap - potentially the southern limit of works.
Track Sectioning Cabin to be built in Church Fenton.
Compounds established at:
Church Fenton;
Ulleskelf;
Bolton Percy (Oxton Lane);
Braegate Lane;
Earfit (Eartfitts?) Lane;
Copmanthorpe (Moor Lane);
Tadcaster Road, Copmanthorpe (by A64); and Dringhouses (Model Railway).
(N.B. All dates are subject to alteration, whether due to COVID-19 or otherwise)
Do let me know if I've missed anything!
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Halifaxlad
Established Member
I somehow doubt the 333's will still be around by the time this gets done. 331's will probably be past it by then too
Its exactly these sorts of comments why I changed my profile pic to Oddball!
59CosG95
Established Member
Big News - the TWAO for Huddersfield - Ravensthorpe has been submitted. Not an April Fool either! https://www.networkrail.co.uk/runni...te-upgrade/huddersfield-to-westtown-dewsbury/
Last edited by a moderator:
YorkshireBear
Established Member
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Amazing news! That is a statement of intent of ever I saw one.
Hopefully with the government fully behind PACE and criticising the industry for being so slow they won't sit with it on their desks for years and they will approve it pronto.
59CosG95
Established Member
The selection of documents is very interesting indeed, particularly this one: https://sacuksprodnrdigital0001.blob.core.windows.net/twao-huddersfield-westtown/Listed Building Consents/Application No.1 - Huddersfield Station/Roof A OLE Support Details.pdf
Looks like Huddersfield won't need headspans after all!
Further details shows that the new feeder at Ravensthorpe will be a Static Frequency Converter (SFC) feeder, rather than an AT feeder. Not much point adding AT capability on a spur, after all!
On a more general note, the breakdown of the TRU works as a whole is included in the NR04 "Statement of Aims" doc.
In summary:
Stations requiring Step-Free Access (excluding Ravensthorpe-Huddersfield):
Looks like Huddersfield won't need headspans after all!
Further details shows that the new feeder at Ravensthorpe will be a Static Frequency Converter (SFC) feeder, rather than an AT feeder. Not much point adding AT capability on a spur, after all!
On a more general note, the breakdown of the TRU works as a whole is included in the NR04 "Statement of Aims" doc.
In summary:
- W1 - happening, with details gathered
- W2a - happening, details a little sketchy
- W3 - happening, with details in abundance
- W4 - happening (only with regards to refs made in W3)
- W5 - happening (although it's the first I've heard of it!)
- E1 - happening - see posts upthread for progress
Stations requiring Step-Free Access (excluding Ravensthorpe-Huddersfield):
- Church Fenton
- Micklefield (possibly)
- Garforth
- Cottingley (if retained)
- Morley
- Batley
- Slaithwaite (possibly)
- Marsden
- Greenfield
- Mossley
- and an 11th one which I can't put my finger on. Man Vic, Ashton-u-L, Stalybridge, Huddersfield-Ravensthorpe (in scheme W3), Dewsbury, Leeds, Cross Gates, East Garforth & Ulleskelf are all accessible.
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Among the documents that are part of the application is a statement on the funding position:
So Hudds to Westtown alone is expected to cost nearly £1.5bn and still be spending money at the beginning of CP7. (Edit after the discussion below: I meant CP8.)
So Hudds to Westtown alone is expected to cost nearly £1.5bn and still be spending money at the beginning of CP7. (Edit after the discussion below: I meant CP8.)
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YorkshireBear
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The timescales are not a suprise. TWAO not yet approved. Not even close to having shovels in ground. And it's a huge job. Id say we are at least a year away from any major start on site? Then 2-3 years to construct which will have to be done in stages.
Wasn't the application for the Order only submitted yesterday?
YorkshireBear
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Yes. The poster above, the tone of what I read suggested they were surprised they would still be spending money in CP7, I was just trying to say it wasn't a surprise.
Ah I see thank you. I hadn't detected a sense that snowball thought that the work was too expensive or too slow.
YorkshireBear
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I could be wrong it's online afterall! Still great news all round. I honestly don't think the TWAO would be submitted if they didn't think it would be approved in this current PACE climate.
#3887 was intended to be purely informative and mostly neutral in tone.
However it did contain an error. When I said "still spending money at the beginning of CP7" I meant "still spending money at the beginning of CP8", which may merit a bit of surprise. To be exact, £37M in CP8. I've now amended the post to correct that.
In previous posts I and others have been confused about the various sums of money that have been quoted, what exactly they do and don't cover, what works have guaranteed funding and what don't. We now know a bit more.
However it did contain an error. When I said "still spending money at the beginning of CP7" I meant "still spending money at the beginning of CP8", which may merit a bit of surprise. To be exact, £37M in CP8. I've now amended the post to correct that.
In previous posts I and others have been confused about the various sums of money that have been quoted, what exactly they do and don't cover, what works have guaranteed funding and what don't. We now know a bit more.
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YorkshireBear
Established Member
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Sorry! My bad.
It was my mistake to say CP7 when I meant CP8 - and I didn't notice it until after I'd written the first version of #3893. I then edited #3893 (and #3887) but you may have already been replying.
Maybe it would be simplest if a mod could delete everything from #3888 to this post inclusive?
That makes more sense thank you. I agree and I also thought it was interesting to see the planned spend trailing off, presumably after most work is complete, in 2029 and beyond.
GRALISTAIR
Established Member
1.5 Billion pounds for just part of the scheme is a big chunk of change
Halifaxlad
Established Member
Thanks for reporting and keeping us updated. I'm looking forward to digesting them later tonight.
Glenn1969
Established Member
Don't forget they submitted a TWAO for Castlefield. It wasn't approved because Grayling deemed it to be too expensive. £1.5bn just for Huddersfield to just past Dewsbury is an eyewatering sum of money. Does Bald Rick think it, Stalybridge-Huddersfield electrification and the full NPR network will all be open before 2045? Have to say I'm not convinced in the post Covid world
GRALISTAIR
Established Member
I agree it is eye watering but it is not just electrification. 4 tracking and other stuff in the works - step free access etc. I actually on balance prefer the breaking the project up into stages and bits approach.
Halish Railway
Established Member
Not to mention the acquisition of land to iron out the curve at Heaton Lodge Jn, although that won’t constitute a significant part of the £1.5 billion budget seeing as it is only farmland.
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Glenn1969
Established Member
Heaton Lodge, just past Dewsbury
Halish Railway
Established Member
Yes my mistake, I’ve sorted it now.
That’s very optimistic. TWAO are normally allowed 18-24 months from submitting application to order being made. This is a big one, so best to allow 2 years. During that period, properties will be being purchased (owners realising it is going to be compulsorily purchased, dangled a carrot to sell early and remove objections), and the non-contentious elements will be in detailed design. Some enabling works may take place - utility diversions etc. If the order is made in early 2023, then full mobilisation can take place. This will take at least 6 months, possibly twelve. So it’s around 3 years until a ‘major’ start on site.
In parallel, there will be a contract with National Grid / Northern Powergrid for the power supply. That could be a 3-5 year lead time.
In terms of construction, that flyover is probably on the critical path. Probably a 2-3 year job to build that, then a year to fit out and commission with track / OLE / signalling Etc. Say 4 years. So finishing around 2028/9 for the whole job. That’s if it all goes well, the TWAO doesn’t get held up, no issues with getting the access (ie disruption of the line) to build it, and no major construction issues.
This will be done, and almost certainly Huddersfield - Stalybridge, by 2030.
The full NPR Network - well no one knows what the full network is yet. Transport for the North have, as we know, said what they want. But then my daughter has also given me a long list of what she wants for her birthday, and she’s not getting all of it, mostly because I can’t afford it, and partly because I know she’s trying it on.
GRALISTAIR
Established Member
Yes this is not electrification - it is a major route upgrade.