Transport for Wales 769's

[py_megapixel]

Additionally they're in the wrong livery. White with Thameslink blue doors.
I assume they'll have to be vinyled into white with black windows and red doors before they enter service.

 

[fgwrich]

Another delivery. https://twitter.com/Dai_Lygad/status/1281276561916919820?s=19

I'm a bit puzzled by that, as it's still in the previous GTR Scheme - I thought they were being refurbished and re-liveried at the same time? I note that motor coach also retains it's Pantograph as well.

Has that been converted to a 769 or is that a 319 being delivered to Canton?

 

[py_megapixel]

I'm a bit puzzled by that, as it's still in the previous GTR Scheme - I thought they were being refurbished and re-liveried at the same time? I note that motor coach also retains it's Pantograph as well.

Has that been converted to a 769 or is that a 319 being delivered to Canton?

It seems to be a 769, or at least zooming into the photo reveals something which looks like it says "769/4"

Possibly TfW are responsible for having the units re-liveried.


Besides, why would they deliver a 319 to a depot which is completely unelectrified for miles around?

 

[fgwrich]

It seems to be a 769, or at least zooming into the photo reveals something which looks like it says "769/4"
View attachment 80573
Possibly TfW are responsible for having the units re-liveried.


Besides, why would they deliver a 319 to a depot which is completely unelectrified for miles around?

I think you'll find Cardiff is actually electrified, even if the approach to Canton isn't quite yet. Equally, that logic stands for why have they delivered a unit with a Pantograph when the rest of the TfW Fleet have them removed? As for delivering a 319 to Cardiff, a multitude of plausible reasons - Canton has the former Pullman Rail workshop, which has carried out work for other TOCs and companies in the past, or to aid staff training at Canton - GWR did have two 319s delivered to Reading for that purpose during last year.

 

[jopsuk]

repainting the doors is relatively easy, the doors on mark 3 EMUs are pretty readily removable

 

[hobbm013]

TfW are responsible for having the 769s Painted and 3? I think have been done already at Cantom Pullmans

 

[Bob Price]

Been told it is 769445 by someone on Twitter

 

[Cardiff123]

Welsh Govt have today allowed the 2m social distancing rule to be eased for workplaces in 'exceptional circumstances', as long as 'mitigating measures' are put in place. The FM gave an example of perspex screens between employees if a 2m distance isn't possible.
I doubt whether fitting a perspex screen in the middle of a 769 cab is practical to allow driver training to start?
Hopefully though the slight relaxation of this rule will mean a solution can be found to allow testing and training on the 769s to finally start.

 

[aleggatta]

Welsh Govt have today allowed the 2m social distancing rule to be eased for workplaces in 'exceptional circumstances', as long as 'mitigating measures' are put in place. The FM gave an example of perspex screens between employees if a 2m distance isn't possible.
I doubt whether fitting a perspex screen in the middle of a 769 cab is practical to allow driver training to start?
Hopefully though the slight relaxation of this rule will mean a solution can be found to allow testing and training on the 769s to finally start.

you might find that some of those pop up banner type film screens are deemed appropriate, then again this is the railway...!

 

[craigybagel]

Welsh Govt have today allowed the 2m social distancing rule to be eased for workplaces in 'exceptional circumstances', as long as 'mitigating measures' are put in place. The FM gave an example of perspex screens between employees if a 2m distance isn't possible.
I doubt whether fitting a perspex screen in the middle of a 769 cab is practical to allow driver training to start?
Hopefully though the slight relaxation of this rule will mean a solution can be found to allow testing and training on the 769s to finally start.

It'll most likely happen when training across TfW restarts, which hopefully should be fairly soon. The trial that two TOCs were doing to find a safe way to have two people in a cab again has been completed, with I believe positive results. Perspex screens or the Welsh Assembly's views aren't likely to change that very much.

 

[Eccles1983]

You can't train with any screen between driver/instructor.

How is an instructor able to check speed/brake gauge and if required get through said screen to apply brake?

It's a non starter. Unless the wg adds a specific exception then I can't see it happening as it stands. Even if they do, you've still got to get the agreement of drivers and instructors. I wouldn't be agreeing to it as it stands.

 

[Mordac]

Welsh Govt have today allowed the 2m social distancing rule to be eased for workplaces in 'exceptional circumstances', as long as 'mitigating measures' are put in place. The FM gave an example of perspex screens between employees if a 2m distance isn't possible.
I doubt whether fitting a perspex screen in the middle of a 769 cab is practical to allow driver training to start?
Hopefully though the slight relaxation of this rule will mean a solution can be found to allow testing and training on the 769s to finally start.

Using PPE though would work.

 

[Bob Price]

Watch out for paths to appear on RTT. I don't think TfW will be happy having 7 (? Lost count) trains sitting in the sidings doing nothing. Let's see what happens

 

[hobbm013]

Yeah I think it’s 7 that have been delivered. I don’t have dates but my records show the following:

769002 TfW Rail W&B Livery & PRM

769003 TfW Rail W&B Livery & PRM

769006 Thameslink & PRM

769007 Thameslink & PRM

769008 TfW Rail W&B Livery & PRM

769445 Thameslink & PRM

769452 Thameslink & PRM

 

[Bob Price]

2 more to come

 

[GWRrrr]

Still no progress on testing/training?

 

[PHILIPE]

Still no progress on testing/training?

Nothing more than #Post 730 at the moment

 

[Senna1210]

Last unit to be delivered for a while has arrived test runs due to restart very soon

 

[Bob Price]

One more to come? Which one was delivered? Apparently the GWR ones are due very soon.

 

[Cardiff123]

Last unit to be delivered for a while has arrived test runs due to restart very soon

Please forgive my pessimism but we've had sources from within TfW Rail come on here, and have even had 'official' tweets etc from TfW Rail saying that testing/driver training is imminent on 769s etc for months and months and months, but barely anything ever happens. Unless and until there has been regular and successful testing and training on the 769s (and I don't just mean the odd run to Heath High Level) I won't believe anything.

 

[Brissle Girl]

Please forgive my pessimism but we've had sources from within TfW Rail come on here, and have even had 'official' tweets etc from TfW Rail saying that testing/driver training is imminent on 769s etc for months and months and months, but barely anything ever happens.

You can hardly blame TfW. COVID has disrupted everything, more so in Wales than in England (sensibly in my opinion, but that's OT). Trying to predict when anything might get back to any sort of normality is very difficult. Given passenger volumes are going to be well down for months, particularly for the white collar commuter traffic into Cardiff which create the demand that makes these units needed, I'm guessing there is much less of an urgency to get the units into service.

Just because a lot of rail enthusiasts are keen to see a type of unit introduced doesn't mean it's the right thing for TfW to prioritise in the current environment, particularly if it increases risk to the drivers who will need to be trained before they can drive them.

BA has just retired its 747s 4 years early, as have most other airlines, because they no longer need them, so it's the right business decision, even though it's sad. The same is true of the 769s - they are not needed with any degree of urgency, and TfW will base their decisions on need, not sentiment.

 

[Cardiff123]

You can hardly blame TfW. COVID has disrupted everything, more so in Wales than in England (sensibly in my opinion, but that's OT). Trying to predict when anything might get back to any sort of normality is very difficult. Given passenger volumes are going to be well down for months, particularly for the white collar commuter traffic into Cardiff which create the demand that makes these units needed, I'm guessing there is much less of an urgency to get the units into service.

Just because a lot of rail enthusiasts are keen to see a type of unit introduced doesn't mean it's the right thing for TfW to prioritise in the current environment, particularly if it increases risk to the drivers who will need to be trained before they can drive them.

BA has just retired its 747s 4 years early, as have most other airlines, because they no longer need them, so it's the right business decision, even though it's sad. The same is true of the 769s - they are not needed with any degree of urgency, and TfW will base their decisions on need, not sentiment.

I agree, which is why I partly believe these units will never enter service with TfW but only time will tell.

 

[Eccles1983]

Training has been authorised by the union.

 

[squizzler]

The same is true of the 769s - they are not needed with any degree of urgency, and TfW will base their decisions on need, not sentiment.

That is open to dispute. TfW has been chronically short of stock since the get-go and this, in conjunction with distancing requirements, is blamed by many for their continued unwillingness to promote train travel over alternatives.

 

[craigybagel]

That is open to dispute. TfW has been chronically short of stock since the get-go and this, in conjunction with distancing requirements, is blamed by many for their continued unwillingness to promote train travel over alternatives.

Correct - and the only way they can run even the service they're providing at present is through using Pacers, which for many reasons needs to stop ASAP.
I too have had my doubts over the 769s but driver training really is going to be starting soon, which suggests we really are going to see them in service one day

 

[py_megapixel]

As far as I can see the reason they are so short of stock is units away for refurb and PRM mods. The PRM mods are an utter shambles which should have been done years ago and the refurb is virtually pointless given the whole fleet is about to be replaced.

 

[Bob Price]

As far as I can see the reason they are so short of stock is units away for refurb and PRM mods. The PRM mods are an utter shambles which should have been done years ago and the refurb is virtually pointless given the whole fleet is about to be replaced.

Wasn't this why Arriva ordered them in the first place to cover for the 150's while they were being PRM modified? Remember TfW inherented this order.

 

[py_megapixel]

Wasn't this why Arriva ordered them in the first place to cover for the 150's while they were being PRM modified? Remember TfW inherented this order.

Well that backfired then. Especially considering that I don't believe any 150s went for PRM until TfW took over!

 

[6Gtraincrew]

Well that backfired then. Especially considering that I don't believe any 150s went for PRM until TfW took over!

I'm pretty sure 284 and 285 went in under Arriva. But they had huge overhaul while in, so were away for a VERY long time.

 

[Bletchleyite]

They'll find a use. While they use a similar bodyshell, they're newer and more modern (and less polluting) than a pair of 150s. If it turns out the extra capacity isn't needed, I reckon they will bin off a few 150s instead.

That said, TfW has had such a unit shortage (barely anything runs as more than a single unit as a result) that I suspect there will still be the need.