Transport for Wales Class 231 / 756 FLIRTs

[MikePJ]

I’m on 756107 - there’s a guy in a Stadler shirt in the front coach with a ruggedised laptop, presumably just in case of teething troubles.

 

[positron]

I’m on 756107 - there’s a guy in a Stadler shirt in the front coach with a ruggedised laptop, presumably just in case of teething troubles.

Yeah they said on twitter they're doing final passenger testing so probably want to make sure everything is running smoothly, including the PIS which can be a bit iffy on new trains when first entering service.

 

[AdamWW]

I think it's also the first of its kind discontinuous electrification in the UK. With the automated balises for controlling the pantograph.

Anyone got any pantograph up pics of the 756s yet?

Not the world's best photo but it's a pantograph and it's up!

I’m on 756107 - there’s a guy in a Stadler shirt in the front coach with a ruggedised laptop, presumably just in case of teething troubles.

I remember when the GA FLIRTs started they had more than one Stadler person keeping an eye on things on the trains. Of course they were really new then.

(Plus free catering and branded charging cables handed out to passengers on the first day)

Yeah they said on twitter they're doing final passenger testing so probably want to make sure everything is running smoothly, including the PIS which can be a bit iffy on new trains when first entering service.

Hmmm. Maybe it's fixed now but the 231s were announcing Grangetown as the next stop when approaching Central from Queen Street for well over a year.

I think my favourite PIS failure on the 231s was the time the big arrows telling you which side to get off were pointing in both directions. And no the doors weren't open on both sides.

The fact that there are coach letter stickers on the coaches that disagree with the coach letters on the display screens is also pretty good. Fortunately they don't do reservations.

 

[MikePJ]

Leaving Cathays, thrashlessly!

231 for comparison!

 

[Envoy]

Took a ride this morning on a 756 and it is a massive leap from the old sprinters. The only powered bogies are those behind the cab at each end and passengers in the end areas will encounter a slight whine from the electric motor when accelerating - so avoid if you don’t want this. The ride quality is very good. The windows against the light seemed to have a bit of a ‘film’ so perhaps TfW might like to check out the cleaning? I think some of the ‘film’ was on the inside.

The seats are too upright and hard and I prefer those in the 197’s. Many seats are arranged as 4’s around a table and needless to say, I saw some ignorant people with their filthy shoes up on the seats in front of them. I really think that train companies ought to have notices about this as who wants to sit on seats with road filth? It’s the sort of thing that puts people off public transport and remain with car travel. Gives a poor impression of the British to foreigners. No animals should be on seats either.

Despite being off peak, the 4 coach train did fill up when south of Pontypridd and a 2 coach Sprinter would have been really full near Cardiff.

The female guard had an excellent speaking voice - far better than the pre-recorded announcements.

Anyway, the Taff Valley looked lovely this morning as I glided through temperate rain forests with mountains above on my Swiss train. I could have been in Switzerland - well - until I saw Pontypridd.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

So the discontinuous electrification on Cardiff-Radyr (both routes)-Ponty-Merthyr/Aberdare, along with the class 756 tri-mode stock and Taffs Well depot, has been proved in service today?
With no apparent incidents I think that is a big plus mark for TfW and the wider electrification project, even if later than planned.

 

[MikePJ]

So the discontinuous electrification on Cardiff-Radyr (both routes)-Ponty-Merthyr/Aberdare, along with the class 756 tri-mode stock and Taffs Well depot, has been proved in service today?
With no apparent incidents I think that is a big plus mark for TfW and the wider electrification project, even if later than planned.

Both units are still running as of 1730 - so far so good...

 

[John R]

So the discontinuous electrification on Cardiff-Radyr (both routes)-Ponty-Merthyr/Aberdare, along with the class 756 tri-mode stock and Taffs Well depot, has been proved in service today?
With no apparent incidents I think that is a big plus mark for TfW and the wider electrification project, even if later than planned.

I don't think the 756's are based at the Taffs Well Depot though?

So how quickly will these diagrams migrate to 756 operation? I'm thinking that if they ran all 9 diagrams on the Aberdare to Merthyr line that would go a long way to mitigating the loss of Class 150s as they reach their withdrawal date due to needing their heavy overhaul. Let alone any additional use on the Treherbert line.

 

[800001]

I don't think the 756's are based at the Taffs Well Depot though?

So how quickly will these diagrams migrate to 756 operation? I'm thinking that if they ran all 9 diagrams on the Aberdare to Merthyr line that would go a long way to mitigating the loss of Class 150s as they reach their withdrawal date due to needing their heavy overhaul. Let alone any additional use on the Treherbert line.

Taffs Well depot is purely the 398s.

 

[bradleyd]

I've just delayed my journey from central to pontypridd for 20 mins or so, purely so I can get on the 6:56.

First impressions, so much more space, comfier seats and so incredibly cleaner, and do much clearer announcements

 

[AdamWW]

I've just delayed my journey from central to pontypridd for 20 mins or so, purely so I can get on the 6:56.

First impressions, so much more space, comfier seats and so incredibly cleaner, and do much clearer announcements

They really are a step up from Sprinters. Except they aren't a step up, of course. (I think I said that when the 231s started running).

 

[Bob Price]

I took a hop and here's a two minute look. Hello to all the other enthusiasts on board

 

[WelshBluebird]

Of course, this is only temporary until the tram trains so don't get too used to the comfort. But still electric running is great to see after all the work!

 

[Lurcheroo]

Of course, this is only temporary until the tram trains so don't get too used to the comfort. But still electric running is great to see after all the work!

Why do you think the 398’s (also made by Stadler) would be significantly less comfortable than the flirts ?

 

[nigelsporne]

I assume that when there are no wires the units run on battery and that the batteries can recharge when overhead power is used. On the route that they are currently running on what approximately is the battery/overhead power split?

 

[Peter Sarf]

Why do you think the 398’s (also made by Stadler) would be significantly less comfortable than the flirts ?

No loo !.

 

[positron]

I assume that when there are no wires the units run on battery and that the batteries can recharge when overhead power is used. On the route that they are currently running on what approximately is the battery/overhead power split?

This image doesn't account for permanently earthed sections but should give an idea of what the split is. Red being wired, black being catenery free.

Ignore Rhymney as that's heavily striped due to it being under construction still.

 

[Lurcheroo]

No loo !.

I’m not sure I can get behind that as a sound enough reason for people to ‘not get used to the comfort’ of the flirts though.

 

[Peter Sarf]

I’m not sure I can get behind that as a sound enough reason for people to ‘not get used to the comfort’ of the flirts though.

It would make my journey more of a challenge. And people on those routes have been used to loos on trains for quite a while. But the Loo argument has been done to death already, I just think the lack of toilet facilities will be noticed.

 

[Rhydgaled]

This image doesn't account for permanently earthed sections but should give an idea of what the split is. Red being wired, black being catenery free.

Ignore Rhymney as that's heavily striped due to it being under construction still.

Other than the Rhymney line, is there any electrification work still ongoing on the valleys? Just wondering if everything planned on the TAM side has been energised and is ready for use. I was a bit surprised to see no wires at Queen Street in the videos others have posted above, I thought that the wires were planned to start/finish somewhere between Queen Street and Central.

So how quickly will these diagrams migrate to 756 operation? I'm thinking that if they ran all 9 diagrams on the Aberdare to Merthyr line that would go a long way to mitigating the loss of Class 150s as they reach their withdrawal date due to needing their heavy overhaul. Let alone any additional use on the Treherbert line.

Where are the 231s currently as well, and how many diagrams are required to cover everything through Queen Street (except Cardiff Bay)? Just wondering if they would (until the 231s move onto Cheltenhams) be able to cover the lot with FLIRTs once all 35 are in service.

First impressions, so much more space, comfier seats and so incredibly cleaner, and do much clearer announcements

Comfier seats compared to what? My memory is getting a little hazy, but I seem to recall the 150s having rather comfortable seats (but not actually comfortable to sit in on a 150 because of how tightly they are packed together leaving no room for knees).

Of course, this is only temporary until the tram trains so don't get too used to the comfort. But still electric running is great to see after all the work!

Why do you think the 398’s (also made by Stadler) would be significantly less comfortable than the flirts ?

I don't know how the class 398s compare to the Bombardier M5000 trams on Manchester Metrolink, but the latter seemed to offer very few seats. The number of times I ended up sitting on the floor of M5000s during my year in Manchester... In other words, unless the class 398 tram-trains are much-more 'trainlike' than 'tramlike' I suspect there will be a greater chance of being without a seat than on a FLIRT. That, and the lack of a toilet on the 398s.

I’m not sure I can get behind that as a sound enough reason for people to ‘not get used to the comfort’ of the flirts though.

It would make my journey more of a challenge. And people on those routes have been used to loos on trains for quite a while. But the Loo argument has been done to death already, I just think the lack of toilet facilities will be noticed.

I think that very much depends on the passenger (eg. certain health problems, or if they've just had a lot to drink recently) and how far they are intending to travel.

 

[Chris125]

I don't know how the class 398s compare to the Bombardier M5000 trams on Manchester Metrolink, but the latter seemed to offer very few seats. The number of times I ended up sitting on the floor of M5000s during my year in Manchester... In other words, unless the class 398 tram-trains are much-more 'trainlike' than 'tramlike' I suspect there will be a greater chance of being without a seat than on a FLIRT. That, and the lack of a toilet on the 398s.

398s have a train-style interior with 128 mostly transverse seats - 20 more than a TfW 150 I believe.

 

[Envoy]

I spoke to a Stadler engineer and he said that they can get from the electricity north of Cardiff to Barry island and back on battery power. (The 756’s will be used on the Barry Island to Rhymney route). I don’t think they have done a proving run via the Vale of Glamorgan Coast Line to Bridgend & back. The sooner they are introduced on this line - the better and with a half hourly service. It sure would help save Cardiff Airport if the management could show to prospective airlines a modern train fleet with level boarding running every half hour - albeit with the 2 mile shuttle bus from Rhoose station. It is also tough on the people in Llantwit Major & Rhoose who now see Pontypridd & Caerphilly having several trains per hour whilst they only get one. The line is also a short cut between Barry and Bridgend for west Wales.

Looks no 756’s out today (Saturday 16 November) which is disappointing for those wishing to try them out who have been working all week. It is also disappointing in view of the increased flow of people into Cardiff in the run up to Christmas - plus a rugby match tomorrow.

I wonder how many new toilets have been built at stations but I guess that is one for the Metro Infrastructure thread. Anyway, below is a photo of the toilet on the 756 which is excellent - although I think it would be for the best of the seat were left upright.

 

[nigelsporne]

This image doesn't account for permanently earthed sections but should give an idea of what the split is. Red being wired, black being catenery free.

Ignore Rhymney as that's heavily striped due to it being under construction still.

Thank you. Greater than I thought.

 

[positron]

Thank you. Greater than I thought.

Yeah it's the Rhymney line where there's a lot more catenery free sections (Caerphilly, Llanbradach, Hengoed, Bargoed etc) because the Flirts have bigger batteries than the 398s. It'll be interesting to see as time goes on if any of these get closed up or any PESs gotten rid of. I'm assuming it might be stuck in it's current discontinuous form for quite some time.

 

[Caaardiff]

Am I right in thinking that no 756's have been out this weekend? Even with the rugby game?

 

[positron]

Am I right in thinking that no 756's have been out this weekend? Even with the rugby game?

Yeah nothing showed up on real-time trains today or yesterday.

 

[CardiffKid]

…I saw some ignorant people with their filthy shoes up on the seats in front of them. I really think that train companies ought to have notices about this as who wants to sit on seats with road filth? It’s the sort of thing that puts people off public transport and remain with car travel. Gives a poor impression of the British to foreigners. No animals should be on seats either.

Signage won’t prevent this. Trust me.

 

[Snow1964]

TfW press release, new trains from 18th Nov​

17 Nov 2024​

Electric ‘tri-mode’ trains will be introduced to passenger services for the first time in the UK today (18 Nov) as part of the South Wales Metro.

They will be introduced on the Valley lines in South Wales for the first time ever signifying a huge moment in the delivery of the next phase of the South Wales Metro.

They will enter passenger service first on the Merthyr and Aberdare lines, followed by the Treherbert line. In a phased introduction, they will replace TfW’s older trains, with fourteen set to be in service by Spring next year (2025).

Transport for Wales has already introduced sixty-five brand-new trains and seven premier class MK4 trains to the Wales and Borders network over the last two years as part of their £800 million investment into new trains.

Built by leading manufacturer Stadler, the new Class 756 Fast Light Intercity and Regional Trains (FLIRTs) will be powered by the recently installed overhead electrified wires, which carry 25,000V.

These transformative ‘tri-mode’ trains are the first in the UK that can use diesel or battery on sections of railway track where there are no overhead wires.

First electric trains to be introduced to South Wales Metro

Electric ‘tri-mode’ trains will be introduced to passenger services for the first time in the UK today (18 Nov) as part of the South Wales Metro.

news.tfw.wales

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

TfW press release, new trains from 18th Nov​

First electric trains to be introduced to South Wales Metro

Electric ‘tri-mode’ trains will be introduced to passenger services for the first time in the UK today (18 Nov) as part of the South Wales Metro.

news.tfw.wales

Is fourteen enough to facilitate the full Aberdare, Treherbert and Merthyr service then? I assume Cardiff Bay Pontypridd will be 150s and likely from May pairs of 153s until the 398s come into service.

 

[6Gtraincrew]

Allocation for today:

2F00 is 756117 (05:16 Ponty - Cdf)
2M00 is 756115 (05:26 Cdf - Merthyr)