Are there any stations which see diesel units, diesel-electric units, AC units and DC units? Excluding stations that have dual-voltage trains but only use one voltage e.g. 377s at Milton Keynes or dragged units e.g. Pendolinos at Chester.
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Trivia: All 4 "types" of traction at one station
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alex17595
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The best I can think of is Ashford international that is 171s (diesel I think) DC 365s and The eurostars OHLE.
There are a lot of stations which have 3 types but I was wondering if there are any stations which have 4 types and all 4 types in use. Bletchley is the closest I've come to all 4 types: 150s (diesel), 221s which pass through (diesel-electric), 350s (AC), 377s (AC and DC but only using AC), 390s which pass through (AC.)
Bastiaan
Member
The only station I can think of is Liverpool Lime Street. Various Northern, EMT and TPE diesel units, CrossCountry 220/221 (DEMU), Virgin 390 and LM 350 (AC electric) and if you count in the low level Merseyrail platform, then there are DC electric class 507/508.
When Reading is electrified, there's a good chance you can see both AC and DC electrics as well as DMUs and DEMUs.
When Reading is electrified, there's a good chance you can see both AC and DC electrics as well as DMUs and DEMUs.
alex17595
Member
i do not think XC serve Liverpool lime street.
If you counted St Enoch as part of Glasgow central they would all be there. 221,390s, Subway stock, 15x
If you counted St Enoch as part of Glasgow central they would all be there. 221,390s, Subway stock, 15x
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They don't. The only way you'd get a 221 at Lime Street is if it fills in for a Virgin 390 but I don't know of that ever happening.
alex17595
Member
What about Paddington ?
DC tube lines
AC Heathrow express
Diesel-electric HST
Diesel 166
DC tube lines
AC Heathrow express
Diesel-electric HST
Diesel 166
joeykins82
Member
Do the 222s ever operate the EMT Norwich-Liverpool route?
matchmaker
Established Member
But St Enoch is not part of Central. It used to have a main line terminus next to it, but that was St Enoch, not Central!
Ooh, good call, especially with the H&C running on the surface alongside the mainline
Only for specials.
EMT don't even do that now the 158 refurbishment is complete. There used to be a 7 car 222 working on Grand National Saturday but 2012 is the last time that happened.
swt_passenger
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Southampton Central gets the four, with the 377/2s having the opposite problem to what you see at Bletchley.
JamesRowden
Established Member
If we also count non-passenger services, you would get the 4th at Ashford, diesel electric, in the form of class 73s travelling to/from the Marshlink.
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Peter Sarf
Established Member
Willesden Junction. Firstly the DC lines (Class 378s) run alongside the AC lines (221s & 390s) from Euston to Watford Junction. Now for the difficult bit. I have seen 150s at Willesden Junction reversing. The Gospel Oak - Barking 172s (EDIT not 171s !) are maintained at Willesden depot. Is that near enough ?.
Othwise it is a case of looking where there are DC lines alongside AC lines. DC is Liverpool, Tyne and Wear (1,500 V DC overhead ?) and London (Tube, Southern and London Overground).
BUT how about five types - DIESEL HYDRAULIC how could you forget (OK fluid drive).
Othwise it is a case of looking where there are DC lines alongside AC lines. DC is Liverpool, Tyne and Wear (1,500 V DC overhead ?) and London (Tube, Southern and London Overground).
BUT how about five types - DIESEL HYDRAULIC how could you forget (OK fluid drive).
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joeykins82
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There's a PIXC buster run from Willesden Junction using a 172 if I remember correctly (I've seen it in the bay platform at least)
Buttsy
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It's the 07:59 from Woodgrange Park that terminates in the bay around 09:00
swt_passenger
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Defining 'types' of traction starts becoming a bit subjective if you decide DHMU and DMMU are different species though. To my mind that is not quite as significant a difference as between DMU and DEMU; but others may have different views.
WestCountry
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Newcastle, if you count the Metro (1500VDC). We had LU already.
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MK Tom
Established Member
That's not what's meant by diesel electric. The OP was talking about DEMUs, in other words classes in the 2xx series, like Voyagers.
I believe the term for classes 71 and 73 is electro-diesel, or possibly bi-mode these days.
swt_passenger
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You are mistaken. The traction third rail never came further north of Farringdon.
matchmaker
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I'd count DMMU and DHMU as different! It caused problems with 1st gen units if a DHMU Class 127 was coupled to a DMMU with the same Blue Square coupling code. They had to change the 127's to a different coupling code eventually.
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WestCountry
Member
Oops.
I remembered it was three stations in the dual-electrified bit, but forgot about City Thameslink. That could actually be the second time I've done that.
A 73 running on its diesel engine is a diesel-electric, though. The engine drives the wheels through a generator and the traction motors.
JamesRowden
Established Member
As I understand it diesel-electric traction is the process of having a diesel generator onboard to produce the electricity that then drives electric motors. Electrodiesels therefore are diesel electric traction when self powered.
No where in the opening post is the term 'multiple' (not even as an 'M' in an abreviation). Otherwise the Paddington example is invalid since HSTs are not multiple units.
An example of a DEMU that runs through Ashford is the class 1001 Hastings diesel that is used for frequent rail tours. One can also then add steam traction as used by other frequent rail tours.
Kentish Paul
Member
Plus the class 66 that pass through on freight, and class 20/37 on the flasks fron Dungeness.
Eagle
Established Member
Ooh, huge can of worms there.
I'd say HSTs are DEMUs (albeit with the relatively unusual layout of having all passenger accomodation in unpowered vehicles). They were even numbered in the DEMU range: 253 and 254.
The powercars' 43xxx numbers are not strictly speaking locomotive numbers, they're vehicle numbers, going along with the 41xxx and 42xxx series for other HST carriages. A Class 43 locomotive is something different (of which sadly no examples exist any more).
JamesRowden
Established Member
I haven't seen any HSTs at Paddington that can link up cab-to-cab and run in multiple with another one. Thats my definition of a multiple unit.
Eagle
Established Member
I haven't seen any HSTs at Paddington that can link up cab-to-cab and run in multiple with another one. Thats my definition of a multiple unit.
Fine then, they're DEUs...
A lot of railway documentation still refers to "class 253 and 254 units" (such as the Sectional Appendix, where HST means something less specific).
alex17595
Member
I haven't seen any HSTs at Paddington that can link up cab-to-cab and run in multiple with another one. Thats my definition of a multiple unit.
Couldn't the ones with buffers theoretically work in multiple although it will never happen?
Being from the North West I rarely see units which aren't multiple units so I was thinking 22xs when I said diesel-electric but didn't specifically say multiple units as JamesRowden has pointed out.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Virgin attempted something like that but it didn't achieve anything other than a unit being taken out-of-service.
http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?t=92792
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I haven't seen any HSTs at Paddington that can link up cab-to-cab and run in multiple with another one. Thats my definition of a multiple unit.
Maybe, but they would end up being too long for every platform!
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