• Our booking engine at tickets.railforums.co.uk (powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!

Trivia: Largest town/city that isn't served by more than one major city

Status
Not open for further replies.

Clansman

Established Member
Joined
4 Jan 2016
Messages
2,571
Location
Hong Kong
As per the title. In this context, 'major' being a loose term for large cities over ~200k population or cities with strategic railway importance such as being a major interchange or terminus (Preston, Carlisle, Exeter etc).

East Kilbride is the largest example in Scotland, with a population of around 80k and only being served by Glasgow.
Cumbernauld wasn't far behind with only Glasgow until through services to Edinburgh started over a year ago. Similar stories for Paisley and Ayr as well.

Surely there has to be a good few down south?
 
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R

RailUK Forums

scrapy

Established Member
Joined
15 Dec 2008
Messages
2,081
I'd go with Southend the only major city directly served is London. There will be several in Kent to the same.
 

johnnychips

Established Member
Joined
19 Nov 2011
Messages
3,675
Location
Sheffield
Great Yarmouth, population 38000, only to Norwich.

Boston, population 33000, only to Nottingham.
 
Last edited:

London Trains

Member
Joined
9 Oct 2017
Messages
901
Surely there has to be a good few down south?

Not really. Most places are not big enough, and along the south coast, all the cities (Brighton / Portsmouth / Southampton) have services to one another, as well as London.
 

Mcr Warrior

Veteran Member
Joined
8 Jan 2009
Messages
11,648
I'm a bit confused by this thread. What exactly are we looking for? Large towns/cities with train services that only ever call (or terminate) at a maximum of one other location which has "city" status? And this "city" has to have a 200,000+ population. Or failing that is a strategic railway interchange or terminus?

Is that it?
 

johnnychips

Established Member
Joined
19 Nov 2011
Messages
3,675
Location
Sheffield
That’s how I read it. So Lowestoft with a population of 71000 wouldn’t count as it has services to Ipswich and Norwich. King’s Lynn looks more promising: population 42 000 with services only to London, but then you realise that Cambridge, although only having a population of 119 000, is a major interchange.

Southend in post 2 seems a good bet. Its population is 184 000, which includes some suburbs like Leigh on Sea and Shoeburyness.
 
Last edited:

Jorge Da Silva

Established Member
Joined
4 Apr 2018
Messages
2,591
Location
Cleethorpes, North East Lincolnshire
That’s how I read it. So Lowestoft with a population of 71000 wouldn’t count as it has services to London and Norwich. King’s Lynn looks more promising: population 42 000 with services only to London, but then you realise that Cambridge, although only having a population of 119 000, is a major interchange.

There are currently no services between Lowestoft and London although there are plans for some
 

johnnychips

Established Member
Joined
19 Nov 2011
Messages
3,675
Location
Sheffield
There are currently no services between Lowestoft and London although there are plans for some
Oops I meant Ipswich - population 115 000 but a major interchange. Now edited.

Another I thought of was Basildon, population 107 000 but only links to London.
 
Last edited:

route101

Established Member
Joined
16 May 2010
Messages
10,595
As per the title. In this context, 'major' being a loose term for large cities over ~200k population or cities with strategic railway importance such as being a major interchange or terminus (Preston, Carlisle, Exeter etc).

East Kilbride is the largest example in Scotland, with a population of around 80k and only being served by Glasgow.
Cumbernauld wasn't far behind with only Glasgow until through services to Edinburgh started over a year ago. Similar stories for Paisley and Ayr as well.

Surely there has to be a good few down south?

East Kilbride is such a poorly connected place for Scotlands largest town, rail or bus.
 

si404

Established Member
Joined
28 Dec 2012
Messages
1,267
Another I thought of was Basildon, population 107 000 but only links to London.
Southend urban area is over 300,000, so Basildon links to two places* over 200k

Southend is the winner, unless Chester (just under 100k) isn't a major interchange, in which case Birkenhead is the winner.

*I don't think actual city status is relevant for this thread.
 

willgreen

Member
Joined
11 Jan 2020
Messages
612
Location
Leeds
A fair bit of the T&W Metro is only connected to one city, Newcastle e.g. Tynemouth, North Shields, South Shields (Sunderland can be accessed with a change)
(No, Gateshead isn't a city)
 

Strathclyder

Established Member
Joined
12 Jun 2013
Messages
3,178
Location
Clydebank
I would've put Clydebank (25,970 for the town proper, 37,560 including the populations of Duntocher/Hardgate & Faifley), Dumbarton (pop. of 20,570, urban area 21,120) & Helensburgh (pop. of 13,310. urban area 15,300) up for nomination, but then I remembered: the Caledonian Sleeper serves all three of them: at Dalmuir (Clydebank), Dumbarton (Dumbarton Central) & Helensburgh Upper (Helensburgh) respectively, providing direct (if infrequent!) links to both Edinburgh & London. This, in addition to the all-day service to Edinburgh (via Livingston, Bathgate, Airdrie, Glasgow, Dalmuir & Dumbarton) starting/finishing at Helensburgh Central of course.
 

Bevan Price

Established Member
Joined
22 Apr 2010
Messages
7,320
I assume the OP means "served by Through Trains" ?
If so, Bootle & Crosby (each about 51,000 in the traditional town areas) are both served only by Liverpool.

Oldham (103,000) only has Metrolink to Manchester.
Sutton Coldfield (105,000) only has Birmingham.
 

Intercity 225

Member
Joined
2 Mar 2014
Messages
329
Mansfield must be a contender for this because the only major city it’s connected to is Nottingham.

The town itself has a population of 107k with its wider urban area containing 172k - that’s the 37th largest population in England and higher than many cities.
 

Bedpan

Established Member
Joined
4 Feb 2010
Messages
1,286
Location
Harpenden
A fair bit of the T&W Metro is only connected to one city, Newcastle e.g. Tynemouth, North Shields, South Shields (Sunderland can be accessed with a change)
(No, Gateshead isn't a city)
I think that it has to be a large town or city that is only connected to one other large town or city, so Tynemouth, North and South Shields etc wouldn't count as they are too small.

Would Kingston on Thames count, or would that be classed as being oart of London rather than a town in its own right?
 

4-SUB 4732

Established Member
Joined
7 Jan 2018
Messages
2,150
Would Gravesend be a good shout? Only served by London, and I don’t consider Ebbsfleet / Stratford / Chatham as major interchanges of any real note.

Tunbridge Wells must also now be relegated to this category having lost links to Croydon; and now only being served by London and, realistically, only one suit of termini. It doesn’t even get, for example, services to Victoria or Blackfriars.

Someone has however mentioned Mansfield, definitely a poor relation in connectivity.
 

4-SUB 4732

Established Member
Joined
7 Jan 2018
Messages
2,150
Thinking about it, can we put Walsall in here? Only goes to Birmingham, and the connection it has to Wolverhampton is pants and takes so long that bus / taxi is a better option?
 

PeterC

Established Member
Joined
29 Sep 2014
Messages
4,069
I'd go with Southend the only major city directly served is London. There will be several in Kent to the same.
That was my first thought, particularly if you take Castle Point as well as Southend as they are a single connurbation.
 

willgreen

Member
Joined
11 Jan 2020
Messages
612
Location
Leeds
I think that it has to be a large town or city that is only connected to one other large town or city, so Tynemouth, North and South Shields etc wouldn't count as they are too small.
South Shields has a population of 75,000, and the urban area of South Tyneside has a population of 150,000; North Shields, whilst only having a population of around 35,000, is part of the 200,000-strong North Tyneside. Hardly 'too small'.
 
Joined
20 May 2018
Messages
229
I think that it has to be a large town or city that is only connected to one other large town or city, so Tynemouth, North and South Shields etc wouldn't count as they are too small.

Would Kingston on Thames count, or would that be classed as being oart of London rather than a town in its own right?
I'd argue Surbiton is basically Kingston Parkway so that's trains to loads of other places.
 

bussnapperwm

Established Member
Joined
18 May 2014
Messages
1,506
Dudley. The nearest rail connection is Sandwell & Dudley/Dudley Port in the borough of Sandwell (or Stourbridge/Coseley if you wanted to stay in the borough of Dudley)
 

BayPaul

Established Member
Joined
11 Jul 2019
Messages
1,219
Would Gravesend be a good shout? Only served by London, and I don’t consider Ebbsfleet / Stratford / Chatham as major interchanges of any real note.
As well as Luton, mentionned above, the Medway Towns connobation is over 200k
 

Ianno87

Veteran Member
Joined
3 May 2015
Messages
15,215
Thinking about it, can we put Walsall in here? Only goes to Birmingham, and the connection it has to Wolverhampton is pants and takes so long that bus / taxi is a better option?


In non-Covid world, aren't there still Euston-Brum-Walsall LNW services?


Mansfield must be a contender for this because the only major city it’s connected to is Nottingham.

The town itself has a population of 107k with its wider urban area containing 172k - that’s the 37th largest population in England and higher than many cities.

There is a daily morning Mansfield-Norwich train in normal times, I recall?
 

adrock1976

Established Member
Joined
10 Dec 2013
Messages
4,450
Location
What's it called? It's called Cumbernauld
I think that it has to be a large town or city that is only connected to one other large town or city, so Tynemouth, North and South Shields etc wouldn't count as they are too small.

Would Kingston on Thames count, or would that be classed as being oart of London rather than a town in its own right?

I suppose it depends if Kingston upon Thames is referred to being in Surrey too. Also, I believe the county council functions of Surrey are shared between Kingston upon Thames and Guildford.

I'd argue Surbiton is basically Kingston Parkway so that's trains to loads of other places.

Surbiton is a post town in its own right, even though it has a KT postcode which is centred on Kingston upon Thames.
 

Ianno87

Veteran Member
Joined
3 May 2015
Messages
15,215
I suppose it depends if Kingston upon Thames is referred to being in Surrey too. Also, I believe the county council functions of Surrey are shared between Kingston upon Thames and Guildford.



Surbiton is a post town in its own right, even though it has a KT postcode which is centred on Kingston upon Thames.

Surbiton, when built, was the Kingston station before the current Kingston station was built.
 

Intercity 225

Member
Joined
2 Mar 2014
Messages
329
There is a daily morning Mansfield-Norwich train in normal times, I recall?

AFAIK although a direct morning service between Mansfield and Norwich can appear on some online journey planners, it doesn’t appear in any printed timetables nor does it appear on any PIS. The destination on the platform displays at the Robin Hood Line stations all show Nottingham with no mention of Norwich. It’s essentially a unit that runs a Robin Hood Line service before a Nottingham to Norwich service.

In addition to this, the wait time at Nottingham is huge and 100% of the passengers disembark at the end of the Robin Hood Line stretch most of the time.

I believe there’s also a Liverpool Lime St to Worksop service that works in the same kind of way that also appears on some online journey planners. Again though, it shows on no official documentation nor on any PIS.

Happy to be corrected on the above but pretty sure the Mansfield to Norwich “service“ is just an anomaly instead of an official end to end direct train.
 
Joined
23 Apr 2012
Messages
343
Location
Greater manchester.
I assume the OP means "served by Through Trains" ?
If so, Bootle & Crosby (each about 51,000 in the traditional town areas) are both served only by Liverpool.

Oldham (103,000) only has Metrolink to Manchester.
Sutton Coldfield (105,000) only has Birmingham
Oldham town centre does only have Metrolink services , However Greenfield has services to Huddersfield,Leeds. Mills Hill which is on the Oldham Middleton border, Has services to Rochdale.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Top