Trivia: Place names that you're not sure how to pronounce

[krus_aragon]

I used to live in Rhiwbina ward (on the site of the old Whitchurch station goods yard), and believe that it is pronounced essentially as it is written in Welsh (Rhiwbeina), i.e. rhioo-bei-na. Welsh speakers are free to correct me.

I'll agree with that pronunciation. You might get a it of dialectual variance (rhioo-b'ey-na vs rhioo-b'aye-na), but that's just a tiddly difference.

 

[krus_aragon]

A -- lesser -- Welsh pitfall which was new to me, turned up in another thread on this theme (possibly even this one !): a place which no longer has a station, though it once did: Abertillery -- which I learned, is pronounced "Aber-till-AIR-y". I'd thought from way back, that the stress was on the third syllable: false analogy with "artillery", I suppose. Don't think I've ever heard the name said out loud -- and never saw any indication of the correct pronunciation, until reading it on these Forums.

That follows the general rule of Welsh that the emphasis is on the penultimate syllable. (Exemptions are generally loan words from other languages, or some compound words).

 

[hexagon789]

One I heard recently which was different to how I assumed it was pronounced - Heysham. Not Hay-shum as I thought, but Hee-shum apparently.

 

[TheSel]

For many years, those south of Watford have insisted on pronouncing Clapham (as in Junction) Clap - 'am (ignorantly dropping the aspirate **) - whereas those of us in the know realise that "ph" is pronounced "ff". So it's Clay - Fam

** To drop one's aspirates - i.e. not to pronounce the 'h'; a mark of imperfect education or humble social standing (source: Chambers Dictionary)

 

[johnnychips]

Like it! Of course most places ending in ‘ham’ come from the Saxon for ‘village’. Sometimes the h is pronounced as the start of the final syllable and sometimes it joins the previous vowel. The oft-cited example is ‘Gotham’, a village in the East Midlands pronounced ‘got-ham’ ( or even ‘gottam’ as opposed to Batman’s home city, which is ‘goth-um’.

 

[Djgr]

West Kirby is pronounced like Kirkby. Meols Cop is not pronounced like Meols.

 

[Merthyr Imp]

Gotham is pronounced 'goat-um'.

 

[fairysdad]

Like it! Of course most places ending in ‘ham’ come from the Saxon for ‘village’. Sometimes the h is pronounced as the start of the final syllable and sometimes it joins the previous vowel. The oft-cited example is ‘Gotham’, a village in the East Midlands pronounced ‘got-ham’ ( or even ‘gottam’ as opposed to Batman’s home city, which is ‘goth-um’.

Given the London Borough of Newham was created by combining West Ham and East Ham, should we call it New-ham, or should we be calling them West'um and East'um?

 

[transmanche]

Given the London Borough of Newham was created by combining West Ham and East Ham, should we call it New-ham, or should we be calling them West'um and East'um?

Hehe! Perhaps when they invented the name Newham, they should have made it New Ham so we wouldn't be in any doubt.

 

[Lucan]

Worldham, a villiage in Hampshire, is interesting. My father-in-law, who is native to that area, pronounces it "Word-lam". I thought his pronounciation was sloppy until, reading Gilbert White's classic The Natural History of Selborne, written around 1800, and Selborne being nearby, I found that White refers to it as "Ward-le-Ham". So it seems my father-in-law is more correct. Probably a case of distant bureaucrats getting a place name wrong when the paperwork was set up.

 

[Railwaysceptic]

When I went to Lowestoft back in the mid-1960s, people there pronounced Norwich as 'Narge' (rhymed with 'barge'); they also pronounced their hometown as 'Lowstarft'.

I guess it's a matter of chance whether local pronunciations become the generally used ones on, for example, the telly news or announcements on the railway, or stay purely local.

I visited Lowestoft last year and the locals I talked with pronounced it "loo stoff." I'd always assumed it was phonetic so I was surprised.

 

[chorleyjeff]

One I heard recently which was different to how I assumed it was pronounced - Heysham. Not Hay-shum as I thought, but Hee-shum apparently.

Engine driver dad of a friend ( in steam days ) who went there for work referred to it as Haysham.
Perhaps ask someone who lives there.

Another place to mention is Lower Peover pronounced Lower Peever. Genteel folk down there in Cheshire !

 

[hexagon789]

Engine driver dad of a friend ( in steam days ) who went there for work referred to it as Haysham.
Perhaps ask someone who lives there.

Pronouncing dictionary of place names has it as Hee-shum, I just never thought to look it up until I heard it pronounced that way.

 

[PaulLothian]

I was brought up in the village of Burpham (now a suburb of Guildford), and definitely pronounced -ph-, not Burp-ham.

 

[stut]

I visited Lowestoft last year and the locals I talked with pronounced it "loo stoff." I'd always assumed it was phonetic so I was surprised.

That's accent more than anything else, though. "Oh" sounds often come out at "oo" in East Angular accents, just as glo'al stops are frequently deployed.

 

[stut]

I was brought up in the village of Burpham (now a suburb of Guildford), and definitely pronounced -ph-, not Burp-ham.

And let's not forget that you can get a train from Bosham (Bozzum) to Cosham (Cosh-um) with a quick change at Havant.

 

[Francis]

Doveridge, by the A50 south of Ashbourne is a typical example of how uncertain English pronunciation is.

I've often wondered, is it two syllables - Dove-ridge (as the bird) or Dove-ridge (as he plunged into a swimming bath)?
Or three; Dovv-er-idge or Doe-ver - idge?

At least Welsh pronunciation, once you know the rules, is phonetic and regular, whereas in English you have to ask the locals.

 

[Zooty]

Engine driver dad of a friend ( in steam days ) who went there for work referred to it as Haysham.
Perhaps ask someone who lives there.

Absolutely, definitely Hee-sham

 

[Dr_Paul]

For many years, those south of Watford have insisted on pronouncing Clapham (as in Junction) Clap - 'am (ignorantly dropping the aspirate **) - whereas those of us in the know realise that "ph" is pronounced "ff". So it's Clay - Fam. ** To drop one's aspirates - i.e. not to pronounce the 'h'; a mark of imperfect education or humble social standing (source: Chambers Dictionary)

Be careful suggesting that. You'll get the trendies actually pronouncing it like that.

Whenever I've heard toffs pronounce it, the 'h' still doesn't appear, and it sounds like Clep'em.

Given the London Borough of Newham was created by combining West Ham and East Ham, should we call it New-ham, or should we be calling them West'um and East'um?

West Ham and East Ham have usually both been pronounced with the 'h' being silent in the London manner and the 't' serving as more the start of the second syllable than the end of the first, as in Wes'tam and Eas'tam, with 'am' rhyming with 'ram'. However, Newham, on the other hand, has the 'am' sounding more like 'um', as in Nyoo'um. I think this may be because the stress in Newham is much more on the first syllable than with the other two names, where the stress is roughly equal on both syllables.

 

[Francis]

Here's a few more for your amusement. Some I guess have already been mentioned.

Woolfardisworthy in Devon is pronounced Woolsery.

Norfolk is notorious for erratic, shortened pronunciations:

Hunstanton in Norfolk is usually Hunston.

Wymondham Norfolk is Windham.

Garboldisham is Garblesum

Happisburgh is Haysbro

Letheringsett is Larnsett.

Gillingham Kent is Jillingham but Gillingham Dorset is Gillingham with a hard G.

Euxton Lancs is Exton

Quernmore Nr Lancaster is Kwormer

A bowdlerized French pronunciation: Beaulieu Hants pronounced Bewlee. Dieulacres abbey near Leek is similarly distorted, I think to Jewlackers.

Frome, Somerset is said as Froom.

Aike nr Arram in East Yorkshire is called Yak-ovver-Arram.

Balquhidder in Scotland is Balwidder.

Fowey in Cornwall is Foy and Mousehole is Mowzel.

 

[matchmaker]

Here's a few more for your amusement. Some I guess have already been mentioned.

Woolfardisworthy in Devon is pronounced Woolsery.

Norfolk is notorious for erratic, shortened pronunciations:

Hunstanton in Norfolk is usually Hunston.

Wymondham Norfolk is Windham.

Garboldisham is Garblesum

Happisburgh is Haysbro

Letheringsett is Larnsett.

Gillingham Kent is Jillingham but Gillingham Dorset is Gillingham with a hard G.

Euxton Lancs is Exton

Quernmore Nr Lancaster is Kwormer

A bowdlerized French pronunciation: Beaulieu Hants pronounced Bewlee. Dieulacres abbey near Leek is similarly distorted, I think to Jewlackers.

Frome, Somerset is said as Froom.

Aike nr Arram in East Yorkshire is called Yak-ovver-Arram.

Balquhidder in Scotland is Balwidder.

Fowey in Cornwall is Foy and Mousehole is Mowzel.

Never heard it pronounced that way! Balquidder is what I've always said.

 

[AlbertBeale]

Hehe! Perhaps when they invented the name Newham, they should have made it New Ham so we wouldn't be in any doubt.

Possibly confusing (though probably not) pronunciation of Newham etc pales in comparison with the confusion caused by Harringay/Haringey. There was a perfect logic in it, but even so... (And, on a related subject, many people don't know the difference between Camden and Camden Town.)

 

[AlbertBeale]

Engine driver dad of a friend ( in steam days ) who went there for work referred to it as Haysham.
Perhaps ask someone who lives there.

At least antii-nuclear campaigners demonstrating against the power station there decades ago knew to pronounce if "Heesham"!

 

[DavidGrain]

Some names from the West Midlands that I have hear pronounced incorrectly on radio and TV.
Cradley and Cradley Heath is pronounced Cray-dley not with a short 'a'. These two adjacent places were in different counties and the railway station used to be Cradley Heath and Cradley but is now just Cradley Heath.

Two suburbs of Birmingham Lozells and Nechells pronouned Low-zells and Nee-chells respectively not Loz-'uls and Nech-uls

 

[InOban]

Never heard it pronounced that way! Balquidder is what I've always said.

I've always thought it was Balwhidder.

 

[woodhouse122]

had a ride to leeds from doncaster the other day on a 331 courtesy of the northern 10p tickets and was dissapointed that adwick was said wrong over the PA , it shoud be pronounced A -Dick ( the W remaining silent ) ,the guards never used to get it wrong

 

[MarkWiles]

I always thought the gentrifying classes referred to Clapham as "Cla'am" in the same way as I once heard someone refer to Moira in Leicestershire as "Mwa-rah", although I suspect they were being tongue-in-cheek.

Burpham sounds like it would be the ideal place to locate a gripe-water factory.

 

[vlad]

Doveridge, by the A50 south of Ashbourne is a typical example of how uncertain English pronunciation is.

I've often wondered, is it two syllables - Dove-ridge (as the bird) or Dove-ridge (as he plunged into a swimming bath)?
Or three; Dovv-er-idge or Doe-ver - idge?

I've only ever heard it pronounced with 3 syllables: dov-e-ridge (first syllable as the bird).

How about Sowerby Bridge? I was of the opinion the first word is pronounced sore-by but the Northern robot pronounces it Sour-by.

 

[hexagon789]

I've always thought it was Balwhidder.

It is Bal-hwidder

 

[randyrippley]

For many years, those south of Watford have insisted on pronouncing Clapham (as in Junction) Clap - 'am (ignorantly dropping the aspirate **) - whereas those of us in the know realise that "ph" is pronounced "ff". So it's Clay - Fam

** To drop one's aspirates - i.e. not to pronounce the 'h'; a mark of imperfect education or humble social standing (source: Chambers Dictionary)

Don't try that at the real Clapham in Yorkshire unless you want to get laughed at