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TRIVIA: Things you saw travelling on mainland European railways that you don't see today

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ChiefPlanner

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Went round Hamburg Maschen in / around 2010 , still using the hump and retarders for wagon load traffic

Magnificent lunch in the staff canteen - schnitzels with onion sauce. Nothing like Bescot I assure you.
 
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route101

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Interfrigo Wagons (yes - they even came to the UK)

Block loads of banana trains

Red capped Assistant Station Managers

SNCF despatchers with "guidons"


Pretty sure i seen these in Greece last month lying in sidings
 

citycat

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Just as a follow on to my previous post, this features memories of childhood trips to Poland by train to visit my grandparents and other Polish relations, featuring things you never see now. Some of you might find it interesting. We would go every two years.

Traveling on a ferry across the North Sea from Harwich Parkeston Quay to Hoek van Holland. The crossing would take six hours as part of the Day Continental service from Liverpool Street, and the ferry was the St George I believe. The boat train from London was usually Mk 1 stock and a class 31 or 37 at the head.

Arriving at the Hoek to find the station full of trains. There was the local one to Amsterdam of course, usually one other, and then our train, the Nord West express. As you walked down the platform, the train would consist of DB coaching stock in green or blue for Berlin, Hamburg, and Copenhagen. There was also PKP green couchette and seating coaches for Warsaw. However, as we only went every two years, my dad would pay extra for the very last coach at the head of the train. A very imposing dark green coach with ribbed sides, brass badging on the side, and lace curtains at the windows. The RZD Russian sleeping car from Hoek to Moscow via Berlin and Warsaw. Complete with stern looking sleeping car conductor.

Ex BR electric loco at the head of the consist, that used to run over Woodhead. Sorry, I don't know the class.

Sitting on the plush bottom bunk, looking out over the flat farmland of Holland as the train made its first stops at Rotterdam Schiedam and Utrecht Centraal. Little did I know then that as the train went from Rotterdam to Utrecht, it passed through the town station of Woerden, the Dutch town in which I now live.

Remembering the first of many border guards that would board the train during the journey, the first being at Hengelo I believe near the Dutch/West German border.

My dad doing ilicit money exchange with the sleeping car conductor, exchanging US dollars for Polish Zlotys. Also agreeing to help the conductor smuggle packs of 200 Marlboro in exchange for unlimited tea, served in glasses with exotic looking holders.

Other passengers changing into pyjamas for the entire trip.

The scary (for a little boy) passage between two coaches, via the concertina curtains and the bouncing corrugated step plates, with the track passing beneath.

Being awoken in the early hours of the morning by loud rapping on the door and the light being switched on, as the West German guards and then the East German guards did the passport check at Helmstedt.

Being awoken again by more passport checks at the East German/West Berlin border at Marienborn.

Watching out of the window as we traversed West Berlin at Hauptbahnhof and Zoo stations, and even more intense passport checks by East German guards.

Watching out of the window again as the train slowly passed through the Berlin Wall, seeing all the watch towers, barbed wire, no mans land, and the wall itself as the train passed through on an elevated section of track.

Arriving into Berlin Ostbahnhoff and seeing green DR coaching stock and Mitropa sleeping and restaurant cars on various other trains.

Remembering the grim and depressing looking blocks of flats near the station, so different from what I saw in West Berlin.

Remembering our Russian car and the PKP cars being shunted into a siding near Ostbahnhoff for a couple of hours with no explanations, and no one asking, it was just accepted, and then finally coupling up to some DDR stock and trundling to Frankfurt Oder for the final border check with Poland.

Remembering the Polish PKP locos that reminded me of class 82 and 83's from the WCML.

Finally arriving into Warsawa Gdansk station some 28 hours after leaving Liverpool Street, and seeing lots of massive black PKP steam locos puffing through the station pulling iron ore or coal wagons. And about twenty of my relatives waiting on the platform as arriving cousins from the West was a big event in those days.

The return journey was the same, except even more intense at Berlin Ostbahnhoff. As another poster said, they would run barking guard dogs under the train, use mirrors, lift all the seats in the compartments or all the mattresses in the sleeper. They would search the locomotive, and border guards would ride the train back to West Berlin.

I was in Berlin Ostbahnhoff a few weeks ago, and now it is just a sleepy Berlin station. It was strange to stand there and remember back to those Cold War days !
 
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30907

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Still some running: ÖBB have several, and indeed provided new facilities for them when Wien Hbf was built a few years back.
Overnight motorail also operates from Bratislava and Prague to Poprad, Kosice etc in Slovakia and seems well used - two dedicated sleepers on Prague - Poprad for example (there's also a once-weekly Prague day train).
I think there are others in the Balkans too.
 

Taunton

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My dad doing ilicit money exchange with the sleeping car conductor, exchanging US dollars for Polish Zlotys. Also agreeing to help the conductor smuggle packs of 200 Marlboro in exchange for unlimited tea, served in glasses with exotic looking holders.
By about 1991, during the hyperinflation, unopened packs of Marlboro (only that brand) became an alternative currency in Poland, especially for "tips". And tea in glasses with silver holders, from a samovar in the attendant's compartment, is still a standard and traditional feature of Russian sleeping cars.

Other passengers changing into pyjamas for the entire trip.
Russians from remote areas (although not the Moscow sophisticats, nor the soldiers in uniform who make up a notable proportion of the travellers) do this on the Trans Siberian. For days.

I was in Berlin Ostbahnhoff a few weeks ago, and now it is just a sleepy Berlin station. It was strange to stand there and remember back to those Cold War days !
Having made the transit through Berlin Friedrichstrasse in those times, for years after The Wall came down it interested me to look at the marks in the passageways where the various partitions etc for those processing rooms and little offices had left their shadow. They were all ripped out in 1991 but it was a long time before the place was completely retiled.
 

coupwotcoup

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I came a bit late to Euro train travel with my first trip being in 1988. Having taken my first TGV from Rouen to Montpellier,
which was rather surreal at the time, picked up the Barcelona Talgo from the latter and had no idea re the gauge change
outside Port Bou (it was two words in those days).

For the next six years the Talgo bar always ended in a party - could still smoke in there then - and, if I recall, there was
a proper galley serving real food.

Another thing from that era and I'm sure you guys will know, was the special train - different ticket needed from memory -
that connected Gare du Nord and Calais Hoverport of different stock to the normal carriages that served Calais Ville?
 

Taunton

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Another thing from that era and I'm sure you guys will know, was the special train - different ticket needed from memory -
that connected Gare du Nord and Calais Hoverport of different stock to the normal carriages that served Calais Ville?
There wasn't a line direct into the Calais hoverport, which needed a shuttle bus, but there was a branch into the Boulogne one. First trip (1976) only a 2-car red/white X2800 dmu, was provided with seats crushed together like a Pacer, everyone sat hunched up, and a few people had to stand all the way to Gare du Nord. And we complain about Northern today! At least for the return a week later a 4-car set was provided.

But a few years later the 5-car Turbotrains were transferred from Normandy to the run, they only did the hovercraft connections. Yellow livery. They had a pleasant ambience, and when a few years after that I rode in the imported Amtrak ones from New York to Albany, they were just the same inside and out. I was particularly impressed when, approaching the junction at Boulogne, it was suddenly announced (in French only) that weather was bad for Boulogne hoverport, and without any slackening of speed we continued a few miles to Calais Ville, where buses were already in place in the staion yard to shuttle us to the other hoverport, which faced north rather than west.

I doubt Northern could organise anything seamless like that.

You have to admire the BR hovercraft engineers who got the huge craft of a novel technology working reliably for years, all the way from the 1960s to the opening of the Channel Tunnel. SNCF built an equivalent couple as well, what a fiasco, their first was completely destroyed by fire while being serviced just a few days after its inaugural trip (!), the second never worked satisfactorily and was always sat on the pad at Boulogne being fiddled with, until they gave up.
 
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coupwotcoup

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I think it was around '89 or '90 and can recall, on arrival at GdL that a strike meant
yomping to GdN via la Republique. Had met up with a couple of girls who were going
back to Blighty and they missed the train - had to buy tickets - and distinctly recall
the train going directly into the Hoverport.

Personally I thought that the Hovercraft was a wonderful conveyance - despite the
noise - and was fast too. Did many a fag run to Calais on them back in the day and
was always fun seeing how many large Barcardi and Cokes we could demolish en route
during the 30-odd minute trip.

Having thought about it, it may well have been Boulogne - just wished I'd kept my
first copies of the ERT that I purchased in 1988.

Used to leave North East Spain for the French border at around 8.30pm, arrive at
Lyon 5am[ish] before arriving back home in East London about 1pm the next day.

Incredible to think that one can do London - Malaga in a day via rail these days!
 

citycat

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CFB73D90-AFB3-4EA0-B178-CD273E97A48B.jpeg Currently on holiday in the South of France and spotted two ex SNCF coaches with the inward opening doors that I described, stabled in the old Frejus St Raphael auto train yard. There seemed to be people living in those coaches.
 

citycat

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E74A167E-375E-41A2-A818-D9568560C60E.jpeg E74A167E-375E-41A2-A818-D9568560C60E.jpeg 90433CE1-8AD9-422B-8F24-1ADCE85EA37A.jpeg E74A167E-375E-41A2-A818-D9568560C60E.jpeg 90433CE1-8AD9-422B-8F24-1ADCE85EA37A.jpeg Regarding the Berlin wall, it was only this thick, but surrounded by no mans land of course.

The East German blocks of flats have been refurbished and look quite nice now.

Sorry, multiple images in error.
 
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gordonthemoron

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There was no Berlin Hauptbahnhof in West Berlin prior to the opening of the new station in 2005/6 (on the site of S-Lehrterbahnhof). Berlin Ostbahnhof was called Hauptbahnhof for a while, certainly in 1991. I thought the Boulogne Hoverport trains ran into Gare St Lazare but could be imagining it.

Berlin S and U bahnhofer in East Berlin with the guards on the platforms and trains not stopping
 

ChiefPlanner

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View attachment 50354 View attachment 50354 View attachment 50355 View attachment 50354 View attachment 50355 Regarding the Berlin wall, it was only this thick, but surrounded by no mans land of course.

The East German blocks of flats have been refurbished and look quite nice now.

Sorry, multiple images in error.


Known as "Plattenbau" - the ex DDR is now very much refurbished.

In my 1983 or so trip to Berlin , you could see stored class 52 locomotives , trainloads of Trabants with police guards , women cleaning carriage exteriors by hand with brushes and buckets, and lots pf pre-war painted signs on older buildings.
 

Cloud Strife

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Regarding the Berlin wall, it was only this thick, but surrounded by no mans land of course.

That's only the "wall" as the West saw it. In reality, that was only a small part of the border fortifications, or in East German language, the "Anti-fascist protection ramparts".

A little known fact is that East Germany was planning in the 1980's to remove most of the border defences, replacing it with a system that would have automatically detected the presence of intruders in the border zone. It's not known (as far as I know) exactly what these plans were, but it was supposed to transform the Grenzmauer 75 (what we think of as the Berlin Wall today) system into one that would be far less visually intrusive and labour intensive.
 

pemma

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That's only the "wall" as the West saw it. In reality, that was only a small part of the border fortifications, or in East German language, the "Anti-fascist protection ramparts".

A little known fact is that East Germany was planning in the 1980's to remove most of the border defences, replacing it with a system that would have automatically detected the presence of intruders in the border zone. It's not known (as far as I know) exactly what these plans were, but it was supposed to transform the Grenzmauer 75 (what we think of as the Berlin Wall today) system into one that would be far less visually intrusive and labour intensive.

I didn't post what you quoted.
 

MarcVD

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maxresdefault.jpg Something quite odd that's not likely to happen again is the mixed train plus plane service "the silver arrow" that linked Paris and London in pre-chunnel times.

A DMU left Paris Nord fort the small airport of Le Touquet where passengers boarded a plane for the Channel crossing. The airport had a siding which the train needed a clearance from the airport tower to enter on.
 

route101

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View attachment 50353 Currently on holiday in the South of France and spotted two ex SNCF coaches with the inward opening doors that I described, stabled in the old Frejus St Raphael auto train yard. There seemed to be people living in those coaches.

Seen a similar scene outside Thessaloniki , green carriages with people living in them .
 

AndrewE

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Thank-you all, your comments have prompted a few - no, lots - more memories!

Coming out of Yugoslavia into Austria: the border guards emptying the contents of disposal bins in the toilets (including sanitary items) all over the floor and then leaving them there - clearly nothing like as bad as coming out of east Germany though. Then the Austrians putting a heavy cleaning team right through the occupied train and refilling all the toilet paper, soap, etc. They couldn't replace the wrecked bog seats!
Seeing freight wagons being loose shunted in western Austria down sidings onto a chock that was welded to a shoe that sat on the rail. I was picturing the stresses in the wheels and axles as the whole wagon was braked to a stand by basically locking one wheel. "Crocodile" articulated electric locos on slow heavy freights.
A miniature narrow gauge crocodile hauling our mixed train on the Rhaetian railway when we in the passenger coaches were shunted quite a bit to pick up freight wagons... Cattle being unloaded from rail wagons and driven up through the town (Davos?) at the start of the next stage of their transhumance trip up into the mountains.
Going up the Austrian main line eastbound in winter on a heavy overnight train: the DC OLE had iced up and there was a blue arc that lit up a narrow strip of the whole valley and right up the mountain sides which progressed with the train
...plus more to come!
 
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ChiefPlanner

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Do not forget the site of wooden , blue painted Transfesa wagons carrying oranges / lemons / Spanish onions , via the Dover train ferry to such exotic places as Wavertree and Paddock Wood in the UK.

I once witnessed the Athens - Venice arrive at the latter - a midden of a train in hot weather , been on road for many hours loaded with exhausted , unwashed backpackers - the train was vigerously attacked by the FS cleaners who just swept out the muck onto the platforms in excellent order , tanked it , unblocked the many blocked "traps" and generally made it a bit more hygienic. No wonder the choice of travel was soon replaced with the gruelling "Magic Bus" ......life was a lot harder but character forming in those days.
 

Springs Branch

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30-odd years ago I lived and worked in northern Italy, in the region between Milan and the Swiss border.
Every so often I'd make use of the FNM's local trains to get to or from Milan Cadorna.

Amongst the FNM's other venerable, robust rolling stock were the antique, chestnut-brown EB.700 Elettromotrice (EMUs) - complete with three steep steps to climb up into the passenger saloon, wooden slat bench seats, chugging compressors and folding doors which could be opened at a passenger's whim whilst the train was moving.

These were probably just an Italian version of a 4-SUB, but the trains and some of FNM's smaller stations had a real pre-WW2 charm and character once you got away from Milan out toward Varese and Lago Maggiore

The FNM has now morphed into Trenord and Milan's suburban railways have been much developed and are slicker than the 1980s & 90s.

This article gives a perfect description of a journey north into Lombardy on one of these trains (it's in Italian, but a quick cut & paste into Google Translate will tell the story).


Bf Milano Cadorna, EB.700-17 [GFDL (http://www.gnu.org/copyleft/fdl.html) or CC BY 3.0
(https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/3.0)], by Falk2, from Wikimedia Commons
 

Groningen

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Transportation of mail by train. Mail was sorted in the train in Germany. In the Netherlands there were 2 kinds of wagons for mail. German diesel locomotive in the Netherlands. Most of all it is the kurswagen where the train is split in several directions in Germany. Nighttrains from and to the Netherlands.
 

InterCity:125

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LowLevel

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How very interesting. I had a most entertaining few trips on CD trains a few months back experiencing communist stations, red caps etc and the joys of happy hour in a proper buffet car when you are on the EC trains in Czech territory and can buy dark lager with schnitzel and boiled potatoes for a pittance. Superb way to go about things. I'd like to see more of Eastern Europe by rail.
 

30907

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How very interesting. I had a most entertaining few trips on CD trains a few months back experiencing communist stations, red caps etc and the joys of happy hour in a proper buffet car when you are on the EC trains in Czech territory and can buy dark lager with schnitzel and boiled potatoes for a pittance. Superb way to go about things. I'd like to see more of Eastern Europe by rail.
CD food is incredibly good value, my wife and I had lunch with a drink today for about £17 - for two. It's now 10pm and we're not hungry! Mine was certainly part prepared on board as well. Slovakia is equally good.
 

dutchflyer

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Any countries in Europe still allow smoking? Remember on a Budapest to Belgrade train in 2009 people were smoking .
Depends on how you define ''Europe''-as ''the continent'' might be more appropriate?
If its EU (that thing you voted against as Brexit) its a 100% NO-not allowed in any public transport. which does not mean that it is forcefully enforced everywhere. Perhaps yet another case of not really knowing what EU means/does? In fact most stations-as airports-now have smokers zones.
The still absurdly low prices for fags in countries like Ukrayna etc. mean most of their male populations are still hooked on, and though its forbidden on trains, it happens with about anyones consent/knowledge in the between the cars sections.
 
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