• Our booking engine at tickets.railforums.co.uk (powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!

Tweedbank to Aberdeen

Status
Not open for further replies.

David M

Member
Joined
16 Jan 2018
Messages
146
I seem to have confused Scotrail somewhat as I have 2 answers from them - 1 saying yes, the other saying no. My inclination is that this isn't possible but I'm looking to do
Friday Tweedbank to Dundee - Stay Dundee overnight
Saturday Dundee to Aberdeen - Stay Aberdeen overnight
Sunday Aberdeen to Tweedbank

Can I do this on a return ticket Tweedbank to Aberdeen?
 
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R

RailUK Forums

ForTheLoveOf

Established Member
Joined
7 Oct 2017
Messages
6,416
I seem to have confused Scotrail somewhat as I have 2 answers from them - 1 saying yes, the other saying no. My inclination is that this isn't possible but I'm looking to do
Friday Tweedbank to Dundee - Stay Dundee overnight
Saturday Dundee to Aberdeen - Stay Aberdeen overnight
Sunday Aberdeen to Tweedbank

Can I do this on a return ticket Tweedbank to Aberdeen?
You should be able to get an itinerary on the through fare for that (if necessary using the Advanced options on TrainSplit to lengthen the change time to overnight), so just book it that way and it's unquestionably valid.
 

David M

Member
Joined
16 Jan 2018
Messages
146
You should be able to get an itinerary on the through fare for that (if necessary using the Advanced options on TrainSplit to lengthen the change time to overnight), so just book it that way and it's unquestionably valid.

I can't enter more than 99 minutes as far as I can figure out - ideally, I would want to put it 1200 minutes!?
 

ForTheLoveOf

Established Member
Joined
7 Oct 2017
Messages
6,416
I can't enter more than 99 minutes as far as I can figure out - ideally, I would want to put it 1200 minutes!?
If there are no trains through the night (as is the case on almost all routes), 99 minutes will do! Alternatively you can enter change at: Dundee, add 99 minutes extra time there, and then put in 99 minutes extra time in the general options (underneath "maximum changes").
 

David M

Member
Joined
16 Jan 2018
Messages
146
Ok, thanks, I changed deaperture times and added 99 minutes at Dundee and it gave me this:
Tweedbank Edinburgh 55 mins 20:29 21:24
Edinburgh Dundee 1 hr 36 mins 22:11 23:47
Dundee (details) wait for 6 hrs, 55 mins. WARNING: LONG WAIT (info)
Dundee Aberdeen 1 hr 16 mins 06:42 07:58
This suggests I can break my journey overnight but my times would be leave Tweedbank at roughly 1030, arrive Dundee 1330 leave Dundee next day at roughly 1030 - can I still break my upward journey overnight on an off peak return?
 

ForTheLoveOf

Established Member
Joined
7 Oct 2017
Messages
6,416
Ok, thanks, I changed deaperture times and added 99 minutes at Dundee and it gave me this:
Tweedbank Edinburgh 55 mins 20:29 21:24
Edinburgh Dundee 1 hr 36 mins 22:11 23:47
Dundee (details) wait for 6 hrs, 55 mins. WARNING: LONG WAIT (info)
Dundee Aberdeen 1 hr 16 mins 06:42 07:58
This suggests I can break my journey overnight but my times would be leave Tweedbank at roughly 1030, arrive Dundee 1330 leave Dundee next day at roughly 1030 - can I still break my upward journey overnight on an off peak return?
You are permitted to recommence your journey on the second day of validity on the outward portion of an Off-Peak Return where it is not possible to complete the journey on the first day of validity. If you are leaving Tweedbank at 10:30 you clearly wouldn't qualify for that, given the frequency of services between Dundee and Aberdeen. I think you would have to leave Tweedbank in the evening, say 18:00 at the earliest, to legitimately claim you couldn't complete your journey. Journey planners implement this fairly accurately IMO.

Your other option is to ask Scotrail for specific permission to travel otherwise than in accordance with the usual terms of an Off-Peak Return. If they do give you such permission, it would be wise to have it recorded in some form (whether written or otherwise). Or otherwise you could split your tickets at Dundee, getting an Off-Peak Return from Tweedbank to Dundee and then Dundee to Aberdeen, or obtain Advances split at Dundee (these can be obtained at very reasonable prices on Scotrail, provided you book sufficiently in advance).
 

David M

Member
Joined
16 Jan 2018
Messages
146
Sort of what I thought - best just to go with return Tweedbank Dundee and return Dundee Aberdeen.
Thanks
 

Haywain

Veteran Member
Joined
3 Feb 2013
Messages
14,877
You are permitted to recommence your journey on the second day of validity on the outward portion of an Off-Peak Return where it is not possible to complete the journey on the first day of validity. If you are leaving Tweedbank at 10:30 you clearly wouldn't qualify for that, given the frequency of services between Dundee and Aberdeen. I think you would have to leave Tweedbank in the evening, say 18:00 at the earliest, to legitimately claim you couldn't complete your journey. Journey planners implement this fairly accurately IMO.
This is complete nonsense and has been debated many times on the forums. If the customer is entitled to break their journey, they are entitled to decide that they cannot complete it on the same day (for whatever reason they choose), regardless of the time they leave their origin station. Whether they are able to obtain an itinerary for their journey does not alter this fact.
 

ForTheLoveOf

Established Member
Joined
7 Oct 2017
Messages
6,416
This is complete nonsense and has been debated many times on the forums. If the customer is entitled to break their journey, they are entitled to decide that they cannot complete it on the same day (for whatever reason they choose), regardless of the time they leave their origin station. Whether they are able to obtain an itinerary for their journey does not alter this fact.
I used to be of that persuasion, but it appears that things have changed. Is there something that I have missed, that contradicts what NRE says (which is linked to or copied by almost all journey planners) about the conditions of Off-Peak (Period) Singles/Returns?
 

Haywain

Veteran Member
Joined
3 Feb 2013
Messages
14,877
I used to be of that persuasion, but it appears that things have changed. Is there something that I have missed, that contradicts what NRE says (which is linked to or copied by almost all journey planners) about the conditions of Off-Peak (Period) Singles/Returns?
I don't believe there has been any change or that there is any contradiction in this (from the page you linked to):
National Rail Enquiries said:
If the journey cannot be completed in this time, the ticket may be used to continue the journey on the following day. Unless otherwise indicated in the relevant restriction code, time restrictions apply as from the initial origin station on both days. The appropriate restrictions for the actual day on which travel is being undertaken apply (for example, it may be that if day 1 is on Sunday, no restrictions apply, but on day 2, the Monday-Friday restrictions apply). All travel must be completed by 04:29 in the morning after this second day.
As before, there is nothing to state why the journey cannot be completed or that the decision is for anyone other than the customer.
 

ForTheLoveOf

Established Member
Joined
7 Oct 2017
Messages
6,416
As before, there is nothing to state why the journey cannot be completed or that the decision is for anyone other than the customer.
As is no doubt clear, I am certainly a proponent of passengers' rights. But I think it would take a substantial stretch of the definition of the phrase "cannot be completed" to include the meaning that it cannot be completed because the passenger wants to break their journey en-route. It is, I'm afraid, something clearly intended for longer journeys which it is not reasonable to expect the passenger to complete in one day, if they set off later in the day.
 

Haywain

Veteran Member
Joined
3 Feb 2013
Messages
14,877
As is no doubt clear, I am certainly a proponent of passengers' rights. But I think it would take a substantial stretch of the definition of the phrase "cannot be completed" to include the meaning that it cannot be completed because the passenger wants to break their journey en-route. It is, I'm afraid, something clearly intended for longer journeys which it is not reasonable to expect the passenger to complete in one day, if they set off later in the day.
So, having said that you used to see it as the customers right, what has changed to make you feel otherwise? And what in the wording states that 'cannot be completed' states that it must be due to a lack of train service rather than because the customer cannot do what they wish in the available time?
 

Starmill

Veteran Member
Fares Advisor
Joined
18 May 2012
Messages
23,224
Location
Bolton
As before, there is nothing to state why the journey cannot be completed or that the decision is for anyone other than the customer.
I agree. Furthermore, I'm sure that the information raised that you've then quoted isn't new, as I've seen that before.

To quote; 'Nothing has Changed'.
 

reb0118

Established Member
Fares Advisor
Joined
28 Jan 2010
Messages
3,194
Location
Bo'ness, West Lothian
Can I do this on a return ticket Tweedbank to Aberdeen?

Yes, if that ticket was an anytime - however, it is cheaper to split @ Dundee with two off peaks. Off the top of my head you're looking at a £5 premium splitting over the through off peak fare.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Top