Uckfield Branch

[Aictos]

Just a thought but would not the Uckfield branch not be better served by a half hourly DMU shuttle between Oxted and Uckfield with the paths formerly used by the hourly DMU between London Bridge and Oxted being used by extra East Grinstead to London Bridge services or a new Oxted to London Bridge service using EMUs?

The line isn't going to be electrified any time soon and this would mean a improved service between Oxted and Uckfield not to mention no longer having to cater for DMUs between Oxted and London Bridge of course it would depend on Southern being able to source extra DC EMUs such as the Class 377s.

Yes it means Uckfield would lose it's direct connection to the capital but would gain better connections at Oxted, what do you guys think?

 

[RobShipway]

Just a thought but would not the Uckfield branch not be better served by a half hourly DMU shuttle between Oxted and Uckfield with the paths formerly used by the hourly DMU between London Bridge and Oxted being used by extra East Grinstead to London Bridge services or a new Oxted to London Bridge service using EMUs?

The line isn't going to be electrified any time soon and this would mean a improved service between Oxted and Uckfield not to mention no longer having to cater for DMUs between Oxted and London Bridge of course it would depend on Southern being able to source extra DC EMUs such as the Class 377s.

Yes it means Uckfield would lose it's direct connection to the capital but would gain better connections at Oxted, what do you guys think?

Well, when the new Siemens Thameslink trains come into service, Southern or whoever is running the franchise at that time would be getting back the class 377's that are on load to FCC at the moment.

In the shorter term all you would have available is either the remaining 5 car class 442's that are store in Eastleigh and have not been used by Southern or the SouthEastern stored class 508's if they have not all ready been taken.

 

[4SRKT]

Prior to electrification there was a 6-car DEMU every hour from Victoria that split at Oxted. In the peaks there were loads of extras from both Victoria and London Bridge including two 33-hauled trains, one each to EG and Uckfield.

After electrification the service was only between Oxted and Uckfield off-peak, sort of what you're proposing here. There was a half-hourly VEP between Victoria and East Grinstead, with a DEMU connection hourly at Oxted. Extra through DEMUs ran to Uckfield during the peaks from both Victoria and London Bridge. It wouldn't have been beyond the wit of man I don't suppose to attach a DEMU to a VEP between Victoria and Uckfield. Certainly there used to be two portioning trains from Waterloo to Salisbury/Eastleigh and Yeovil Junction/Bournemouth that ran 33/1+TC+VEP+VEP driven from the 33 cab as far as Basingstoke, where the 33+TC split off for Salisbury or Yeovil. Is this sort of thing possible now? Can a 170 run in multiple with a 377?

Here's a picture of the old Uckfield station south of the [former] level crossing to remind us of the old order.

 

[tempests1]

Just a thought but would not the Uckfield branch not be better served by a half hourly DMU shuttle between Oxted and Uckfield with the paths formerly used by the hourly DMU between London Bridge and Oxted being used by extra East Grinstead to London Bridge services or a new Oxted to London Bridge service using EMUs?

The line isn't going to be electrified any time soon and this would mean a improved service between Oxted and Uckfield not to mention no longer having to cater for DMUs between Oxted and London Bridge of course it would depend on Southern being able to source extra DC EMUs such as the Class 377s.

Yes it means Uckfield would lose it's direct connection to the capital but would gain better connections at Oxted, what do you guys think?

I can see the sense in what you are saying, but the Uckfield services are busy by the time they get to Oxted and they can rival the loadings on the East Grinstead line trains (off peak) so I believe they deserve direct trains. I imagine the local line users group would make some noise about it! On a random but related note has there ever been an occasion when a Class 377 has ever coupled up to a Class 170 and travelled together as they both have Dellner couplers?

 

[RobShipway]

I can see the sense in what you are saying, but the Uckfield services are busy by the time they get to Oxted and they can rival the loadings on the East Grinstead line trains (off peak). I imagine the local line users group would make some noise about it! On a random but related note has there ever been an occasion when a Class 377 has ever coupled up to a Class 170 and travelled together as they both have Dellner couplers?

The class 171 have been fitted with Dellner couplings, but this is only so that they can do Emergency Couplong with Class 377's, not sure though if this means thagt they can travel at line speed coupled together?

 

[4SRKT]

On a random but related note has there ever been an occasion when a Class 377 has ever coupled up to a Class 170 and travelled together as they both have Dellner couplers?

Not random at all, see my post above.

 

[tempests1]

Not random at all, see my post above.

I spend a long time doing my posts, as I type one fingered and yours wasn't there when I started 2 hours ago!!

 

[swt_passenger]

...In the shorter term all you would have available is either the remaining 5 car class 442's that are store in Eastleigh...

The whole 442 fleet has been with SN since early last year.

--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

The class 171 have been fitted with Dellner couplings, but this is only so that they can do Emergency Couplong with Class 377's, not sure though if this means thagt they can travel at line speed coupled together?

Rescue of a dead train only as you suspect. There is no control possible of the towed unit's traction package whether it's the DMU pulling the EMU or vice versa.

 

[yorksrob]

It wouldn't have been beyond the wit of man I don't suppose to attach a DEMU to a VEP between Victoria and Uckfield. .

The experimentally refurbed unit 205205 was the only one able to run in multiple with EMU's, so they would have had to have modified the others. By no means impossible though.

 

[southerner2174]

It wouldn't be possible the way it is, due to only parts of the line being double tracked, it only works in the peaks because some services are limited stop between oxted and uckfield and even then are often held at reds awaiting the single line to become available, also you would only be able to run a maximum of 4 car units since the bay at oxted can only accommodate a 4 car unit and that's with the front car deselected.
Also you would have the wrath of the local users groups to deal with!!!!

 

[OxtedL]

Losing the through service to London would probably destroy loadings, even if only off peak. If you don't run direct through to London and instead have to change at Oxted (a phenomenon seen on Sundays and occasionally during the festive period as a truncation of the normal off peak pattern) you take about 15 minutes longer into London, which is quite a lot proportionally.

The problems southerner2174 points out are all true as well.