UK sleeper trains

[alwaystouchout]

Hi,

Recently came across this article from the Independent regarding UK sleeper trains.

Aside from the Caledonian and Night Riviera sleepers, does anyone have information about what other sleeper routes operated during the days of British Rail?

Cheers.

 

[gordonthemoron]

70s & 80s AFAIR:

Newcastle-Kings Cross via Hartlepool
Aberdeen-Kings Cross via Newcastle
Edinburgh-Kings Cross via Newcastle
Newcastle-Kings Cross (joined one of the ex-scotland services)
Leeds-Kings Cross (joined one of the ex-scotland services)
Bristol-Glasgow/Edinburgh
Edinburgh-Inverness
Glasgow-Inverness/Aberdeen
Stranraer-Euston

 

[D6975]

70s & 80s AFAIR:

Newcastle-Kings Cross via Hartlepool
Aberdeen-Kings Cross via Newcastle
Edinburgh-Kings Cross via Newcastle
Newcastle-Kings Cross (joined one of the ex-scotland services)
Leeds-Kings Cross (joined one of the ex-scotland services)
Bristol-Glasgow/Edinburgh
Edinburgh-Inverness
Glasgow-Inverness/Aberdeen
Stranraer-Euston

To those you can add:
Euston - Manchester/Liverpool
Euston - Barrow
Euston - Holyhead
Victoria - Paris

probably some more as well

ps going even further back, there used to be sleepers out of Marylebone up the GC route to Leeds and Carlisle.

 

[Be3G]

Recently came across this article from the Independent regarding UK sleeper trains.

Note that the article in question is two years old, and the outlook for the sleepers is somewhat rosier now, with investment promised for the Caledonian.

 

[alwaystouchout]

Cheers, sounds like there was much more of a sleeper network back then. Were those services direct or did they stop at various stations along the route?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Note that the article in question is two years old, and the outlook for the sleepers is somewhat rosier now, with investment promised for the Caledonian.

Yeah I spotted it was rather old article. Haven't they have also separated the sleeper from the ScotRail franchise?

 

[gordonthemoron]

And the Cornish Riviera used to drop a sleeper coach off at Plymouth until fairly recently.

 

[jopsuk]

Yeah I spotted it was rather old article. Haven't they have also separated the sleeper from the ScotRail franchise?

At the moment it is stuill part of Scotrail, but it is out to tender (I think- or will be) as a seperate operation.

 

[anme]

There was also Bournemouth (?) - Glasgow/Edinburgh for a while, which joined with the Bristol - Glasgow/Edinburgh.

 

[gordonthemoron]

Have UK sleepers ever tried couchettes?

 

[matchmaker]

Have UK sleepers ever tried couchettes?

Not as such, although the first 3rd class sleepers introduced by the LMS were day coaches that converted into 4 berth sleeper compartments.

 

[Essexman]

And the Cornish Riviera used to drop a sleeper coach off at Plymouth until fairly recently.

The Night Riviera

 

[Liam]

Weren't there also Paddington-Fishguard/Milford Haven and Euston Holyhead sleepers?

There was also the Glasgow/Edinburgh-Aberdeen/Inverness sleepers.

 

[merlodlliw]

Weren't there also Paddington-Fishguard/Milford Haven and Euston Holyhead sleepers?

There was also the Glasgow/Edinburgh-Aberdeen/Inverness sleepers.

I only recall Holyhead to Euston sleepers, I have never known a LondonHolyhead sleeper,although they may have run, I recall in the 70s seeing an empty sleeping coach attached to an afternoon Euston/Holyhead on its way to the port,it went through Rhyl at 1630,It connected with a late evening helicopter flight from Dublin, but did not last long.Three key night Trains,Two from London and the 2220 Manchester to Holyhead connected with the then 0315 sailing which had cabins.

Also I recall a Euston/Barrow sleeper,Liverpool/Euston/Liverpool sleeper and Manchester/Euston/Manchester sleeper.

 

[deltic]

Going further back you could add

Manchester-Plymouth
Liverpool/Manchester to Glasgow
St Pancras to Glasgow and Edinburgh
St Pancras to Leeds?
Euston-Stranrear
Euston to Perth

Also various motorrail services used sleeper rollingstock -eg York to Inverness - Newhaven-Scotland

Not sure the Glasgow-Aberdeen service ever carried sleeper carriages

 

[gordonthemoron]

In 1988, there was Edinburgh-Inverness sleeper & and Glasgow-Inverness/Aberdeen sleeper, the glasgow train was split at Perth I think and the portion for Inverness was attached to the train from Edinburgh. I used the Edinburgh service during my resignation period from BR. Not sure there was an Aberdeen-Glasgow service though

 

[brompton rail]

Weren't there also Paddington-Fishguard/Milford Haven and Euston Holyhead sleepers?

There was also the Glasgow/Edinburgh-Aberdeen/Inverness sleepers.

I remember using the Milford Haven (from Haverfordwest) to Paddington sleeper, probably in the '70s. Having eaten a (too) rare beef sandwich before boarding, I'm afraid I didn't sleep but spent time searching for "hughie" in the inside of a porcelain receptacle. Much to the displeasure of my wife! On arrival at the Paddington Station Hotel (?name?) the head waiter in the posh BT Hotel was most churlish.

 

[38Cto15E]

Around 1970 I am sure that there was a Euston-Glasgow (St Enoch?) sleeper via Northampton, Leicester, Leeds, Carlisle etc.
I don't think there was a southbound, or maybe that went to St Pancras..

 

[30907]

I'm pretty certain there was a London-Glasgow sleeper via the GSW route even after services from St Pancras via Leeds went; I've certainly been on a night train that way (NOT the Stranraer).

There was a Paddington-Exeter car, and a Euston-Perth separate from the Royal Highlander - and a Brussels portion on the Night Ferry.

And if you go back to the 60's, London-Oban via Callander and Paddington-Birkenhead.

I think the one-way Holyhead may have lasted into the Mk3 era, which "did" for most other "one car" sleeper workings (including the car on the down Irish Mail).

On "couchettes" - I think both LMS and LNE third class cars were 4-berth without full bedding etc.

In short, there was a great variety of sleeper services, most of which have since gone. But then the same can be said of most of Western Europe.

 

[6Gman]

Long-distance sleepers often 'dropped' a coach or two at intermediate stations e.g. Preston, Exeter.

 

[deltic]

Looking at a 1960s timetable the sleeper services listed were

London Euston to

Oban
Stranraer Harbour
Perth
Inverness
Holyhead
Glasgow Central & St Enoch
Barrow in Furness/Corkickle
Carlisle
Preston
Manchester Picc
Liverpool Lime St

London Kings Cross to

Aberdeen
Fort William
Edinburgh
Newcastle - direct and via Sunderland

London Paddington to

Carmarthan
Penzance
Plymouth
Birkenhead
Milford Haven

London St Pancras to

Glasgow St Enoch
Leeds
Edinburgh

Birmingham to

Edinburgh Princess St
Glasgow Central

Bristol Temple Meads to

Newcastle

Edinburgh to

Inverness

Glasgow Buchanan St to

Inverness

Glasgow Central to

Liverpool Lime St
Manchester Exchange

Manchester Picc to

Plymouth

Motorrail trains that had sleeper accommodation were

London Holloway to Perth
London Marylebone to Glasgow
Birmingham Sutton Coldfield to Sterling and Inverness
Glasgow St Enoch to Eastbourne
Manchester - Boulogne
Newcastlle/York - Boulogne
Newcastle/Sheffield to Exeter
Newcastle/York to Inverness

Does anyone know about the services to Boulogne _ I assume they really went to Newhaven and you drove on to the ferry?

 

[SussexMan]

Does anyone know about the services to Boulogne _ I assume they really went to Newhaven and you drove on to the ferry?

No idea about any sleeper service but I can't see it going Newhaven to Boulogne. I think Newhaven ferries have only ever gone to Dieppe.

 

[alwaystouchout]

Looking at a 1960s timetable the sleeper services listed were

London Euston to

Oban
Stranraer Harbour
Perth
Inverness
Holyhead
Glasgow Central & St Enoch
Barrow in Furness/Corkickle
Carlisle
Preston
Manchester Picc
Liverpool Lime St

London Kings Cross to

Aberdeen
Fort William
Edinburgh
Newcastle - direct and via Sunderland

London Paddington to

Carmarthan
Penzance
Plymouth
Birkenhead
Milford Haven

London St Pancras to

Glasgow St Enoch
Leeds
Edinburgh

Birmingham to

Edinburgh Princess St
Glasgow Central

Bristol Temple Meads to

Newcastle

Edinburgh to

Inverness

Glasgow Buchanan St to

Inverness

Glasgow Central to

Liverpool Lime St
Manchester Exchange

Manchester Picc to

Plymouth

Motorrail trains that had sleeper accommodation were

London Holloway to Perth
London Marylebone to Glasgow
Birmingham Sutton Coldfield to Sterling and Inverness
Glasgow St Enoch to Eastbourne
Manchester - Boulogne
Newcastlle/York - Boulogne
Newcastle/Sheffield to Exeter
Newcastle/York to Inverness

Does anyone know about the services to Boulogne _ I assume they really went to Newhaven and you drove on to the ferry?

London Holloway?

 

[reb0118]

London Holloway to Perth

Did this one run via Cornton (Near Stirling) to facilitate any cross border Anglo-Scottish female prisoner transfer?

 

[deltic]

London Holloway?

It was apparently the old cattle dock platforms

 

[bishdunster]

There was also Bournemouth (?) - Glasgow/Edinburgh for a while, which joined with the Bristol - Glasgow/Edinburgh.

Not Bournemouth, but the Brockenhurst -Scotland motorail service I am pretty sure

 

[6Gman]

Corkickle is an interesting destination!

I presume that this was something to do with sleeper stock not being permitted on the section north of Corkickle, which has its own loading gauge issues?

 

[30907]

Does anyone know about the services to Boulogne _ I assume they really went to Newhaven and you drove on to the ferry?

I think Dover Town (officially goods-only).
Amend that: just found 1959 SR wtt for London East and it was Dover Marine.

And on the question of couchettes (prev. post) - 1958 NER timetable says sleepers on this were 4-berth.

 

[Eagle]

Not Bournemouth, but the Brockenhurst -Scotland motorail service I am pretty sure

The non-motorail overnight services started from Poole though (as did most IC services).

 

[reb0118]

Barrow in Furness/Corkickle

Corkickle is an interesting destination!

I presume that this was something to do with sleeper stock not being permitted on the section north of Corkickle, which has its own loading gauge issues?

Would this be to do with Whitehaven Tunnel or further north?

As Whitehaven Bransty is less than a mile away you could say Corkickle for Whitehaven.

 

[30907]

Would this be to do with Whitehaven Tunnel or further north?

As Whitehaven Bransty is less than a mile away you could say Corkickle for Whitehaven.

Whitehaven tunnel: there are gauging issues between Maryport and Carlisle IIRC but the train was to Workington only.

My 1958 LM tt says it had a "new type sleeper with full bedding and washing facilities" which would have (I think) been a 63' Mk I vehicle (see previous post on couchettes).

The up sleeper was attached at Barrow so the car must have been worked ECS Corkickle-Barrow for servicing (not really surprising!).

Slightly OT: the sleeper and the Whitehaven TPO were separate trains north of Preston.