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Uniforms - formal vs. informal?

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bramling

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Hi vis jackets worn when not required are a pain - people will be a lot more desensitized to them as a result.

I’ve heard it said that an immaculately clean hi-vi tells its own story. And in my experience there’s definitely some degree of truth to this!
 
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Mintona

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I’ve never been given a name badge at my current TOC. But I do wear a little pin that says ‘train driver’ so people know what I do. If they look.
 

Bromley boy

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I’ve heard it said that an immaculately clean hi-vi tells its own story. And in my experience there’s definitely some degree of truth to this!

Mine languishes in my bag apart from on the rare occasions I have to do some real work and walk around in depots or on the ballast.

It sits alongside the plastic goggles I’ve also been issued, for those occasions where I’m expected to personally de-ice the juice rail. o_O.
 
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Ken H

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Many railway staff wear clip-on ties which avoids that issue, but how long does it really take to do a tie up properly?

Personally I think there’s value in them. Done properly it’s an item of uniform which is very company specific, and personally I’d prefer this than a name badge. Likewise a decent design should be readily identifiable from a distance.

I’d add that some of the most problematic punters to deal with can be some of the suited commuter types, some of whom play on the fact that they think they’re superior. Wearing a shirt and tie, in my experience, puts a stop to that.
If I was in a customer facing role I would do clip on. You dont want to be wearing a proper tie if it kicks off, perhaps when tackling fare evasion. Police do clip-ons for that very reason.
 

Ken H

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There should be a cotton top. man made fibre can get very sweaty if its at all warm. Whats wrong with a blue open neck shirt, and a tie for those who want to wear one. Add in a uniform jumper and waterproof jacket. And some chinos. Black shoes or trainers. (Some jobs may need steel toe cap boots, I suppose)

Do you need a different uniform for guards vs drivers vs station staff? probably not.

But it should still look presentable at the end of a long shift.

Do railway staff have to wash their own uniforms or is it done by their employer?
 

bramling

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Do you need a different uniform for guards vs drivers vs station staff? probably not.
I’m my experience, absolutely yes. During incidents it allows the relevant staff to be quickly picked out. (Yes I know that this isn’t foolproof, but it at least allows the person to be picked out in a crowd - at which point their identity can be confirmed definitely).

Imagine something like a defective train, twenty minutes in. Lots of people around by this time, various staff (probably a few off-duty ones as well as on-duty). The most important person is the driver, you don’t really want to be wasting 5 or 10 minutes mooching around like a lemon going up to various people asking “are you the driver?”.
 

Ken H

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I’m my experience, absolutely yes. During incidents it allows the relevant staff to be quickly picked out. (Yes I know that this isn’t foolproof, but it at least allows the person to be picked out in a crowd - at which point their identity can be confirmed definitely).

Imagine something like a defective train, twenty minutes in. Lots of people around by this time, various staff (probably a few off-duty ones as well as on-duty). The most important person is the driver, you don’t really want to be wasting 5 or 10 minutes mooching around like a lemon going up to various people asking “are you the driver?”.
when we do fire drills at work, the fire marshalls don pink high vis vests with 'FIRE MARSHALL' on the back.
pink because warehouse staff wear yellow ones.
so we all know who the fire marshalls are

So why not have it that all staff carry a high viz vest with DRIVER, GUARD, FITTER or whatever on the back to designate their function when there is an incident. Or do they do that already?
 

bramling

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when we do fire drills at work, the fire marshalls don pink high vis vests with 'FIRE MARSHALL' on the back.
pink because warehouse staff wear yellow ones.
so we all know who the fire marshalls are

So why not have it that all staff carry a high viz vest with DRIVER, GUARD, FITTER or whatever on the back to designate their function when there is an incident. Or do they do that already?

In some cases yes, however it would need to stand out from a distance. It’s much easier to pick someone out based on, for example, the colour of their shirt, or the number of bands on a hat - or even the type of equipment bag they have with them.
 

MetroCar4058

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I hope Northern insist on their staff working the new Civity services wear these smarter uniforms, to help improve the brand image. At the end of the day, these services are competing with TPE and VT on some routes

If Northern is anywhere like some places I know, you've got to put uniform policy change past the union. We all know how good that relationship is and that rigid rule will probably not go down well :lol:
 

ooo

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I can see an issue with names (e.g. someone identifying a member of staff outside work and attacking or otherwise abusing them), but I would certainly support the idea of "PCV badges", i.e. a badge with a unique identification number such that a member of staff can be identified in the event of a complaint being necessary.

Or if you like things formal, numbered epaulettes? :)
I think name badges are particularly useful when a member of staff speaks another language as it can be shown easily with a flag on their badge
 

matt_world2004

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My uniform hasn't been replaced in six years because the manager didnt replace it for a few years. So it appeared the annual uniform budget for 66 staff was £1100 now a successor manager cannot get the uniform replaced because previous managers only spent £1100 and they cannot get the budget increased.
 
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The new South Western Railway uniform is fantastic. It's much better fitting and makes you actually look the part.
 

hooverboy

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a decent pair of well made knee length shorts should be ok with a polo. The uniform needs to be practical and if the weather is hot shorts should be ok in my mind. Personally I think all drivers should be wearing full PPE at all times ;)
come on, this is the railway...you aren't going on holiday in dubai!

airline style dress will do quite nicely.
1)properly shined shoes
2)properly ironed trousers/ skirt )with "formal" type black or tan tights if ladies prefer.
3)properly ironed lightweight shirt/blouse-short or long sleeve of either neutral or company colour/emblazoned.
4)blazer/waistcoat optional
5)company tie/cravatte optional depending on weather/duties. if left off then company Logo's ID badge must be visible
6)ought to also say as well as presentable, said uniform needs to be workable in emergency/evacuation routines....so definitely flat shoes or boots/ perhaps reinforced(but not steel) toes.

(ps as for not having your uniform replaced for 6 years, frankly that is not on.
I also do a customer facing job and I don't visit the same customer the following year with the same shirt.)
At least have a word with your HR/PR departments stating that it looks unprofessional to have old and delapidated workwear
 
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Bromley boy

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come on, this is the railway...you aren't going on holiday in dubai!

Quite right.

On the rare occasions I wear shorts, the sun is out, I’m not at work, and the words “Albacrombie and Fitch” are on the label.

Shorts are not a good look in any working environment. Neither are short sleeved formal shirts, for that matter.
 

hooverboy

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If I was in a customer facing role I would do clip on. You dont want to be wearing a proper tie if it kicks off, perhaps when tackling fare evasion. Police do clip-ons for that very reason.
quite.

clip on's are there just in case they get yanked/caught on something.
at least they just drop off rather than strangle you
 

virgintrain1

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come on, this is the railway...you aren't going on holiday in dubai!

airline style dress will do quite nicely.
1)properly shined shoes
2)properly ironed trousers/ skirt )with "formal" type black or tan tights if ladies prefer.
3)properly ironed lightweight shirt/blouse-short or long sleeve of either neutral or company colour/emblazoned.
4)blazer/waistcoat optional
5)company tie/cravatte optional depending on weather/duties. if left off then company Logo's ID badge must be visible
6)ought to also say as well as presentable, said uniform needs to be workable in emergency/evacuation routines....so definitely flat shoes or boots/ perhaps reinforced(but not steel) toes.

(ps as for not having your uniform replaced for 6 years, frankly that is not on.
I also do a customer facing job and I don't visit the same customer the following year with the same shirt.)
At least have a word with your HR/PR departments stating that it looks unprofessional to have old and delapidated workwear
Here here.
 

hooverboy

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Quite right.

On the rare occasions I wear shorts, the sun is out, I’m not at work, and the words “Albacrombie and Fitch” are on the label.

Shorts are not a good look in any working environment. Neither are short sleeved formal shirts, for that matter.
short sleeved formal shirts work perfectly fine in hot countries!(I am wearing one now as it happens..in spain...on business)

the dress code if anything when you are somewhere severely hot most of the time is quite a bit more relaxed!
managerial level still expected suited and booted/ or short formal shirt
techies/engineers are coming in polo shirts
 

Mugby

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I've noticed one or two EMT platform staff at Sheffield wearing peaked caps.

I havn't seen them anywhere else, are they an EMT issue or is it just a Sheffield thing?
 

vikingdriver

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As much as love sweat dripping off my body, running down the legs on my trousers etc on really hot days in a our sauna like cabs, I do tend to wear shorts to mitigate against this. Sort the air con so it works and is reliable or allow shorts to be worn. No wonder shorts are on some TOCs uniform lists.
 

hooverboy

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Especially train crew working intercity services
if you really wanted minimum dress code, I suppose you could get away with (black,charcoal,grey or blue)chino's instead of formal trousers.
They can still be quite presentable.
 

hooverboy

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As much as love sweat dripping off my body, running down the legs on my trousers etc on really hot days in a our sauna like cabs, I do tend to wear shorts to mitigate against this. Sort the air con so it works and is reliable or allow shorts to be worn. No wonder shorts are on some TOCs uniform lists.
probably sounds a bit daft, but in the event of you having to clamber up/down ladders in emergencies or signalling etc, what good are shorts?
you are more susceptible to grazing/knocking etc etc...

surely this has been brought up by 'elf and safety as a need for better PPE?
 

LowLevel

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I have to wear rubbish polyester shirts and trousers. Consequently when it's hot I look like I've been swimming in them and I certainly cannot be bothered to do my job properly. Provide proper uniform items or accept staff doing half a job at best.

If I have to work on a class 158 with failed air conditioning I should be able to wear whatever I wish or fail the train. Funnily enough large numbers of our crews in last year's lengthy heat wave were denied the right to wear shorts (unlike sister TOCs previously who had the same uniform because it didn't make the corporate brand) and therefore refused to set foot on any unit with failed air conditioning which caused mass train cancellations. At one point a certain hub station was littered with trains which drivers and guards had flat refused to work on and that was that.
 

vikingdriver

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probably sounds a bit daft, but in the event of you having to clamber up/down ladders in emergencies or signalling etc, what good are shorts?
you are more susceptible to grazing/knocking etc etc...

surely this has been brought up by 'elf and safety as a need for better PPE?

Not long after starting I tripped over walking in the cess in my work trousers (the cheap, retains all water when walking in a siding in the rain leading to a really miserable day and wet seat, school boy type) and cut my leg open so I don't think wearing shorts would make a difference to the outcome!
 

Bromley boy

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short sleeved formal shirts work perfectly fine in hot countries!(I am wearing one now as it happens..in spain...on business)

Not ideal, but recoverable.

From my city days, I would advise as follows: for the love of God, do not combine a short sleeved shirt with a tie. That would be a one way path to sartorial destruction.

I hope you’re wearing Church’s? Preferably Oxfords, polished to a high shine. In a hot country Burwood-glossed-tan-leather brogues, or even loafers, might just about be acceptable. ;)
 

vikingdriver

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I have to wear rubbish polyester shirts and trousers. Consequently when it's hot I look like I've been swimming in them and I certainly cannot be bothered to do my job properly. Provide proper uniform items or accept staff doing half a job at best.

If I have to work on a class 158 with failed air conditioning I should be able to wear whatever I wish or fail the train. Funnily enough large numbers of our crews in last year's lengthy heat wave were denied the right to wear shorts (unlike sister TOCs previously who had the same uniform because it didn't make the corporate brand) and therefore refused to set foot on any unit with failed air conditioning which caused mass train cancellations. At one point a certain hub station was littered with trains which drivers and guards had flat refused to work on and that was that.

I remember one of the drivers at our depot would take his top off and drive in just his shorts. Nothing quite like a 158 with failed aircon. Well maybe a 166...
 

bionic

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I’m my experience, absolutely yes. During incidents it allows the relevant staff to be quickly picked out. (Yes I know that this isn’t foolproof, but it at least allows the person to be picked out in a crowd - at which point their identity can be confirmed definitely).

Imagine something like a defective train, twenty minutes in. Lots of people around by this time, various staff (probably a few off-duty ones as well as on-duty). The most important person is the driver, you don’t really want to be wasting 5 or 10 minutes mooching around like a lemon going up to various people asking “are you the driver?”.

When I'm dealing with a defective train or other situation the last thing I need is a load of people (apart from other drivers or fitters who might actually be able to help) coming up to me and asking stupid questions. I'm the driver and I'm dealing with it. The more daft questions you ask the longer it will take.

airline style dress will do quite nicely.
1)properly shined shoes
2)properly ironed trousers/ skirt )with "formal" type black or tan tights if ladies prefer.
3)properly ironed lightweight shirt/blouse-short or long sleeve of either neutral or company colour/emblazoned.
4)blazer/waistcoat optional
5)company tie/cravatte optional depending on weather/duties. if left off then company Logo's ID badge must be visible
6)ought to also say as well as presentable, said uniform needs to be workable in emergency/evacuation routines....so definitely flat shoes or boots/ perhaps reinforced(but not steel) toes.

Yes, because when we are getting up at 0245 for an early shift we are really going to be ironing shirts, pressing trousers and polishing shoes!

Shorts are not a good look in any working environment. Neither are short sleeved formal shirts, for that matter.
I disagree 100% with this remark. I'd wear shorts all year round if we had the climate and the company issued them. :D
 
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