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Discussion in 'Traction & Rolling Stock' started by AJP, 5 Feb 2006.
From the following which is better..
Out of those I would prefer HST, but surely you have missed so many options (90,47,57 etc.) that it is hard to give an honest opinion cratch:
I just want to no rom them locos thats all
HSTs all the way.
A HST is not a loco
It's a power car , So it's make it a unit
We all know he means a Class 43.
87s but if like Laverack said if 90s were there thats would be my choice.
So whats this then (??) :neutral:
Oh, and before you say
"thats 2 'powercars' so i doesnt count as a loco", in Russia etc, they have locomotives that have two or even three 'parts' to then, each containing a power unit etc., but it is still classified as one locomotive.
*cough* Skodas of the railways *cough*
glorified luggage racks, hst's.
when they came out they were nicknamed trams.
HST's/class 43's what ever sound good,look good they are DEFINATLY not a unit:@
87s I voted for as HSTs, 86s, 90s were common everywhere else but WCML where as the 87s were unique.
91's are unique to the ECML yet everyone hates them lol!!
I don't hate them! They have great horns
TBH i can't vote...
Where are the 47's????
HSTs all the way!
YAY!! Im with ya!
HSTs for me!!!
It's gotta be HSTs for me!
Though aren't they Class 43s and not DMUs?
Saying a Power car is a Class 43 is no different to saying a Buffet car is a class 40. It is a unit with no set number and 2 power cars at each end... But one is still a proper train it is just not a loco.
and saying one is a loco because two were back to back on the bedz one night last week is a bit like saying a 150 is a loco if it shunts a failed 158 about...
Close but I'm gonna have to go for the HST!
87's all the way (though I like 86's too) HST's are a bit bland IMO,OK they make a loud noise etc, but they dont have the same "passion" as some earlier loco's- But if i had the choice of a 57 or HST, I know I'd choose the Valenta. I had the MTU one (004) PC the other day, and by gum is it dull.
Can I just say that we could say the following;
A HST - A rake of coaches with a class 43 'HST' locomotive at either end
A class 43 - A locomotive which forms a HST
But Class 43 is a Warship but they had all gone by the times the TOPS system was introduced and a power car is a power car...
The sleeper does not use Top and Tailed 57s. It is just one at the front a 'proper loco hauled train' and it is even shunted about at Plymouth a HST is a fixed formation unit!
I had a top tailed 47, Damm it was a unit. HSTs 43's whatever are more of a Locomotive than a AC electric will ever be.
Surely you realise HST sets are not fixed formation. They can have carriages added or taken off easily enough, just preferably not whilst in service.
Get ready to say goodbye to the shunting at Plymouth too, that dedicated portion goes at the end of March. As for the FGW sleeper being 'proper' locomotive haulage, I agree in terms of it being traditional haulage, but a HST is still loco-hauled, just push-pull.
In any case, I do believe this argument over HSTs being loco-hauled goes on far too often, but here's my final thought on it: HSTs are loco-hauled. Fact, end of story.
As for everyone hating 91s, I'll raise my hand there. It's still loco-haulage, but I guess it's the coffins it pulls behind it that I don't like.
Metcam, how could you not like 43004? I had it for haulage again today. Absolutely beast. We got held in the tunnel for platform clearance at Newport, so taking off again, the engine echoed down past me nicely. Taking off from Newport was a satisfying sound too! But I find it hard for someone to say it was dull. EMUs are dull, 004 sounds far more interesting than a 317!
Hmm - the whole HST is a unit argument can be applied nicely to the through wired 37s and Mk2s used on Leeds to Carlisle trains a little while ago.
There's a locomotive at both end. Both work at the same time. The locomotives can come off, move around, and work independently of coaches and each other. The locomotives can if need be haul other things. Label the differences if you will. As far as I can tell, there aren't many between a proper through wired 37 and coaches set and a HST set
And HSTs can run in various forms, they don't actually need to have 2 powercars on a train at all, they can run without anything else too.
You can run small HSTs, big HSTs, HSTs with a few coaches, HSTs with no coaches, first class only HSTs, standard only HSTs.
You can mention the corridor connection. Lots of locomotives had corridor connections in the 60s.
The office was merely in place of a cab, and is gone now in any case.
What is the difference between your coupled TNT through wired 37s on a rake of Mk2s then, with a HST?
Nothing? Thanks for putting some good points up AlexS, sums up the 'HST is loco-haulage' argument well.
So there's some smart Midlanders around too? *JOKE!*
And even if you think one is a loco that does not make me take any more interest in them, they are a unit, they are boring, they are just a HST... But I do think they are a 'proper train' and something nice to travel in but they are just a unit with a power car at each end...