Wales is to ban travel from COVID hotspots

[MattA7]

The Welsh government has announced a travel ban on traveling to Wales from high risk parts of the UK.

Covid: Wales to ban people coming from UK hotspots

People from areas with high coronavirus rates will be banned from travelling to Wales from Friday.

www.bbc.co.uk

People from parts of England, Scotland and Northern Ireland that have high rates of coronavirus will be prevented from travelling to Wales from Friday.
First Minister Mark Drakeford said the move was needed "to prevent the spread of infection within Wales and to other areas of the UK".
It follows a row between the Welsh and UK governments about whether areas in England should be subject to travel restrictions.

 

[kristiang85]

I'd love to see how this is going to be enforced.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I'd love to see how this is going to be enforced.

The Police enforced it during lockdown, they can do it again.

I don't see why he is pushing Bojo to do it, it's none of Bojo's business. If he wants a Welsh law he should make his own.

 

[Carlisle]

At times it’s extremely hard to believe Mr Drakeford is actually part of a unionist rather than nationalist political party

 

[Bletchleyite]

At times it’s extremely hard to believe Mr Drakeford is actually part of a unionist rather than nationalist political party

I just Googled him, and I'll be honest, I thought he was Plaid Cymru, not Labour as he is!

 

[duncanp]

I'd love to see how this is going to be enforced.

And it would be easy to circumvent.

If travelling from Manchester or Birmingham, you could buy a train ticket to Shrewsbury, for example, and then a separate ticket from Shrewsbury to your destination in Wales.

So if anyone asks, you have travelled from Shrewsbury, which is not (yet) a COVID-19 hotspot.

Similarly with some of the cross border bus services.

And it is no surprise whatsoever that Jeanette Krankie is supportive of Mark Drakeford's intentions.

 

[SquireBev]

Good

 

[bramling]

At times it’s extremely hard to believe Mr Drakeford is actually part of a unionist rather than nationalist political party

To be fair, he's already got travel banned from the locked down parts of Wales, so this is only levelling things up. Whether we agree with it is another matter, however it is only consistent with what's going on within Wales (AIUI).

 

[kristiang85]

The Police enforced it during lockdown, they can do it again.

Well it was a bit easier back then, as the whole of the UK was under lockdown.

But how on earth are they going to tell who has legitimately driven or got a train from non-hotspot places?

 

[bramling]

Well it was a bit easier back then, as the whole of the UK was under lockdown.

But how on earth are they going to tell who has legitimately driven or got a train from non-hotspot places?

I suspect it will be police going round cars in honeypot areas like Snowdonia. It's presumably pretty readily viable to check where a car is registered.

Sadly I wouldn't be surprised to see some vigilante assistance, for example cars with English places on the number plate being keyed. I seem to remember reading this certainly occurred in a few places last time.

 

[Mag_seven]

Its all starting to get rather political now isn't it. I can see calls for similar bans from areas of low infection in England. The national unity that we had in April is quickly evaporating.

 

[bramling]

Its all starting to get rather political now isn't it. I can see calls for similar bans from areas of low infection in England. The national unity that we had in April is quickly evaporating.

I'm not sure we had much national unity in the first place. Our politicians have really let us down on this - the one time we really needed them to work together they have failed.

In Drakeford's case to be fair I think this has largely been with sound motives (though again he is heavily banking on vaccine). The jury's out in Sturgeon's case.

 

[ainsworth74]

Sadly I wouldn't be surprised to see some vigilante assistance, for example cars with English places on the number plate being keyed. I seem to remember reading this certainly occurred in a few places last time.

More fool them! My car number plate is CE which identifies it as being Cardiff despite very much being owned and driven by myself who very much does not live in Wales!

 

[MDB1images]

Good luck in policing these type of 'soundbite' travel bans.

 

[duncanp]

More fool them! My car number plate is CE which identifies it as being Cardiff despite very much being owned and driven by myself who very much does not live in Wales!

And there could be quite a cottage industry in false number plates too.

 

[birchesgreen]

Its all starting to get rather political now isn't it. I can see calls for similar bans from areas of low infection in England. The national unity that we had in April is quickly evaporating.

Well you can call for it i don't see how that could ever be enforced. I went from Brum (High) to Kidderminster (Medium) today, maybe they could install a checkpoint at Stourbridge station?

 

[Trackman]

The Police enforced it during lockdown, they can do it again.
...

They did as well.
Remember those people in a viral video on the North Wales coast? 'Boris said we could go the beaches' - Police reply - 'Not in Wales though' and carted away..
Plus reports of those ever-keen North Wales traffic cops stopping all and sundry.

 

[bramling]

Well you can call for it i don't see how that could ever be enforced. I went from Brum (High) to Kidderminster (Medium) today, maybe they could install a checkpoint at Stourbridge station?

In Wales it would be quite easy - a good proportion of honeypotters would be non-creative enough to travel via the likes of A5 or A55, so they only need to put in a checkpoint somewhere. I think that's along the lines of what was done last time, plus some police presence at popular car parks like for Snowdon.

There aren't *that* many ways of getting to the popular areas if sticking to major routes, and most people aren't going to go to the bother of planning a route that involves minor roads.

 

[WelshBluebird]

I suspect this is more of a surprise for those in England rather than those in Wales or those of us in England but with Welsh ties.
The areas in Wales under local lockdown have had travel restrictions from the start of the local lockdowns. That isn't new.
So based on that point, it does seem mad that someone from Pontypridd can't travel the 30 miles to Brecon but someone from say Liverpool can.

Of course, as with a lot of this, enforcement is another kettle of fish! In terms of car licence plates - whilst the plates themselves may not be too reliable (as ainsworth74 has pointed out), can't the police just run a check on where the registered keeper for the car is from? Granted it may not be that person driving it, but the driver would have had to get the car from that person somehow. And as it is a legal requirement to keep your address with the DLVA up to date - you can't really complain much if you have moved but not updated your details.

 

[bramling]

I suspect this is more of a surprise for those in England rather than those in Wales or those of us in England but with Welsh ties.
The areas in Wales under local lockdown have had travel restrictions from the start of the local lockdowns. That isn't new.
So based on that point, it does seem mad that someone from Pontypridd can't travel the 30 miles to Brecon but someone from say Liverpool can.

Yes to be fair I don't think it's an unreasonable aspiration if that's what the position is for Welsh people.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

Even last time with "stay local" and the 2-mile and 5-mile WG rules, there were never checks at the border.
As it stands at the moment in restricted Welsh counties, you can go anywhere for food/work/education, even into England, which many do up here.
Cars also can be registered anywhere - mine has a Chester registration (supplied from new by a Welsh dealer).
Then there's north-south routes which dip in and out of Wales, and places which are Wales on one side of the road and England on the other.

Meanwhile, travel writer Simon Calder has had trolling and abuse from Welsh residents for suggesting English people visit mid-Wales and the Cambrian coast via Shrewsbury, something Visit Wales was keen to promote until today..
This is via non-restricted areas and routes, avoiding the lockdown areas in north and south Wales.
This is something which is still perfectly possible and legal from at least Tier 1 areas of England.

If they are not careful, the government (either or both) are going to end up looking stupid on this one.
Boris is right not to get into the legalities, advising no inessential travel should be enough.
It's not as though the peak tourist season is approaching.

Meanwhile the Welsh infection rate has jumped significantly in most areas today, to 946.

 

[adc82140]

They did as well.
Remember those people in a viral video on the North Wales coast? 'Boris said we could go the beaches' - Police reply - 'Not in Wales though' and carted away..
Plus reports of those ever-keen North Wales traffic cops stopping all and sundry.

But that was when there were national measures in England. I have a private plate on my car which doesn't give any indication where I'm from. The address of the registered keeper means nothing. (it's the company's auto lease partner's head office)

Practically, I crossed into Wales innumerable times during April (legitimately for work) and never even saw a police car, let alone being stopped.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Yes to be fair I don't think it's an unreasonable aspiration if that's what the position is for Welsh people.

Agreed. And if Wales believes this should be the case, as it clearly does, Wales should legislate, it's not Boris's job.

 

[WelshBluebird]

As it stands at the moment in restricted Welsh counties, you can go anywhere for food/work/education, even into England, which many do up here.

For those things yes - but not for leisure or holidays etc.

And my understanding (based on my parents living in one of the areas under local lockdown in Wales) is that the guidelines say activities such as food shopping etc should be done in the local area if possible. Granted there will be situations where it makes more sense to cross the council border (e.g. where a town is a lot closer or easier to get to etc), but for most people it just means staying local.

Certainly I can see the logic of changing something given under the current rules my parents who live in the Rhondda cannot travel the ~30 miles to Brecon for a day trip but someone from Liverpool can. If it is the right thing to do - who knows. But I'm certainly not surprised by it

Cars also can be registered anywhere - mine has a Chester registration (supplied from new by a Welsh dealer).

But presumably you are the registered keeper of the vehicle, and your details with the DVLA are upto date?

Then there's north-south routes which dip in and out of Wales, and places which are Wales on one side of the road and England on the other.

But all in all, those are the exceptions and I am sure some degree of common sense will be used if you are on roads that cross the border often and aren't doing something stupid like having a journey from an area under local lockdown in England to an area that isn't in Wales on your satnav or similar!
You'd have a hard time explaining to a police officer in Aberystwyth that you were just travelling from Liverpool to Gloucester that you were just travelling North to South though!

 

[adc82140]

But presumably you are the registered keeper of the vehicle, and your details with the DVLA are upto date?

It matters not one jot who the registered keeper of a car is. The registered keeper is not legally the owner, nor are they necessarily the driver.

Also the driver could be from a low covid area, but the passengers may be from high covid areas. How is that enforcible?

 

[HSTEd]

I'd love to see how this is going to be enforced.

The huge network of informants they have built up over the past several months.

It would be unwise to be in Wales with any sort of English accent from now on.

 

[Crossover]

Not at all surprising - a colleague of mine lives in Wales and I understand Drakeford has been making mutterings about this for quite a while

 

[WelshBluebird]

It matters not one jot who the registered keeper of a car is. The registered keeper is not legally the owner, nor are they necessarily the driver.

Also the driver could be from a low covid area, but the passengers may be from high covid areas. How is that enforcible?

I don't drive and haven't had to read to understand much of this stuff since I passed my test 12 years ago, but my understanding was that the registered keeper, whilst not the owner (although often is), is the person responsible for the car (e.g. for chasing up things like accidents or penalty points etc).

As such they seem to be a fairly good person to use as an idea from where the car is "based". Sure they may not be the driver but I think it is fair assumption to make that if they are not the driver, the driver would have had to pick up the car from the registered keeper.

Again, I know there are exceptions, but for 90% of the population the registered keeper and driver will either be the same person, or will live in the same area.

In terms of passengers - again obviously there will be exceptions but you could probably make a fairly reasonable assumption that passengers have traveled from the same area. Again, I know that isn't always the case and there are obvious exceptions you can bring up, but as a rough guide for the police to be able to start a conversation it is probably good enough!

 

[Journeyman]

The huge network of informants they have built up over the past several months.

It would be unwise to be in Wales with any sort of English accent from now on.

Yeah, I certainly wouldn't fancy it, especially in areas where anti-English sentiment can get militant and aggressive.

 

[trebor79]

Of course, as with a lot of this, enforcement is another kettle of fish! In terms of car licence plates - whilst the plates themselves may not be too reliable (as ainsworth74 has pointed out), can't the police just run a check on where the registered keeper for the car is from? Granted it may not be that person driving it, but the driver would have had to get the car from that person somehow. And as it is a legal requirement to keep your address with the DLVA up to date - you can't really complain much if you have moved but not updated your details.

But so many people have company cars, or are PCP or drive hired vehicles that information isn't going to tell the police anything useful.

Plus, the registered keeper isn't necessarily the owner anyway, and it isn't necessarily the owner or registered keeper driving it.