Was there ever a service from Waterloo to Exeter that did not call at places like Salisbury?

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Doomotron

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A few years ago I went to Waterloo station and I remember seeing on one of the information boards that there was a service from Waterloo to Exter St Davids calling at Pinhoe, Exeter Central and Exeter St Davids. Did/does this service exist, or did I misinterpret it?
 
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Cowley

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A few years ago I went to Waterloo station and I remember seeing on one of the information boards that there was a service from Waterloo to Exter St Davids calling at Pinhoe, Exeter Central and Exeter St Davids. Did/does this service exist, or did I misinterpret it?
Definitely not and I’d agree with the Good @Dr Hoo on that. ;)
 

superalbs

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A few years ago I went to Waterloo station and I remember seeing on one of the information boards that there was a service from Waterloo to Exter St Davids calling at Pinhoe, Exeter Central and Exeter St Davids. Did/does this service exist, or did I misinterpret it?
Finally the recognition we deserve. <:D
 

DelW

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I *think* I've read that no services have been allowed to run non-stop through Salisbury since the boat train derailment in the early 1900s. I've certainly never seen one do so.

[Edit] From the replies below, I probably read of such a ruling being applied after the derailment, but it has evidently been rescinded long ago.
 
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TheWalrus

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I *think* I've read that no services have been allowed to run non-stop through Salisbury since the boat train derailment in the early 1900s. I've certainly never seen one do so.
Didn’t the old Wales &Borders services from South Wales/Manchester to Waterloo omit Salisbury? I’m sure they were non-stop Warminster-Basingstoke?
 

embers25

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Didn’t the old Wales &Borders services from South Wales/Manchester to Waterloo omit Salisbury? I’m sure they were non-stop Warminster-Basingstoke?
Yes it did. There was also a non-stop Southampton(or was is Havant?) to Bath train I used a fair bit a few years back.

As for Pinhoe...people don't realise it's Exeter's most important station:) I also don't understand why the Barnstaple trains can't terminate at Pinhoe given they have enough time and have been doing so in quite a few weeks recently. I get it's a bit of a faff and may impact SWR performance but would be of great use.
 

hexagon789

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Wayback in the 1950s/1960s the Atlantic Coast Express made only one stop Waterloo-Exeter at Sidmouth Junction. By the late 1950s the timing was 2hr 56 to Exeter iirc.

It's worth noting that at this point there were only 5 through services on a roughly two-hourly frequency despite the line being entirely double track.
 

jfollows

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Didn’t the old Wales &Borders services from South Wales/Manchester to Waterloo omit Salisbury? I’m sure they were non-stop Warminster-Basingstoke?
Absolutely. I lived in Bath in 1994 and 1995 and I remember the service running then - I had an occasional need to visit IBM Basingstoke and it was an interesting train journey with very few stops, Salisbury definitely not being one of them.
 

TheWalrus

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Yes it did. There was also a non-stop Southampton(or was is Havant?) to Bath train I used a fair bit a few years back.

As for Pinhoe...people don't realise it's Exeter's most important station:) I also don't understand why the Barnstaple trains can't terminate at Pinhoe given they have enough time and have been doing so in quite a few weeks recently. I get it's a bit of a faff and may impact SWR performance but would be of great use.
I used Pinhoe a few times when I lived in Exeter. I lived in Polsloe so I was between Pinhoe and Central. It was a lot cheaper for me to walk half hour to Pinhoe than go from Central when travelling to Andover! Very useful station.
 

TheWalrus

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Absolutely. I lived in Bath in 1994 and 1995 and I remember the service running then - I had an occasional need to visit IBM Basingstoke and it was an interesting train journey with very few stops, Salisbury definitely not being one of them.
Think it was Bradford on Avon, Trowbridge, Warminster then Basingstoke? I have the old timetable. Shame such a service no longer exists! Although at least there’s a partial replacement with SWR Bristol-Waterloo.
 

Lewlew

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I *think* I've read that no services have been allowed to run non-stop through Salisbury since the boat train derailment in the early 1900s. I've certainly never seen one do so.
Did the GWR/FGW diverts into Waterloo stop at Salisbury?
 

DerekC

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I think the sharp curve is on the approach from Exeter, not from Bath

The 1906 derailment occurred at the east end of the station on the curve between the platform end and the Fisherton Street overbridge, a path which would be taken by any train using the up main. Speed is still limited to 30mph, as it was then. According to the accident report, the train averaged 72 mph between Dinton and the point of derailment, including a 40mph curve at Wilton Junction!
 

swt_passenger

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I *think* I've read that no services have been allowed to run non-stop through Salisbury since the boat train derailment in the early 1900s. I've certainly never seen one do so.
Up direction GWR diversions into Waterloo via Salisbury during the Reading rebuild definitely passed through non-stop, although there was such a historic rule it no longer applies.

(I believe the incident involved platform 1, which isn't really a main running line nowadays.)
 

Taunton

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The main issue that, in steam days, led to stopping at Salisbury was the LSWR didn't have any water troughs (possibly because they didn't have any adequate level sections for them). As a result Waterloo, or Exeter, to Salisbury was as far as you could go on a tank of water. The LSWR and successors did have some notably large tenders for the size of loco. Because they would take a considerable time to refill it was the practice to change locos instead, which was invariably done - by maximising the water capacity the coal capacity was somewhat reduced as well. Waterloo to Salisbury and back was also a good days' work anyway.

This water issue, indirectly, is what led to the Ocean Liner Express crash at Salisbury in 1906. The Up express from Plymouth (actually from Devonport, where it reversed coming up the spur from the shipping terminal) couldn't make it all the way over all the gradients etc through to Salisbury on one tank of water, and they didn't want to stop twice, so the changeover loco at Salisbury was sent down to Templecombe, 35 miles west, which is about halfway between Plymouth and Waterloo, and changed there, thence coming through Salisbury nonstop. Apparently it was the Salisbury driver's first ever run through the station without stopping. Thereafter it was determined that the Ocean trains, at the time the only ones to pass Salisbury nonstop, would stop there, now having already done so at Exeter as well. Apparently there had been multiple prior instructions from management to Salisbury crews not to run through the station too fast with these trains, there had been concerns before the accident.

In the 1950s on summer Saturdays there was congestion at the station with all the loco changing, the main expresses being duplicated or triplicated at short headways, so the Atlantic Coast Express, nominally nonstop through to Devon, passed nonstop and changed locos at Wilton, next station west, the Salisbury loco again having been sent down there ahead. It did so while the relief, running behind, changed locos at Salisbury station.

Back to the original post about the Waterloo indicator showing Page 2 etc, this is just bad programming, where it fills up page 1, if there is anything left over (sometimes just one line) it then does a page 2, which looks silly. It should really be divided into logical sections, now with space for a more prominent text about it being continued.
 
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30907

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In the 1950s on summer Saturdays there was congestion at the station with all the loco changing, the main expresses being duplicated or triplicated at short headways, so the Atlantic Coast Express, nominally nonstop through to Devon, passed nonstop and changed locos at Wilton, next station west, the Salisbury loco again having been sent down there ahead. It did so while the relief, running behind, changed locos at Salisbury station.
I assumed from the thread title that the OP was enquiring about the Devon Belle (hope you don't mind the correction) which omitted the Salisbury stop as you describe - every day it was timetabled (Friday to Sunday down IIRC).
 

Gloster

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It is nearly forty years since I used to cycle through Pinhoe every day (the box was open and the station still closed then), so I am bit rusty about the arrangements. I think one major problem about terminating from the west at Pinhoe is that the set would have to run into the section to Honiton in order to cross over to the down.

A minor point about the Salisbury accident: I think the driver was based at Nine Elms.
 

embers25

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It is nearly forty years since I used to cycle through Pinhoe every day (the box was open and the station still closed then), so I am bit rusty about the arrangements. I think one major problem about terminating from the west at Pinhoe is that the set would have to run into the section to Honiton in order to cross over to the down.

A minor point about the Salisbury accident: I think the driver was based at Nine Elms.
I thought the reverse was an issue for that reason too but GWR did it hourly recently with the Barnstsple trains.
 

Gloster

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I thought the reverse was an issue for that reason too but GWR did it hourly recently with the Barnstsple trains.

Did they go right through to reverse at Pinhoe, which is quite possible, but occupies the single line to Honiton, or did they reverse in the sidings opposite Exmouth Junction box?
 

norbitonflyer

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Up direction GWR diversions into Waterloo via Salisbury during the Reading rebuild definitely passed through non-stop, although there was such a historic rule it no longer applies.

(I believe the incident involved platform 1, which isn't really a main running line nowadays.)
Although the full story died with the footplatemen, various theories have been suggested. There were rumours of barnstorming behaviour by boat train drivers as they passed Salisbury depot - which might explain the long blast on the whistle as the train passed. It is also suggested that boat trains had regularly taken the curve at Salisbury at high speeds, but this driver got unstuck because the locomotive, an L12, had a higher centre of gravity than the T9swhich usually performed that duty.
 

Taunton

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The driver was indeed from Nine Elms. This would be only from a limited group there, as crews from there did not normally know the line west of Salisbury, but he was originally from Exeter before moving to London. Despite this it was his first time non stop at Salisbury. Notably, despite hard running he had actually slightly lost time from Templecombe to Salisbury.

The official accident report covers at length that the LSWR management had paid considerable attention beforehand to the boat trains going through Salisbury undesirably fast.
 

Gloster

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In Salisbury 1906: An Answer to the Enigma by the late Norman Pattenden, he provides a good argument for his suggestion that the driver suffered a brief micro-sleep at a crucial moment. He also demolishes many of the myths surrounding the accident. This monograph is sufficiently well regarded that it was put on the recommended reading list for the Institution of Railway Operators’ Degree in Railway Operation.
 

embers25

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Did they go right through to reverse at Pinhoe, which is quite possible, but occupies the single line to Honiton, or did they reverse in the sidings opposite Exmouth Junction box?
The sidings were closed which is why they used Pinhoe.
 
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