Weather-Related Disruption (Dec 2012)

[MadCommuter]

My 4th year dissertation is on ways the railway can improve response to flooding. I think i may do some interesting focus on Exeter.

Unless you raise the entire line there is little you can do. Drains do not work when everything is flooded, as where does the water go?

Sounds like you've written your summary already

 

[Ferret]

I'll expect a lot of messeges from our control when i wake up then. going to be another fun filled day at the office

Enjoy! So glad I'm off...!

 

[D1009]

And arrange bus services. Last time this happened the bus alternatives between Exeter and Taunton/Tiverton worked mostly very well.

Not so sure it'll work quite so well this time, demand for coaches in November is a bit different to Christmas!

 

[DavidBrown]

Bearing in mind that most of the line from Cowley Bridge north is already raised slightly, and the biggest problem seems to be water from the small river Yeo trying to cross the line to reach the Exe, would replacing the embankment with a permament bridge help? Obviously the biggest problem is the cost and massive disruption that such work would cause, but I don't think it would be all that much more than the suggestion of raising the line - especially as the latter option would also have to involve reconfiguring the A377, A396 and other nearby roads.

 

[HSTEd]

Giant pumps dumping the water into a storm drain leading directly to the sea in a tunnel under the town.

 

[Goatboy]

So FGW know there wont be trains tommorrow yet NRES are still proudly advertising everything for tommorrow as being unaffected....

Information is the difference between irate and understanding passengers in times of problems. Why do they often get it wrong?

 

[tsr]

...especially as the latter option would also have to involve reconfiguring the A377, A396 and other nearby roads.

Sounds like havoc to me! I haven't used those roads that much, but I'd think that might be a bad idea

Does anyone know if such routes are in line for massive upgrade works, perchance?

 

[Rich McLean]

So FGW know there wont be trains tommorrow yet NRES are still proudly advertising everything for tommorrow as being unaffected....

Information is the difference between irate and understanding passengers in times of problems. Why do they often get it wrong?

They have said possible disruption for tomorrow. If NR says in the morning that everything is honkey dory, then they will run trains. If not, the NRE will update in the morning. FGW are advising passengers early to prevent hoards of passengers turning up at Taunton when there is insufficient bus replacements

 

[tsr]

They have said possible disruption for tomorrow. If NR says in the morning that everything is honkey dory, then they will run trains. If not, the NRE will update in the morning. FGW are advising passengers early to prevent hoards of passengers turning up at Taunton when there is insufficient bus replacements

I'd say NRE should put up a warning of possible disruption tomorrow. I don't think that's beyond their system (after all, they were very recently able to warn of the possibilities of strikes disrupting services, and, moreover, the system was able to retract those warnings and show a message of reassurance).

I know NRE have a lot on their hands in terms of disruption at the moment, but it seems quite inconsistent to have a strongly-worded warning on a TOC website but none on the official nationwide rail information website!

 

[Goatboy]

NRES are able to warn that it might be busy due to the Bath Christmas market so its technically possible for them to warn services might be cancelled tommorrow.

Currently, Mr Average Passenger using NRES has no idea of the choas that will hit his journey tommorrow. To be honest the only reason I know is because I read this forum - I use NRES normally in favour of specific TOC websites as it's all-encompassing. Well, in theory.

 

[tsr]

NRES are able to warn that it might be busy due to the Bath Christmas market so its technically possible for them to warn services might be cancelled tommorrow.

Currently, Mr Average Passenger using NRES has no idea of the choas that will hit his journey tommorrow.

Quite.

Given the natural inconsistency in how members of the public expect to be provided with and subsequently access information (this is somewhat demonstrated by the variety of media formats, websites and so on), surely it is a good idea to use every means of information provision possible which has the ability to display the information in a suitably specific way?

Information design and management is of interest to me, and I have to say that if there's one thing the rail industry should take to heart, it's that consistent display of reliable information is absolutely key. (I do not deny that there are experts working on delivering this, and the information management situation is progressing well.)

 

[Goatboy]

Absolutely. People accept that sometimes, stuff happens. It's not bad stuff happening that annoys people, its poor information provision. This was my bugbear last time we had flooding. The staff on the ground operationally were fantastic. The buses worked. Journeys were as good as anyone could reasonably expect. They did a fantastic job.

But the information provision let everything down, which is a real shame. Somebody, somewhere, knows whats going on - which is why this forum is usually the first we hear about stuff. Get it out into the public domain quickly and efficiently. People are far more understanding when they are accurately kept informed.

 

[tsr]

Absolutely. People accept that sometimes, stuff happens. It's not bad stuff happening that annoys people, its poor information provision. This was my bugbear last time we had flooding. The staff on the ground operationally were fantastic. The buses worked. Journeys were as good as anyone could reasonably expect. They did a fantastic job.

But the information provision let everything down, which is a real shame. Somebody, somewhere, knows whats going on - which is why this forum is usually the first we hear about stuff. Get it out into the public domain quickly and efficiently. People are far more understanding when they are accurately kept informed.

Compared to the situation a few years back, where departure boards in some areas were more inaccurate, there were fewer accessible social media sites, fewer help points and staff were provided, and fewer website tools were available, let alone the quality and type of information available for public-facing systems (which, after all, is the backbone of it all), things are getting better, it has to be said. I do agree with you that an appropriate amount of information has to be given. Unfortunately, although it sometimes is, it can often end up given as "endless" (not literally ) alterations lists on JourneyCheck, or something equally unusable to "Mr General Public".

Rail staff and enthusiasts can forget that "prevention is better than cure" in pre-emptive information provision. Failing that (for example, if an incident was completely unable to be predicted), the public want to know briefly and accurately what has happened, but the most important thing is to suggest the quickest resolution in an easy-to-understand way.

 

[D1009]

Rail staff and enthusiasts can forget that "prevention is better than cure" in pre-emptive information provision. Failing that (for example, if an incident was completely unable to be predicted), the public want to know briefly and accurately what has happened, but the most important thing is to suggest the quickest resolution in an easy-to-understand way.

And therein lies the problem. Rail staff are only human, and the natural reaction when something happens is to sort it out as quickly as possible. Trying to provide a running commentary to the wider world takes almost as much effort, and usually there's nobody to do it.

 

[aleph_0]

And therein lies the problem. Rail staff are only human, and the natural reaction when something happens is to sort it out as quickly as possible. Trying to provide a running commentary to the wider world takes almost as much effort, and usually there's nobody to do it.

Part of the problem appears to be structural. The disruption information should be on both NRES and the FGW website - when one is updated, so is the other, this hasn't happened.

They had staff on social media duties, so there are the staff time available. A more useful use of their time would be to firstly ensure the public information is up-to-date.

I think there is also a strong argument for giving more information about the problem. For example, during the previous flood an embankment between Bristol Parkway and Swindon was damaged. The plan appeared to be to cancel most Cardiff services, and just run the Swanseas, with trains being diverted via. Bath. Making such information public (and indeed, the guards' on-train announcements did a good job in stating the actual problems) would be a good idea, rather than a vague promise of delays and cancellations.

The disruption page only usually only got updated in the morning - an update in the evening about plans for the next day (even if the information is incomplete, and a disclaimer was provided), would be a very good idea.

It's clear to me that FGW/NR did a good job in fixing things and in utilizing the working infrastructure as effectively as possible. It's frustrating that the information being provided, which is the easier thing to get right, didn't reflect this.

 

[455driver]

The fire brigade are going to be pumping out at Cowley Bridge tonight, well this morning actually.

Link-
http://www.dsfire.gov.uk/News/Newsd...dentID=22885&siteCategoryId=3&T1ID=26&T2ID=41

Edit, line closed between Tiverton Parkway and Exeter st Davids until further notice
1A40 6 early at Castle Cary (0152) but showing delayed from there onwards, might have been diverted via Yeovil?
All Southbound XC services terminating at Taunton today, Shuttle between Exeter and Plymouth/ Penzance covering for most but not all services, FGW still shows all services running through, probably system not updated.

 

[class57basher]

A link posted on SWRG from ljs10632000 might be of interest and possibly help with the disruption

http://www.dsfire.gov.uk/News/Newsd...dentID=22885&siteCategoryId=3&T1ID=26&T2ID=41

 

[Hyphen]

Certainly showing on the National Rail website now.

Also Looe services are stopped for the same reason

 

[embers25]

Line closed Plymouth to Tiverton and A38 also closed until 0630 at Marsh Mills just outside Plymouth on the way to Exeter making buses tricky!

 

[Zoe]

Line closed Plymouth to Tiverton

Nothing seems to be running between Taunton and Tiverton.

 

[Captain Chaos]

Barnstaple line is closed and is expected to be so until the 29th of December apparently. No buses running at the moment due to road conditions.

 

[Rich McLean]

Trains are running between Exeter St D and Penzance, then london end and xc trains are terminating at taunton
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Scrap that, not trains between Plymouth and Exeter until further notice

 

[Kali]

Rain down here is awful & looks like it will be all day ( and apparently 24th also ), so I'd not be surprised if it's November all over again.

Not sure what you can do to the Culm valley really, once you fill up a valley there's literally nowhere to put more water. Ideally the line should have gone down the Exe valley instead which is a bit less flood prone, but that would still end up flooding Stoke Canon-Cowley bridge anyway.

 

[Goatboy]

Trains are running between Exeter St D and Penzance, then london end and xc trains are terminating at taunton
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Scrap that, not trains between Plymouth and Exeter until further notice

Are you sure - they said no trains between Plymouth and Exeter as at 00:43 due to a signalling problem but live departures for Plymouth is now showing all through trains cancelled and Exeter terminators On Time in the same path, which seems sensible and implies Plymouth to Exeter is open?

 

[krus_aragon]

My 4th year dissertation is on ways the railway can improve response to flooding. I think i may do some interesting focus on Exeter.

Unless you raise the entire line there is little you can do. Drains do not work when everything is flooded, as where does the water go?

I know! Once the line is electrified, use the electricity from regenerative braking to boil all the water in the drains. It'll evaporate up into the sky, and, er, become rain again... :P

 

[wintonian]

FGW are now advising passengers NOT to travel.

BBC

 

[Zoe]

Are you sure - they said no trains between Plymouth and Exeter as at 00:43 due to a signalling problem but live departures for Plymouth is now showing all through trains cancelled and Exeter terminators On Time in the same path, which seems sensible and implies Plymouth to Exeter is open?

That's what it says but if you look at the departure boards for Newton Abbot you will not see any reports of the trains in question departing Plymouth. FGW are saying that all lines are blocked between Taunton and Plymouth. This was last updated at 09:14.

 

[DavidBrown]

Barnstaple line is closed and is expected to be so until the 29th of December apparently. No buses running at the moment due to road conditions.

What's your source for that? No mention of a reopening date on FGW's website, and it would seem to be too early for engineering crews to have assessed whatever damage there may be as most of it will still be underwater. Do we even know where abouts the Tarka Line is flooded? I would assume the usual places at Cowley Bridge and New Bridge near Barnstaple.

 

[Goatboy]

FGW are now advising passengers NOT to travel.

BBC

Yea, they do that every time as if most people travel for a laugh. It's 2 days before Christmas, I doubt many people making a long journey today are doing so for any reason other than they have to.

That's what it says but if you look at the departure boards for Newton Abbot you will not see any reports of the trains in question departing Plymouth.

So yet another information breakdown then

 

[Zoe]

So yet another information breakdown then

Would you prefer it if the departure boards just showed the original train as terminating short rather than showing cancelled and then a separate train running in its path?