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West Coast Partnership: Awarded to First Trenitalia

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I13

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Here's an image of 221101 all in white, without any Virgin branding at all.
 

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RealTrains07

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The Virgin West Coast franchise has had many plus points including the availability of some very attractive fares (particularly earlier in the franchise). However there are two areas where I hope that First Trenitalia might be an improvement:
1. Virgin run the franchise like an airline with all that entails. It is a train service please.
2. Virgin have a misguided policy of never holding connections at stations they control. This is a mistake in my view and should be looked at by the new operator.
Nearly all TOCs do this and it wont stop. Most have “airline seating” anyway
 

RealTrains07

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Here's an image of 221101 all in white, without any Virgin branding at all.
Guessing that costs more money compared to the pendolinoes. Why bother at all, surely just removing the branding is easier this close to the transfer??
 

Bletchleyite

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Nearly all TOCs do this and it wont stop. Most have “airline seating” anyway

I wouldn't hold up much hope of First-TI moving away from airline style pricing when you consider that TI's entire IC system is run airline style - compulsory reservations, all tickets train specific. That said, to contrast with that First are far less of a fan of Advances - very rarely have I found one on GWR that was better value than the walk-up.
 

Mathew S

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GWR regularly do in Cornwall, which nicely demonstrates the benefits of it being one company running all of it.
It also demonstrates the difference of running isolated branch lines and services on a relatively remote part of the network though doesn't it.
Start holding services for connections on the southern WCML and it'll cause all sorts of chaos, as I'm sure you well know.
 

LNW-GW Joint

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Wouldn't it be funny if FT had decided to do a deal with Virgin to keep the current branding?
Branson is not beyond simply using his brand on other people's businesses, for a fee.
Not that I am expecting anything of the sort, with First Group and Trenitalia wanting to plant their own brand.
 

pt_mad

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Wouldn't it be funny if FT had decided to do a deal with Virgin to keep the current branding?
Branson is not beyond simply using his brand on other people's businesses, for a fee.
Not that I am expecting anything of the sort, with First Group and Trenitalia wanting to plant their own brand.
Wouldn't have thought it likely though or they wouldn't be de-vinyling their 390s.
 

Howardh

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I read that the pendolinos that will be handed over to Trenitalia are to have a good refurb including first-class. Good - I always thought Virgin's first class was shabby and with the single seats in particulardownright uncomfortable, the arm-rest by the window and the table leg getting in the way! Hope that gets sorted with some new comfortable seats. Also hope the refurb extends to those lounges too.
 

Mathew S

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I read that the pendolinos that will be handed over to Trenitalia are to have a good refurb including first-class. Good - I always thought Virgin's first class was shabby and with the single seats in particulardownright uncomfortable, the arm-rest by the window and the table leg getting in the way! Hope that gets sorted with some new comfortable seats. Also hope the refurb extends to those lounges too.
You're aware that the window seats are exactly, 100% identical to the other seats in 1st? And therefore, by definition, no less or more comfortable?
 

Bletchleyite

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I read that the pendolinos that will be handed over to Trenitalia are to have a good refurb including first-class. Good - I always thought Virgin's first class was shabby and with the single seats in particulardownright uncomfortable, the arm-rest by the window and the table leg getting in the way! Hope that gets sorted with some new comfortable seats. Also hope the refurb extends to those lounges too.

A full set of new seats I believe. Who bets they'll be F*ins* S*ph**s? I heard somewhere that they would actually be swapped round with First at the present Coach A end (as coach A has one more window bay than coach K).
 

Howardh

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You're aware that the window seats are exactly, 100% identical to the other seats in 1st? And therefore, by definition, no less or more comfortable?
The ones on the aisle which are part of two don't have a fixed arm that you have to put up with!! AFAIK it/they can be retracted - the ones by the window can't. Bulky nuisance....
 

ashkeba

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Branson is not beyond simply using his brand on other people's businesses, for a fee.
Isn't that many Virgin businesses? VTWC and VTXC were unusual in Virgin owning a majority stake of a business that isn't some sort of sales op. Virgin only owns 20% of its flagship Virgin Atlantic airline. He exerts control by owning the brand rather than shares.
 

Grumpy Git

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................. Also hope the refurb extends to those lounges too.

Having used the ones at Lime St. and Euston recently, I agree. They really are terrible, particularly the one at Lime St, what nasty dirty soulless dump.
 

Bletchleyite

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Isn't that many Virgin businesses? VTWC and VTXC were unusual in Virgin owning a majority stake of a business that isn't some sort of sales op. Virgin only owns 20% of its flagship Virgin Atlantic airline. He exerts control by owning the brand rather than shares.

It's exactly what VT would have been had it "continued" - Stagecoach-SNCF with Virgin branding, so more like EMT or VTEC than VTWC. Virgin Rail Group (i.e. Virgin control) was going to end on 8th December pretty much whatever happened.
 

Howardh

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Class 80x seats.
These? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Briti...ia/File:Standard_Class_interior_of_800009.jpg
If so they look OK but the colour...like being in a funeral! I suppose the interior will have Trenitalia branding, and I've no idea whatsoever that will be. Anyhow, need to travel to London in January and note that tickets bought on the Virgin site today will be valid after take-over, as they should be of course. But who gets the money - and when?? Presume Trenitalia and after the change?
 

Howardh

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M28361M

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Lime Street, it does look a bit, er, basic! https://www.tripadvisor.com/Locatio...-i236223525-Virgin_Trains-London_England.html Never been in it, but if that's a recent photo it has the feel of the cafe/bar at Oxford Road about it. It makes the one at Glasgow feel like a palace!

The picture in that link is the old lounge which was located between the pre-refurb platforms 7 and 8. It was demolished during the renovation works last year.

The new lounge is on the upper floor of the barrier line building above M&S Simply Food - here's a picture (not mine) from twitter: https://twitter.com/tnwbb/status/1050618422172631041

I've been in it and I think it's fine, my main complaint is that the seat I was in (one of the big red ones seen in that picture) was quite uncomfortable.
 

Grumpy Git

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The picture in that link is the old lounge which was located between the pre-refurb platforms 7 and 8. It was demolished during the renovation works last year.

The new lounge is on the upper floor of the barrier line building above M&S Simply Food - here's a picture (not mine) from twitter: https://twitter.com/tnwbb/status/1050618422172631041

I've been in it and I think it's fine, my main complaint is that the seat I was in (one of the big red ones seen in that picture) was quite uncomfortable.

That photograph does it a LOT of justice! It was cold, the seats were non too clean and it was generally very underwhelming in late October.
 

Howardh

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The picture in that link is the old lounge which was located between the pre-refurb platforms 7 and 8. It was demolished during the renovation works last year.

The new lounge is on the upper floor of the barrier line building above M&S Simply Food - here's a picture (not mine) from twitter: https://twitter.com/tnwbb/status/1050618422172631041

I've been in it and I think it's fine, my main complaint is that the seat I was in (one of the big red ones seen in that picture) was quite uncomfortable.
Those big red seats aren't particularly comfortable on the eye!
 

AK1982

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Can anyone confirm whether the new operator plan to run direct services from Euston to Liverpool South Parkway?

I have just read an article by the Liverpool Echo which suggests they will along with the existing stopping service ran by London northwestern?
 

The Planner

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Can anyone confirm whether the new operator plan to run direct services from Euston to Liverpool South Parkway?

I have just read an article by the Liverpool Echo which suggests they will along with the existing stopping service ran by London northwestern?
Yes, but not immediately. Could well be as late as 2022 when a recast is expected.
 

EE Andy b1

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Can anyone confirm whether the new operator plan to run direct services from Euston to Liverpool South Parkway?

I have just read an article by the Liverpool Echo which suggests they will along with the existing stopping service ran by London northwestern?

That is First trenitalias aim, to stop at Liverpool South Parkway with the introduction of a second hourly service with new EMUs if given the go ahead.
 
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