West Coast Railways / Riviera Trains HST

Discussion in 'Railtours & Preservation' started by Masboroughlad, 11 Oct 2017.

Will an HST ever get bought by charter train hire companies?

  1. Yes

    40 vote(s)
    90.9%
  2. No

    4 vote(s)
    9.1%
  1. Masboroughlad

    Masboroughlad Established Member

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    Wonder if in years to come, we'll witness a maroon WCR Intercity 125 or maybe an INTERCITY swallow HST or a blue and grey one.
     
  2. STEVIEBOY1

    STEVIEBOY1 Established Member

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    I would like to see a Blue and Grey one, there are a few carriages around which do have that infact. Maroon would be good too.
     
  3. Blindtraveler

    Blindtraveler Established Member

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    Nowhere near enough to a Pacer :(
    Highly likely that with the production line so to speek open in Donny for 2020 work that at least 1 of Riviera/DRS/GBRF/WCRC doesnt take some surplus EC or GWR ones and have them brought up to standard incl CET fitment and retro fit the 1970s/80s interior.
     
  4. sprinterguy

    sprinterguy Established Member

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    Of course one HST set has already spent time with a railtour operator, in the 2007/8 period, in the form of Cotswold Rail.

    It didn't seem to work out particularly well for them and worked only a limited number of tours, but post 2020 I would be surprised if West Coast Railway Co or their contemporary equivalent didn't pick up a set to service the daytripper market. A second resurrection of the luxury "Blue Pullman" dining service that FM Rail operated for a while utilising a pair of top and tailed air con mark 2s would also seem a suitable use for a set, and I think that an HST rake would look particularly appealing in the nanking blue and white livery of what was in several ways its forerunner.

    I do desperately hope that we don't see the sleek lines of an HST marred by WCRCs' universal drab brown livery, though. :|
     
  5. mushroomchow

    mushroomchow Member

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    Given they're already familiar with MK. 3 operation, I could see DBS operating a set.

    How I'd feel about seeing a British icon like the HST with "DB" emblazoned on the side is another matter entirely. :rolleyes:
     
  6. gordonthemoron

    gordonthemoron Established Member

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    It'd be nice to have one in ICE livery ;)
     
  7. 43096

    43096 Established Member

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    In what way did the use of an HST not work out for Cotswold, then?
     
  8. gazthomas

    gazthomas Established Member

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    They went out of business soon after
     
  9. 43096

    43096 Established Member

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    Which is absolutely nothing to do with their use of an HST!!!!
     
  10. gazthomas

    gazthomas Established Member

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    Really? It must have impacted their cash flow?
     
  11. 43096

    43096 Established Member

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    Not really. The set would have been stored anyway so AIUI there was a nominal fee agreed between Cotswold and Porterbrook, which suited both as Porterbrook avoided the cost of storage.

    What really killed Cotswold financially was leasing Class 66s. Not cheap, and not what they really needed - 57s would have been better.
     
  12. sprinterguy

    sprinterguy Established Member

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    I can't be certain; but the fact that it saw only occasional use, and was never tarted up in the way that they initially seemed keen to do, before the company was wound up suggests that it wasn't a successful experiment for them.
     
  13. 43096

    43096 Established Member

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    The set didn't need tarting up - it was a Project Rio set that was relatively recently refurbished. It also became clear pretty quickly that First Great Western would take almost all of the off-lease HST fleet, so there wasn't much point in spending cash on it.

    Your timescales are also out. The HST set went back to Porterbrook in August 2006. Cotswold/Advenza went under 3 years later. Nothing to do with the HST.
     
    Last edited: 14 Oct 2017
  14. sprinterguy

    sprinterguy Established Member

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    It looked terribly tatty whenever I clapped eyes on it, though that was the impression I got from the whole of the Project Rio fleet, too.
    Fair enough, I didn't even realise that the Advenza operation was related to Cotswold Rail.

    You seem to have a far more solid grasp of the facts than the outsiders' impressions that I'm relaying, so if the HST set was more of a success for Cotswold than the impression I gained then I'll happily withdraw my argument.
     
  15. 43096

    43096 Established Member

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    That's what forums are for - sharing information! It is over 10 years ago now and I had to go back and check the dates when things happened.

    Part of the reason for the Cotswold use was because Porterbrook wanted to see if an HST set could be used on an occasional (rather than daily) basis. At the time there were a lot of sets off lease and they may have wondered about selling/leasing them to charter stock owners. The Cotswold operation proved that an HST copes fine with occasional use. Subsequently 41001 has also been successfully used on an occasional basis, too.
     
  16. sprinterguy

    sprinterguy Established Member

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    Sounds like the future prospect of an HST in railtour use is quite a likely one then, on that basis. :smile:
     
  17. alexl92

    alexl92 Established Member

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    Tbf, West Coast paint their diesels maroon to match the rolling stock. I think it looks terrible unless the diesel in question is simply providing hotel power from the rear (where it sort of blends in) but on an HST they wouldn’t have the same reason to do it as the coaches and power cars would stay as a set.

    Plus, they’re surely not daft enough not to have noticed the way the retro-liveried GWR power cars have been received.
     
  18. 43096

    43096 Established Member

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    I don't get why anyone would think WCRC would want an HST. Their core business is kettle charters, so don't see how that fits?
     
  19. sprinterguy

    sprinterguy Established Member

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    I appreciate that they do it to make the locos look as incongruous as possible when heating steam tours, although the colour used seems notably darker than the shade used on the carriages that they haul most of the time. It doesn't, for example, look anything like the extremely appealing and noticeably lighter shade of maroon that was deployed on Western Region Warships and Westerns, which did seem to match the BR maroon livery of mark 1 coaching stock. Getting off topic, but I don't think that West Coast's 47s would look any more incongruous on steam tours if they were painted in an approximation of their original BR two-tone green livery, and would look considerably more appealing when working solo. Not that it's exactly a major concern.
     
  20. mushroomchow

    mushroomchow Member

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    It'll be useful for the next time an old codger ignores signals or safety equipment and they're banned from operating said kettle charters. :lol:
     

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