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West Somerset Railway

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UP13

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So my understanding is that other railways have had similar issues in the past but had the advantage of no social media to fight it out in public?
 
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Cowley

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So my understanding is that other railways have had similar issues in the past but had the advantage of no social media to fight it out in public?
Very good point.
There was quite a bit of trouble on the Mid Hants years ago and articles appeared in the railway press about it which seemed very public at the time, but it was nothing like what happens now.
 

UP13

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Very good point.
There was quite a bit of trouble on the Mid Hants years ago and articles appeared in the railway press about it which seemed very public at the time, but it was nothing like what happens now.

What was the deal at the Watercress? All I know is that their was a falling out with their CME, who was also a locomotive owner, and it resulted in a life ban yet his locomotives were still there for a number of years...
 

Crewe Exile

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Sad to see the WSR in (seemingly) such a state. I went with family a couple of years back now and loadings appeared healthy for the time of year. One thing that I do think is a problem for the line is the length. It’s too long!. It’s too long a trip for families with kids to ride the entire line (and expensive) It must also take a hell of a lot volunteers to maintain it. Perhaps running from Minehead to half way down the line might be a more viable option?.
Also, the stop at Doniford is nowhere near the holiday park there - and somewhat inaccessible for families with kids/buggy’s etc.
 

tiptoptaff

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Sad to see the WSR in (seemingly) such a state. I went with family a couple of years back now and loadings appeared healthy for the time of year. One thing that I do think is a problem for the line is the length. It’s too long!. It’s too long a trip for families with kids to ride the entire line (and expensive) It must also take a hell of a lot volunteers to maintain it. Perhaps running from Minehead to half way down the line might be a more viable option?.
Also, the stop at Doniford is nowhere near the holiday park there - and somewhat inaccessible for families with kids/buggy’s etc.
Some of the issues I believe are related to the level crossing at Minehead, so the station is effectively cut off at the moment. Seems to be no effort made by the Board and the Chairman to get it sorted. They rejected out of hand plans that were ready to go, done by senior S&T engineers. I believe the new equipment is ready at Saltash, but he's decided he doesn't want it.

As for Doniford, it's quite popular in the summer, and there is a dedicated path to the park that's been upgraded over the years.
 

4141

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Sad to see the WSR in (seemingly) such a state. I went with family a couple of years back now and loadings appeared healthy for the time of year. One thing that I do think is a problem for the line is the length. It’s too long!. It’s too long a trip for families with kids to ride the entire line (and expensive) It must also take a hell of a lot volunteers to maintain it. Perhaps running from Minehead to half way down the line might be a more viable option?.
Also, the stop at Doniford is nowhere near the holiday park there - and somewhat inaccessible for families with kids/buggy’s etc.
Personally, I find that is the length of the line, and the fact it goes from seaside to hilly areas through changing scenery, that gives it it's attraction. Lose the Bishop's Lydiard end and you lose any chance of traffic coming from Taunton. Maybe there could be a marketing push for families with children to do Minehead - Williton and return as an option, as there's usually a crossing of trains there anyway...
 

STEVIEBOY1

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I like the photos in post #33. Is the DMU a class 117? I hope the line can survive.
 

UP13

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I like the photos in post #33. Is the DMU a class 117? I hope the line can survive.

I believe so. They definitely have a 117 and km unaware of any other DMUs.

I hope it survives too. Politics aside, the only thing going against it is its length (both on terms of being expensive to maintain and pushing the boundaries of endurance for a regular family).
 

tiptoptaff

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I believe so. They definitely have a 117 and km unaware of any other DMUs.

I hope it survives too. Politics aside, the only thing going against it is its length (both on terms of being expensive to maintain and pushing the boundaries of endurance for a regular family).
The length can be a real issue. £for mile, the all day rover tickets are really good value. But, as they cost more than other railways locally, such as the DFR, SDR and GWSR, which are all shorter, the public believe it to be expensive.
And as you say, the round trip is almost too much for a family with small kids. The SVR is nearly in the same category, but they have a fantastic place to get off half way along (The Engine House at Highly) which really breaks it up
 

Richard Scott

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I believe so. They definitely have a 117 and km unaware of any other DMUs.

I hope it survives too. Politics aside, the only thing going against it is its length (both on terms of being expensive to maintain and pushing the boundaries of endurance for a regular family).
Thought it was a 115 unit not a 117. That unit has high backed seats which 117s do not, as far as I'm aware.
 

headshot119

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Thought it was a 115 unit not a 117. That unit has high backed seats which 117s do not, as far as I'm aware.

There's 5 x 115 vehicles at the WSR, one of which is just an underframe. There's also a single 117 vehicle, but it's not yet been used on public services.
 

Bedpan

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What was the deal at the Watercress? All I know is that their was a falling out with their CME, who was also a locomotive owner, and it resulted in a life ban yet his locomotives were still there for a number of years...

The locos remained at the Mid Hants until 2014 (or at least the three Moguls did not leave until 2014) due to the contracts entered into between the owner and the railway. At the time I was quite interested in what the argument was about, not least because of whether or not to donate any few spare pence I might have to the MHR or somewhere else, but I never did find out what, if anything, had been alleged to have been going on. I did at the time think that it might have been a bit heavy handed to give the CME a life ban when his locos were committed to the railway, but who can say when we don't know what was happening.
 

John Luxton

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A lot of people appear to have commented on the length of the WSR being an issue - however the Welsh Highland is around 5 miles longer and a full trip is almost a full day with usually the option of a half way trip for those that do not want to commit to a full day. How is length an issue for the WSR and not apparently so for the WHR?
 

UP13

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To be fair I've never been to the Welsh Highland but to be honest if I was in the area the length of trip would probably be too much for my family.
 

bramling

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A lot of people appear to have commented on the length of the WSR being an issue - however the Welsh Highland is around 5 miles longer and a full trip is almost a full day with usually the option of a half way trip for those that do not want to commit to a full day. How is length an issue for the WSR and not apparently so for the WHR?

I think length *can* be an issue on the WHR. Not an issue for me, however I've certainly seen some pretty bored families on there.
 

Malcmal

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I think length *can* be an issue on the WHR. Not an issue for me, however I've certainly seen some pretty bored families on there.

I would imagine there is a lot more "WOW" factor along much of the WHR route compared to the WSR which is probably just like any average railway view for a lot of the route.
 

DB

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I would imagine there is a lot more "WOW" factor along much of the WHR route compared to the WSR which is probably just like any average railway view for a lot of the route.

The WSR is perfectly pleasant countryside, but I would agree - it's not dramatic like the WHR.
 

the sniper

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A lot of people appear to have commented on the length of the WSR being an issue - however the Welsh Highland is around 5 miles longer and a full trip is almost a full day with usually the option of a half way trip for those that do not want to commit to a full day. How is length an issue for the WSR and not apparently so for the WHR?

The WHR and SVR arguably have more of a destination at 'the end', wherever you're starting. I imagine most passengers on the WSR originate from Minehead, in which case, where are they going? Watchet is a touristy place to go, but I can't say I'd be fussed about going to Williton or Bishop's Lydeard (again, in my case), and you've got to travel a long way to get to the latter.

As said above, I'd argue the WHR is also more characterful and unique than WSR. Plus, if you're in that area and want to do a shorter journey, you can do the FR and the money still goes in the same company's pot.
 

DB

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The WHR and SVR arguably have more of a destination at 'the end', wherever you're starting. I imagine most passengers on the WSR originate from Minehead, in which case, where are they going? Watchet is a touristy place to go, but I can't say I'd be fussed about going to Williton or Bishop's Lydeard (again, in my case), and you've got to travel a long way to get to the latter.

Watchet or Dunster - there isn't really anywhere else with anything for the average tourist! Bishops Lydeard is a sprawling and dull commuter village for those working in Taunton.
 

35B

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The WHR and SVR arguably have more of a destination at 'the end', wherever you're starting. I imagine most passengers on the WSR originate from Minehead, in which case, where are they going? Watchet is a touristy place to go, but I can't say I'd be fussed about going to Williton or Bishop's Lydeard (again, in my case), and you've got to travel a long way to get to the latter.

As said above, I'd argue the WHR is also more characterful and unique than WSR. Plus, if you're in that area and want to do a shorter journey, you can do the FR and the money still goes in the same company's pot.
WSR traffic is apparently very heavily weighted to start from Bishops Lydeard, not Minehead. It's a journey to the seaside, with good access from Taunton and the M5, not a journey from Minehead to nowhere much.
 

Malcmal

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The WHR and SVR arguably have more of a destination at 'the end', wherever you're starting. I imagine most passengers on the WSR originate from Minehead, in which case, where are they going? Watchet is a touristy place to go, but I can't say I'd be fussed about going to Williton or Bishop's Lydeard (again, in my case), and you've got to travel a long way to get to the latter.

As said above, I'd argue the WHR is also more characterful and unique than WSR. Plus, if you're in that area and want to do a shorter journey, you can do the FR and the money still goes in the same company's pot.

There is something else that came to mind. In my view narrow gauge probably appeals more to families with kids as there is a "toy train" element to it and the small ones feel more "grown up" and to scale with the experience. Does anyone else think this is a sensible theory or am I just back in my own world ha ha??!
 

paul1609

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A lot of people appear to have commented on the length of the WSR being an issue - however the Welsh Highland is around 5 miles longer and a full trip is almost a full day with usually the option of a half way trip for those that do not want to commit to a full day. How is length an issue for the WSR and not apparently so for the WHR?
In terms of commercial sucess;
a) Narrow Gauge infrastructure is intrinsically cheaper to maintain that's why several heritage railways that were previously standard gauge have been rebuilt as narrow gauge, Kirklees, Bure Valley, South Tyneside, Bala etc.
b) Welsh Highland was effectively a new build using modern methods because it is new it has a period when maintenance costs will be low. The rail for instance will not require replacement in the early years.
c) The WSR has inherited a largely life expired victorian railway from BR. The rail for instance now requires significant replacement which has to be funded by the day to day business.
d) the whr has a simple low cost signalling system.
e) the WSR has a traditional BR branch line which has expensive to maintain and work systems. For example My 11 mile line with 4 signal boxes uses in excess of £20k a year of electricity around 30% of our overall consumption. This is on track circuits, telecoms interlocking etc.
f) the whr is largely in the Snowdonia National Park with large numbers of visitors whereas the WSR is in a much quieter attractive part of Somerset.
g) the whr has a much higher proportion of passengers making part trips along the line to external attractions at Beddlegert Rhyd Ddu etc.
No doubt others can add more.
 

UP13

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WSR traffic is apparently very heavily weighted to start from Bishops Lydeard, not Minehead. It's a journey to the seaside, with good access from Taunton and the M5, not a journey from Minehead to nowhere much.

The few times I've been on it, it has always started at Bishops Lydeard.

Years ago we went to Minehead, then walked along the coast to Blue Anchor and hopped back on the train. A long return journey isn't so bad when you've had a decent walk.
 

MarkyT

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WSR traffic is apparently very heavily weighted to start from Bishops Lydeard, not Minehead. It's a journey to the seaside, with good access from Taunton and the M5, not a journey from Minehead to nowhere much.
Very much so. They have a large free car park at Bishops Lydeard, and during operating hours the Taunton - Minehead public bus service route 28 runs via the station forecourt, and it always serves Taunton mainline station so it's very easy to get to from that end. Its a good day out for anyone staying in or around Minehead as well of course, but parking at Minehead station is pay and display unsurprisingly, being so close to the town centre and seafront. Some of the other stations have limited parking.
 

Shenandoah

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Despite the pleasant countryside of the WSR, presently there are no trains operating and it seems not for a while yet.
There will be even less attractions at passing stations when the S&D Trust leave Washford. (unless ther is a change of heart by the PLC)
 

31160

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There really was never many visitors to the S&D place and i travel on the line loads maybe two peeps at most got off there on non gala days and even that smal number wasnt heading to the museum automatically as the abbey seams to hold an attraction to some
 

DelW

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Despite the pleasant countryside of the WSR, presently there are no trains operating and it seems not for a while yet.
There will be even less attractions at passing stations when the S&D Trust leave Washford. (unless ther is a change of heart by the PLC)
AIUI there's planned to be a three day event at Minehead over the bank holiday weekend, similar to a couple of other recent weekend events. I believe that p-way issues currently restrict them to using a relatively short stretch of line.
 

tiptoptaff

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Issues, unfortunately, of the chairman's making. His decisions have lead to the sad state it's in at the moment
 

31160

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Issues, unfortunately, of the chairman's making. His decisions have lead to the sad state it's in at the moment

I think some problems have been coming for a long time, the pway problems are long term and predate his arrival
 
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