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What are your observations of face coverings wearing on public transport?

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greyman42

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I think I would have asked ‘show me your ticket.’ If they had one, which I doubt, he could have told them to sit together in the far end of the train. With the lass, I would have asked if she had an exemption without asking what it was. You can see I’m on the guard’s side by not giving any details, but I worry he might lay himself exposed.
Have guards been given responsibility for enforcing the wearing of masks? If not then why do they get involved?
 

island

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Guards have the legal entitlement to enforce mask requirements. To what extent their TOCs allow/require/encourage them to do so I do not know.
 

Enthusiast

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Guards have the legal entitlement to enforce mask requirements. To what extent their TOCs allow/require/encourage them to do so I do not know.
Only provided they have been specifically authorised by the operator for that purpose.
 

ForTheLoveOf

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Guards have the legal entitlement to enforce mask requirements. To what extent their TOCs allow/require/encourage them to do so I do not know.
Enforce, of course, only means preventing someone from boarding, or giving them a direction to put on a mask or to leave. It doesn't entitle ordinary members of staff to forceably remove passengers once they are onboard.
 

island

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They do not need to have been specifically authorized; they can already give a passenger a byelaw 12.2 direction to put a mask on and remove them if they didn’t, but we really are getting into angels on drawing-pins as no guard is going to do that in a month of Sundays.
 

yorkie

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Guards have the legal entitlement to enforce mask requirements. To what extent their TOCs allow/require/encourage them to do so I do not know.
The Unions (or, at least the RMT) have instructed operational staff not to get involved in the enforcement of masks.

Most do make announcements, some of which mention fines for non compliance, and some mention exemptions.

Getting back to observations, compliance was extremely high on my journey yesterday, which involved LNER, GWR and LU.
 

SteveM70

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Just made my first train trip since lockdown began. Four stops on a Northern train. Everyone wearing facemasks apart from a group of about a dozen people all sat together and getting stuck into a load of cans

But as an aside it’s good to see the 195s still have the “platform too short” announcement when it isn’t needed
 

Jayden99

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Ashamed to admit I had a bit of a go at one of the pink vest brigade at Euston station. Pounced on me as I was mid putting my mask on to tell me I should have done it before entering the station, which is fair enough. The reason I lost it a bit is because he had his nose poking out the top of his mask!
 

bramling

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Ashamed to admit I had a bit of a go at one of the pink vest brigade at Euston station. Pounced on me as I was mid putting my mask on to tell me I should have done it before entering the station, which is fair enough. The reason I lost it a bit is because he had his nose poking out the top of his mask!

Euston has been particularly oppressive for some reason, especially the Underground station.

I can fully understand why you had a go - there’s people who seem to have latched on to masks as though anyone not wearing one is some kind of diseased monster, whilst like you observed misusing them themselves.

We might all be better off if some of these faux-terrified types just boarded themselves up in their own homes, or perhaps more realistically just wore proper medical-grade masks to protect themselves, then they wouldn’t have to worry about what others are doing or not doing.
 
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greyman42

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Ashamed to admit I had a bit of a go at one of the pink vest brigade at Euston station. Pounced on me as I was mid putting my mask on to tell me I should have done it before entering the station, which is fair enough. The reason I lost it a bit is because he had his nose poking out the top of his mask!
What was fair enough about it? It does not sound very fair to me and i can understand you having a go at the pink vest.
 

Domh245

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Ashamed to admit I had a bit of a go at one of the pink vest brigade at Euston station. Pounced on me as I was mid putting my mask on to tell me I should have done it before entering the station, which is fair enough. The reason I lost it a bit is because he had his nose poking out the top of his mask!

Legally you aren't obliged to put the mask on before entering the station, so doubly poor showing from the pink vest!
 

bramling

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Legally you aren't obliged to put the mask on before entering the station, so doubly poor showing from the pink vest!

The numbers of staff seem to have exploded around some stations in the last couple of weeks, seemingly the NR-managed stations.

At Euston there seem to be two brands of “pink vest” staff - some floating around the mainline station whilst others line the entrance to the LU station, the latter seeming to eyeball and size up anyone entering whether they’re masked up or not, they’re so thickly spread that any intending passenger literally has to find a path through them. On occasions they’ve been seen standing either side of the entrance, masks lowered beneath their mouth and talking to each other, so to enter the station one has to walk between them, and right through any droplets coming out of their mouths whilst they talk to each other.

Not to be outdone, there’s then other staff floating around in tactical vests with “RESPONSE” emblazoned across their front and back. I’m not sure what they’re there to respond to, but I presume it wouldn’t be for any operational railway-related incident. Then there’s others with something along the lines of events & security on their uniform (I forget the exact wording). Both these groups simply seem to be floating around.

Add in BTP and it’s all fairly oppressive, although I’ve been across the concourse probably a dozen times in the last week and nothing been said about lack of mask, and I’d say at least half of the uniformed staff on the mainline station aren’t wearing them.
 

Bletchleyite

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Euston seems to have become overrun with contract security guards recently (even before March) and they do not do anything useful, rather a waste of money, really. If they want to keep people to one side of the 8-11 ramp, I'd suggest a set of barriers and one way/keep right (due to the layout) signage would be preferable - cheaper and less impolite.

It doesn't surprise me that they've switched to barking orders about masks.
 

Jayden99

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What was fair enough about it? It does not sound very fair to me and i can understand you having a go at the pink vest.
I'm of the belief that because I was in uniform (even for another non Euston TOC) I should be trying to set an example to passengers when I'm in a customer area. I was totally on autopilot when I walked into the station though, habits are hard to form it seems
 

Jayden99

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To get back on topic though, I've noticed trains are much busier again this weekend, I know someone who commutes in on the Victoria line and she was saying it was standing room only. Still seems to be a lot of compliance with mask rules though, maybe 85%-90% when I've been out and about.
 

LordCreed

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Worked my first train in a little while yesterday. I noticed a number of passengers that would put their mask on in a hurry every time I walked through the coach.
 

route101

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Ashamed to admit I had a bit of a go at one of the pink vest brigade at Euston station. Pounced on me as I was mid putting my mask on to tell me I should have done it before entering the station, which is fair enough. The reason I lost it a bit is because he had his nose poking out the top of his mask!

I had the same at Glasgow Central , i do feel for them in their job. I never had a go at them.
 

Romsey

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Two observations:
Listening to teenagers talking earlier today, there already seems to be a "market" for discharged asthma inhalers. If and when they are challenged they can waive an inhaler and say they are asthmatic. ( I have to admit a sneaking regard for their thinking.)
In the same town centre, one of the self appointed mask mafia started ranting at a smart teenager who as he was walking in an open street with no requirement to wear a mask. During her tirade he didn't say much, then this old dear said, " I'll report you to the police!". The reply was superb, " Yes, can I help you then, I'm a trainee Police Officer." I don't care if he is or isn't in the police force, he held his nerve very well for a superb put down.
 

takno

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I had the same at Glasgow Central , i do feel for them in their job. I never had a go at them.
The difference at Glasgow Central is that they do at least have the law on their side there. It's a pointless job but someone's gonna do it.
 

PupCuff

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They do not need to have been specifically authorized; they can already give a passenger a byelaw 12.2 direction to put a mask on and remove them if they didn’t, but we really are getting into angels on drawing-pins as no guard is going to do that in a month of Sundays.

I'm afraid that is a selective (mis)interpretation of the byelaws. The relevant byelaw actually states:

An authorised person may, in an emergency or in other circumstances in which he believes he should act in the interests of safety, issue instructions to any person on the railway. No person shall, without good cause, disobey such instructions

There are plenty of examples of such good cause which could include citing that the law allows exemptions etc. "Put a mask on now." "No, it could kill me" - good cause.

It's also worth noting that a guard or other member of rail staff will have been told what the law says and what they are expected to do to maintain safety as part of their training; as front line rail staff are not expected to be heath and safety professionals, they are trained with the safety risks/mitigations/responsibilities etc they need to be aware of in respect of their roles. To invoke this particular byelaw the authorised person has to 'believe he should act in the interests of safety'. If they have previously been told by their employer that such circumstances are not grounds for enforcement then they have no reason to believe that they have a requirement to act in the interests of safety and therefore it reads that invoking this byelaw under such circumstances would have no basis in law.

You are of course correct in saying that no conductor would even bother trying, however. Making up your own safety rules and trying to intimidate customers is a quick way to find yourself a new career path.
 

6Gman

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BTP are exempt.

I think people should just respect the rules and other people. If everyone does that there are no issues.

Interestingly, at my work some members of the general public are criticising some staff for wearing masks. Can’t win really, but people should respect personal preference.

Most passengers I’ve seen are still wearing masks (and 1 BTP was too today that I saw).

Entirely agree, but thought for others seems a difficult concept for some people.
 

fishquinn

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I know someone who commutes in on the Victoria line and she was saying it was standing room only
After months of it being empty it actually brought a smile to my face to see it busy again
 

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island

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I'm afraid that is a selective (mis)interpretation of the byelaws. The relevant byelaw actually states:
No misinterpretation or selectiveness has occurred save by your failure to infer the obvious “subject to the usual exceptions”.
You are of course correct in saying that no conductor would even bother trying, however
I am glad we agree on this much.
 

Dstock7080

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BTP positioned on platforms this morning, holding and checking each train at:
Dagenham Heathway
Whitechapel
Aldgate East
South Kensington
then removing non-wearers
 
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talldave

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So what are the BTP doing that prevents them from passing on the virus? If we all knew then there wouldn't be a problem??
Pure hypocrisy. It undermines what little remaining credibility they have and shows that they consider it pointless.
 
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First journey on a train today since these silly new rules were introduced. I'd say about 70-80% compliance. Surprising amount of people wearing them at stations too, considering it's not a legal requirement there. Was only asked once by some rail workers if I had a mask at a station, no actual station staff seemed bothered. Wore it on the train but still seems very useless and silly considering how quiet the trains are along with high backed seats.
 

DelW

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My first train journey since early March today. I'd say > 90% compliance on trains, maybe 40% - 50% on platforms (but these were open air with loads of space, so not an issue really). 100% on local bus home. Wearing a woven cotton face covering for 2 & 1/2 hours wasn't actually uncomfortable. Gate lines in use at start and finish stations.
 
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