What do YOU understand by "first class"?

[digitaltoast]

Here's an odd one - the background is contained in the letter I wrote to XC

This was the first time I chose to travel first class as the difference was only £6 (£18 vs £12) more, so I calculated that the benefits provided by first class (sandwiches etc) would be good value for money. The seat was a secondary consideration.

However, when I went to collect my refreshments, I was told:
"Sorry, but those are retail sandwiches, they forgot to give us any complimentary sandwiches at Reading and we can't give retail sandwiches out".
She then gave me a WARM thimble-sized can of Coke. Although the person herself was polite and apologetic, I can't help thinking there is something wrong with this procedure.

Aside from the tiny can of Coke being WARM (ugh!), the reason I am writing is because I feel that if someone messed up, that is not my fault and I should not be penalised for it.
If a procedure breaks down and no complimentary sandwiches are available, they should be able to give out retail sandwiches - if there is a small loss on the retail side, this can surely be accounted for by the lacking procedure?

I'm not asking for a full refund, of course, just the difference between the first and standard class fare (or even a voucher to upgrade the next same journey to first, or an XC food voucher for £5 perhaps?).

And here's the reply:

Thank you for getting in touch about your journey.

I am concerned we didn't offer our complimentary refreshments service when you travelled with us recently. I understand how annoying this must have been and thank you for letting us know.

Although things can sometimes go wrong this service is something you've every right to expect. We clearly let you down this time and I am sorry. However, all refreshments are complimentary so I am afraid that on this occasion I am unable to offer you a refund. But, we do follow it up when we hear that we've not given our customers the service we should. So I will certainly speak to the manager responsible for this area.

Now, I'm not going to make a big issue over £6, but out of my own interest, I called XC, and the conversation went like:

"Hi, can all passengers get the complimentary refreshments."
"If you have a first class ticket, yes"
"Oh, but I have a letter that says they are complimentary".
"Yes, for first class".
"As part of the service then?"
"Yes"
"So these are something that are paid for?"
"Yes"
"Doesn't complimentary mean free, though?" (At this point I was starting to confuse myself!).
"It's part of the first class service".
"Ok, thanks, bye".

I'm not sure I learnt much more from that; but this does bring about a bit of an oddity. If, as sold, a premium product is a package of items and some of those items are not provided, isn't that something trading standards should be interested in?

Now, before anyone gets too excitable, of course, I'm not going to do that over £6. But it did make me wonder - what's the point of the ticket then?!
At least I now know to save my £6 as it's better spent in conjunction with my Bite card and a visit to Upper Crust than on the copy of The Times and mouthful of warm Coke!!

 

[me123]

Had I been in that position, I'd have either refunded the difference, or given you a complimentary FC upgrade on your next journey; either way you get exactly what you paid for. As long as they do follow this up, however, at least something would have come out of writing the letter.

 

[Mintona]

Did you put in option three just so voyagerdude didn't feel left out?

 

[Techniquest]

I would have expected more than just a can of warm cola...I'd have made sure I'd have gotten my money's worth of drinks at the least.

I've yet to go FC with XC, but if I ever do I might ask the on-board crew what complimentary items I can get that day before upgrading. If it's only warm drinks, then I'll stay in SC, even if it means standing up.

I've gotten too used to the idea of at-seat power sockets in SC (thanks to FGW) so going FC without power sockets and plenty of complimentary snacks/drinks would not be my cup of tea now. Quite honestly there's no point on many routes anyway!

 

[Darandio]

Would this of happened when Virgin were running the service?
I am not going to trawl through old threads but I can remember a few posts where there were some good comments about the FC service, or was that for West Coast?
Someone enlighten me.

 

[glynn80]

At work we have the same issue and when selling tickets we can never 100% confirm to passengers they will get a meal as they are "complimentary" and thus if we wish to give them we will but the extra ticket price is not for the meal only for the seat in that particular carriage (all legal rubbish to me).

 

[Max]

I would have expected them to give you some kind of small token voucher to at least attempt to attract you into their first class on another occasion.

 

[Phoenix]

I really don't know why you all expect so much for two reasons one being that this is the railways we are talking about so all is not as it seems and sometimes It might be the case that first class does actually just involve big comfy seats and a nice warm carrige I mean not to put anyone down but you get what you get and you should like it.
No offense intended.

 

[AlexS]

What a load of crap Phoenix.

You pay for first class to get a greater level of service than the norm on XC ie I regularly find myself sat on the vestibule floor outside the shop.

If I wanted to pay more just for a seat I'd bribe someone to give me their seat and sit on the floor (which is any case is quite comfy if you pick the right location).

 

[me123]

To be honest, if I were to pay for complimentary refreshments and then to be told I'd have to purchase them, I'd be rather annoyed. When you pay a First Class fare, which is usually about double the price, you really should expect to get everything on offer. If not, they are in breach of contract in my personal opinion.

Unlike, for example, failing to provide a trolley service to Standard Class passengers (the price of which is not included in the ticket) complimentary refreshments should always be available to First Class passengers where advertised, as this is therefore included in the ticket price (ie, they pay for unlimited refreshments as a part of their ticket).

 

[glynn80]

To be honest, if I were to pay for complimentary refreshments and then to be told I'd have to purchase them, I'd be rather annoyed. When you pay a First Class fare, which is usually about double the price, you really should expect to get everything on offer. If not, they are in breach of contract in my personal opinion.

I think you've missed the point of the word COMPLIMENTARY, when a TOC sells a first class ticket they are not selling the refreshments but the first class carriage and first class seat (if you get neither of these you are entitled to the difference). Some TOCs then offer complimentary refreshments of which they have no obligation to give out and all are subject to availability. If a TOC sells you a ticket and guarentees you refreshments for free then yes they would be in breach of contract but for you to assume they will be on every train is your own assumption and in contract law the TOC would not be liable.

 

[me123]

Hmm... fair enough but it's still advertising a product that isn't available. Part of the first class experience for me would be complimentary refreshments; I could easily live without the big chairs and "nicer ambiance" unless I needed space to work (which I generally don't).

Even if there's nothing legally that can be done, it's still wrong not to provide the service they're saying they do, and in this scenario I have come to the conclusion that they didn't.

 

[devon_metro]

Simply Email them back saying this is no acceptable and demand to speak to somebody in higher authority or your business will choose not to travel on XC again (play the big wealthy business card of course )

 

[glynn80]

I'm pretty sure wherever advertising of free refreshments on TOCs first class service the word complimentary is always used. They never advertise without of that word due to that reason it is not guarenteed. If you can live without the comfy seat then the difference in ticket price is very likely not to equal the goods you are recieving (I realise in some circumstances a few pounds may differentiate the Advance fares but even a few founds can buy a pack of biscuits and a carton of orange juice).

 

[me123]

To be fair, I'd never travel First Class anyway unless I were to go on Virgin where a meal is available, or on a Sleeper. Even on Virgin I can live with Standard Class. Otherwise, I feel standard class is sufficient.

 

[Pumbaa]

It depends where I'm going. I frequently have to do London to Manchester, Liverpool, Glasgow and Edinburgh. For these distances, I usually go FC if the price difference is easily overcome. Otherwise I don't bother. And NatEx FC, (I also travel to Durham a fair bit) I don't bother with really now as it's not worth it compared to VT

 

[Polarbear]

I'd like to see any airline worth it's salt telling it's first class customers there was no food available!

I've been at the receiving end of this sort of treatment from Cross Country in the past - albeit run by Virgin at the time.

Historically, 1st class on trains has been a matter of wider seats & more room for which you paid a fare roughly 50% above the standard class fare. However, since privitasion, many of the longer distance TOC's have added "complementary" snack, food & drink to the 1st class package. This varies of course, with Virgin being at one end of the spectrum (meals) & NXEA at the other, (nothing free), as regards what is provided on a "complementary" basis.

However, whilst doing so, the 1st class fares have also increased steeply too. Therfore, these "complementary" items are in fact paid for in the fare.

I feel that any TOC that states it's not obliged to provide the advertised complemetary snack is a) painting themselves into a corner and b) being less than honest with their customers. It would be interesting to see how a mention of the trades description act would make the TOC's react!

I agree that for the sake of £6, it's not worth the hassle, but I'd be most miffed if I had a 1st open from say Chester to London at around 300 sheets & been told something similar. My complaint letter would not have been for the faint hearted!

On one occasion, I boarded a pendo at Crewe going to London. Sat in 1st class to a table of dirty dishes. I was offered a coffee but the guy was going to refill the dirty cup that the previous occupant had left. He seemed most indignant when I asked for a fresh cup!

I wasn't offered any food - it was assumed I'd been on the train all the way from Glasgow. I complained to Virgin & was refunded the difference between the 1st & 2nd fares, based on the ticket held, (an advance fare).

So if anyone doesn't get their "freebies" - complain.

 

[richa2002]

I think First Class is a great way to travel and usually can be done at reasonable prices! Not a lot better than sitting back on an East Midlands Trains HST right next to the power car on a weekday with at-seat service on a quiet evening train and a Marston cooling fan if you're lucky . Something I will be doing from Luton to Sheffield and back on Tuesday for only £32 on a 16-25 railcard. Not bad value in my opinion.

 

[Phoenix]

What a load of crap Phoenix.

You pay for first class to get a greater level of service than the norm on XC ie I regularly find myself sat on the vestibule floor outside the shop.

If I wanted to pay more just for a seat I'd bribe someone to give me their seat and sit on the floor (which is any case is quite comfy if you pick the right location).

Alex all I am trying to say is that if you don't like it deal with it rather than people saying ''oh my coke is too warm''.
If you know me well enough from my post's I try to keep a fair opinion on every discussion.
And if you want to bribe people then im sure you will have no problem in getting a nice comfy seat with all the free food you want but personally as someone who has to deal with the daily grind of catching the train I like to keep it realistic.
And as for the comment of saying my opinion is a load of crap it wasn't quite well received so in future try some manners .