What happened to tram route numbers?

[ALEMASTER]

Hi
Sheffield has four routes:
Y, Yellow, from Middlewood to Meadowhall
B, Blue, from Malin Bridge to Halfway
P, Purple from Cathedral to Herdings Park
TT, no colour, Tram-Train from Cathedral to Parkgate

The trams display the letters on the relevant colour background next to the destination. The whole trams are not branded to a particular route, though the tram-trains are confined to certain sections.
Hope that is of interest.

And here is the network map...

 

[U-Bahnfreund]

In respect to London (Croydon Tramlink in popular parlance) I believe there were two main reasons why route numbers were dropped:-
a) The public hardly ever used them in conversation, referring instead to the destinations
b) For operational convenience: e.g. some early morning Addington line trams work through to Wimbledon, rather than round the West Croydon loop.

Regarding b): that's not really an argument, you could just have the tram change the number at Church Street, or have a footnote in the timetable saying that it goes to Wimbledon. It's not really that hard.

Using your argument, why have bus route numbers? Why not just have a destination + via points?

I only meant for a simple network, for more complex networks I didn't say it would get rid of numbers, if a destination is reachable by more than one route which go different paths then for intermediate stops it would obviously help to have some form of clear differentiation be it a colour, number or letter.

I see your point, but on the other hand, trams are always part of the bigger picture transport network, and I don't think everybody necessarily knows the extent of the tram systems in each city. Regular commuters and transport enthusiasts may, but do other people?

Manchester Metrolink is of course more a Metro rail service with a few bits of tramway rather than a traditional tram service, the network map colour codes the different routes but only the destination is displayed on the vehicle

I actually asked TfGM why the line letters didn't show on the trams, they said they wanted to wait until the 2nd city crossing was finished and service patterns had settled down. But then they ditched them altogehter ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Except in the case of Croydon, where numbers are far easier communicated than destinations with visitors and people who either speak little English or don't speak English well, of which there are plenty in the locality.

So much for an inclusive London.

+1, same with Overground lines.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Regarding b): that's not really an argument, you could just have the tram change the number at Church Street, or have a footnote in the timetable saying that it goes to Wimbledon. It's not really that hard.

Milton Keynes has a bus route that does this. The 4 operates from Bletchley to the centre, then 2 out of the 6 buses per hour change to 14s to Wolverton. There's a note on the blind about it. The reason for this is that at some times of day 4s and 14s are totally separate due to the latter being tendered (I think).

So if you can do that for buses you can for trams.

I've also seen numbering schemes like a "12" being half a 1 and half a 2.

 

[geoffk]

Melbourne tram routes are all numbered but this is a large system and the numbering, which appears illogical, goes back many years.

 

[hexagon789]

I see your point, but on the other hand, trams are always part of the bigger picture transport network, and I don't think everybody necessarily knows the extent of the tram systems in each city. Regular commuters and transport enthusiasts may, but do other people?

True but surely numbers would be of little use to 'other people' unless a destination is given in addition and to those people a destination with a list of major waypoints (via such-and-such etc) would surely be more useful?

 

[ARIC]

I know Metrolink trialled both letters and numbers (and I'm sure at one point there were different numbers for different directions on the map), but then they were dropped. I'm not sure they really utilised them other than on the maps themselves. The current colours only seem to feature on the maps and on travel planners like Citymapper and Google Maps.

I think the current system of identifying a service using it's final destination, and the line named after the final destination on whatever side of the city zone it's on (Ashton Lyne, Eccles Line, Airport Line etc.) works pretty well.

 

[Pakenhamtrain]

Melbourne tram routes are all numbered but this is a large system and the numbering, which appears illogical, goes back many years.

https://www.danielbowen.com/2012/01/11/route-numbers/#comment-68835
Once upon a time there was logic to the numbering. But with various changes it's gone out the window. There were a bunch of other numbers used for diversions and depot runs. Now replaced by the a and d suffix.
https://www.danielbowen.com/2008/09/08/the-secret-seven/
11 and 12 are now thier own routes after the split of the 112.

The 55 was extended along route 8 to Toorak with it becoming the 58. The other section of Route 8 up to Moreland was part of an extended Route 6.