What would you like to see in the next Great Western Franchise?

[TT-ONR-NRN]

You are posting insinuations with no shred of evidence. Rather immature, really.

Geez - I don’t really think it’s the end of the world purely because he doesn’t have any evidence!

Moving on... if you withdraw the Pen Mill SWR services you could get hourly Weymouth GWR trains if rolling stock allowed.

 

[molecrochip]

But in the case of SWR, surely they shouldn't ever need to send a DMU to Fratton at all, once all the internal cascades are complete? It has been suggested over the last few years that running 158s to/from the Portsmouth area is partially done in order to maintain traction knowledge for Fratton crews, well that might have to stop if they can't easily stable there...

However I don't think GWR stabling at Eastleigh overnight actually makes it any easier for them - if XC are any precedent they might not ever have a train crew depot actually AT Eastleigh.

One other small point though, is that one of the early GW trains off Fratton runs to Brighton from Portsmouth Harbour, as a shortened working to start the limited Brighton - Great Malvern service up. It wouldn't actually need to run via Portsmouth at all, it could just enter service eastbound at Fareham on its usual route...

From Dec 18, the extra South Hampshire locals and Lymington Branch will no longer use DMUs - the stock is committed to the Exeter line and Fratton crews won't retain knowledge. EMUs will replace.

SWR proposed upgrading Fratton depot and with no need for fuel roads proposed that FGW relocate to Eastleigh. DfT agreed. Not sure if crew depot will move. Short working to Brighton is to retain route knowledge of Hilsea-Bedhampton.

 

[spookywestie]

You are posting insinuations with no shred of evidence. Rather immature, really.

This kid posts on everything he can for the sake of it, probably to get a high post count or something equally as ridiculous.

 

[bussnapperwm]

More frequent trains in the Cotswolds:

2tph North Cotswolds-1x fast to Malvern/Hereford, 1x stopping to Worcester/maybe Droitwich?

At least 1tph South Cotswolds, extended to Worcester (or Droitwich/Kidderminster in place of the above option), CALLING AT ASHCHURCH STATION.

Also, an hourly Bristol-Worcester service, rather than 2 hourly at present.

Have the ones you'd turn at Worcester/ Droitwich extend to Stourbridge and Birmingham/The proposed abellio station at Brierley Hill (the latter being historical Oxford and Worcester/Great Western territory and the former being a option to compete against Chiltern and London Northwestern on the Birmingham to London flow)

 

[Hartington]

I was under the impression that a regular, hourly, Weymouth service was/is impractical because of the lack of a passing place between Pen Mill and Maiden Newton?

 

[Hartington]

Living near Castle Cary I've occasionally wondered why there isn't a down service towards Taunton before 1030. "Occasionally" probably explains why - the market is small but it removes employment and education options. It also makes hospital appointments difficult - essentially you can't plan on getting to Musgrave Park Hospital before 1130; one of the things about rural medicine is that certain conditions are only treated in "centres of excellence" and Musgrave Park, Taunton is one such center. Without an earlier train the alternative is a car. Period; there is no bus.

 

[MidnightFlyer]

I was under the impression that a regular, hourly, Weymouth service was/is impractical because of the lack of a passing place between Pen Mill and Maiden Newton?

20.5 mins according to a train I just pulled up on RTT, including a total of 90 seconds given in dwell for the request stops at Chetnole, Yetminster and Thornford (what lovely place names they are by the way); so it appears to be possible, just alas not very practicle as something would have to have rather a long wait somewhere for its crossing move.

Dorchester West to Yeovil PM appears to get very close to 30 mins if you were to knock out the allowances given for the calls at the three request halts, but that would leave absolutely no margin for error at all!

 

[HarleyDavidson]

This kid posts on everything he can for the sake of it, probably to get a high post count or something equally as ridiculous.

And what have you provided in knowledge or anything else which can be construed as as useful.

 

[SpacePhoenix]

the stock is committed to the Exeter line and Fratton crews won't retain knowledge. EMUs will replace.

Do very many drivers based at Fratton currently sign the 158/159s?

 

[jimm]

The Didcot won't be going onto the fasts until after Maidenhead or Slough anyway.
One of Theresa May's points on her local manifesto (during the election), was the pledge to keep the GW semi fast at Twyford & Maidenhead, after crossrail.

Perhaps the * technique could be used, at Paddington * is shown on the departure screens to denote a fast train to Reading.

The fast Class 1 387s services starting from/heading to Didcot will mostly weave between the relief lines and the main lines at Maidenhead East.

There is the odd one that switches at Slough West, while the 0601 from Didcot, which is non-stop Didcot to Reading, will run on the up main line all the way, so is booked for a platform 10 call just after 06.15 and will catch early birds heading into Paddington before the long-distance services start to show up from further west.

Great election pledge there from the PM - keeping some GW services to give Twyford and Maidenhead (and the Henley and Marlow branch passengers) quicker services than Crossrail has been the plan for many years.

Re ticket machines, I believe GWR plans to redeploy a number from the stations between Acton and Langley once Transport for London takes over management of those stations from December and gives them a makeover and installs new machines to Crossrail specifications.

 

[HarleyDavidson]

Do very many drivers based at Fratton currently sign the 158/159s?

Just 1 large link does. I suspect that if Fratton loses its diesel work, then an exodus may well begin, as a lot of them as peed off with doing electric work and doing double London's and I don't blame them either. But that's the diagramming section for you.

 

[pompeyfan]

Just 1 large link does. I suspect that if Fratton loses its diesel work, then an exodus may well begin, as a lot of them as peed off with doing electric work and doing double London's and I don't blame them either. But that's the diagramming section for you.

That doesn’t tally up with my account of things, was under the impression there’s 3 reasonable size links, 2 of which are then further split into an “A” and a “B”.

Link 1A does 158/159 as well as MPV work, link 1B is solely DMU & Desiro from what I understand.

I know quite a few GW guys and girls at Fratton, and they’ve never mentioned about the units (or the crew) being moved. Like I say, my impression was that the extra stabling roads at Fratton were going to be the track that was proposed as an intermodal Yard.

 

[HarleyDavidson]

MPV work was lost as far as I know.

Link 1 is MT and generally doesn't sign West of Totton yard, Link 2 goes to Poole, but that could have changed.

 

[SpacePhoenix]

Would the Link 2 drivers be the ones to do the Lymington branch when that's using a 158?

 

[pompeyfan]

That doesn’t tally up with my account of things, was under the impression there’s 3 reasonable size links, 2 of which are then further split into an “A” and a “B”.

Link 1A does 158/159 as well as MPV work, link 1B is solely DMU and Defrom what I understand.

I know quite a few GW guys and girls at Fratton, and they’ve never mentioned about the units (or the crew) being moved. Like I say, my impression was that the extra stabling roads at Fratton were going to be the track that was proposed as an intermodal Yard.

MPV work was lost as far as I know.

Link 1 is MT and generally doesn't sign West of Totton yard, Link 2 goes to Poole, but that could have changed.

MPV work under subcontract to Balfour Beatty. Correct in what your saying elsewhere. Link 2 also sign Cobham.

Lymington is only booked Bournemouth, although it’s not unheard of for a Fratton MPV man to cover it as they have traction and route. Although we’re getting massively off topic here.

 

[infobleep]

So how exactly is anyone supposed to get from Reading (major interchange station) to Gatwick airport (major international airport)? Lug their bags across a platform at Guildford?

Even when the route was operated by BR's Southern Region, trains ran through Guildford to and from Redhill and Tonbridge, then someone noticed there was this airport south of Redhill that a few people wanted to get to and started sending trains there...



Why? Chiltern really isn't interested in services that do not link to and from London and even then it regards the need to serve Stratford-upon-Avon as a nuisance. The Banbury-Oxford (and beyond) local service exists to connect the north of Oxfordshire with Oxford and the Thames Valley, an area which is served by GWR, so is a far more logical operational fit than Chiltern.

The Basingstoke route is going to end up with 25kv overhead wires sooner or later - so what on earth would be the point of it being run by an operator that does not have any stock with ready-to-run 25kv equipment (for fairly obvious reasons...), or any spare dmus, and would not want the headache of running a 25kv micro-fleet to operate a short-distance shuttle service?

Don't know a lot about the merits or otherwise of the Hampshire routes but a fairly obvious issue would be the total lack of any GWR traincrew or rolling stock facilities in the area. What would be the point of setting up such things when the service functions perfectly well under current arrangements?

Rather like giving SWR the Barnstaple route. Why should a TOC that is largely focused on London commuter services have anything to do with running a local stopping service into deepest North Devon? As opposed to leaving the job to the TOC that has been running the route for more than a decade and done a good job of it - and of boosting business on the other West Country branches too.

Would you think it silly the idea of South Western Railway running trains to Bristol if they didn't already run services? I mean Bristol isn't commuter belt London.

I don't know if the Barnstaple line would work practically but SWR does have experience of single line working to Exeter at least.

 

[HowardGWR]

20.5 mins according to a train I just pulled up on RTT, including a total of 90 seconds given in dwell for the request stops at Chetnole, Yetminster and Thornford (what lovely place names they are by the way); so it appears to be possible, just alas not very practicle as something would have to have rather a long wait somewhere for its crossing move.

Dorchester West to Yeovil PM appears to get very close to 30 mins if you were to knock out the allowances given for the calls at the three request halts, but that would leave absolutely no margin for error at all!

How much does a passing loop cost? No land would be required (was double track). Adrian Shooter would build one for us in his franchise bid, if he were in charge.

 

[reddragon]

True it probably would be easier but for passengers machines on stations would be much more useful

When the ticket office is closed morning rush hour, because GWR do not provide holiday / sick cover and the long queue at the 1 machine ends in it breaking of course machines at RDG would be a great idea and would be well used!

 

[Clip]

I should have elaborated then.

Prior to the train being boarded at its origin.

But this is a waste due to seats becoming vacant throughout the journey of the train and its nice to know that passengers with walk up fares can actually reserve a seat

 

[greaterwest]

But this is a waste due to seats becoming vacant throughout the journey of the train and its nice to know that passengers with walk up fares can actually reserve a seat

Like I said, it should be done before the train is boarded at its origin. It’s unfair on those who don’t know to reserve beforehand, which is likely to include the elderly, and parents with young children.

Vacant unreserved seats can and will become occupied during the journey, as they always have done on GWR.

 

[HarleyDavidson]

Perhaps HSS trains should be treated like E*, TGV & Thalys. Compulsory reservations.

 

[Clip]

Like I said, it should be done before the train is boarded at its origin. It’s unfair on those who don’t know to reserve beforehand, which is likely to include the elderly, and parents with young children.

Vacant unreserved seats can and will become occupied during the journey, as they always have done on GWR.

From experience those people you mention would more than likely have already got reservations when they booked their tickets..

And cheaper than me who may have just had to travel on the day.

 

[jimm]

Would you think it silly the idea of South Western Railway running trains to Bristol if they didn't already run services? I mean Bristol isn't commuter belt London.

I don't know if the Barnstaple line would work practically but SWR does have experience of single line working to Exeter at least.

The SWR Bristol service is pretty silly really - a remnant of a service that was started to link Cardiff and Bristol with Waterloo when Eurostar operated there. In a couple of weeks' time it will be a decade since Eurostar left Waterloo for St Pancras.

What exactly is the point of this service now? A nice little slice of ORCATS money, perhaps? Maybe there really is an insatiable demand for direct services between Bristol, Bath and Woking, but I have my doubts.

There is a slight difference between the Salisbury-Exeter route and the Exeter-Barnstaple line, with multiple request stops, just two passing loops, etc, etc. The Exeter-Salisbury timetable is critically dependent on trains reaching the various loops on time - start sending trains off into North Devon and the potential for importing delays to the route east of Exeter is obvious, with problems likely to snowball along the route once a train misses its slot.

Just because something looks like a great idea on paper, or because such and such happened until 50 years ago, because of some bit of railway rivalry in the mid-19th century, does not mean it makes sense now. For all the LSWR/Southern associations, the Exeter-Barnsstaple line began life as a broad gauge railway and there were broad gauge goods trains between Exeter and Crediton right up to the GWR gauge change in 1892.

 

[cactustwirly]

Have the ones you'd turn at Worcester/ Droitwich extend to Stourbridge and Birmingham/The proposed abellio station at Brierley Hill (the latter being historical Oxford and Worcester/Great Western territory and the former being a option to compete against Chiltern and London Northwestern on the Birmingham to London flow)

Are you serious? Have you ever been on the Cotswold line?
Never in a million years will it compete on London to Birmingham flows. I mean its slow as hell, no one is going to spends 3+ hours on a train, when they can spend just 90 minutes on another route.

 

[HarleyDavidson]

Are you serious? Have you ever been on the Cotswold line?
Never in a million years will it compete on London to Birmingham flows. I mean its slow as hell, no one is going to spends 3+ hours on a train, when they can spend just 90 minutes on another route.

Ever experienced XC? It's why I drive.

 

[bussnapperwm]

Are you serious? Have you ever been on the Cotswold line?
Never in a million years will it compete on London to Birmingham flows. I mean its slow as hell, no one is going to spends 3+ hours on a train, when they can spend just 90 minutes on another route.

Yes I have, by 165, all the way to London after a particularly tight connection off a 150 a few years ago!

Those with time to kill/would prefer a potentially cheaper option/those who want to see the Cotswold countryside/those who have an addiction for HSTs...

Ever experienced XC? It's why I drive.

Think that's bad...try doing Sheffield to Manchester via Pacer or even Worcester to London on a 165! The 142 almost drove me to drink!

Cross Countrys luggage racks on the Voyagers are a breath of sanity compared to the other two traction types mentioned.

 

[FenMan]

Ever experienced XC? It's why I drive.

XC's capacity to transport people from A to B, their raison d'être, is so limited I doubt they're overly worried about people choosing to drive. They're much more focused on yield, hence them offering Advances to the unknowing at pennies below the price of walk on tickets.

 

[Parallel]

The SWR Bristol service is pretty silly really - a remnant of a service that was started to link Cardiff and Bristol with Waterloo when Eurostar operated there. In a couple of weeks' time it will be a decade since Eurostar left Waterloo for St Pancras.

What exactly is the point of this service now? A nice little slice of ORCATS money, perhaps? Maybe there really is an insatiable demand for direct services between Bristol, Bath and Woking, but I have my doubts.

From personal experience, they have got more popular over the last couple of years or so. A fair few board the morning Waterloo service from Bradford on Avon and Trowbridge and Warminster, with many remaining on the train past Salisbury. It also, of course provides an extra service between Bristol and Salisbury. Plus, they have fantastic advances from these stations; I got a first class advance Trowbridge - Waterloo for £12 this year. Standard class was £9!

 

[Envoy]

With increased frequencies, the GWR will have almost a turn up and go service on the main routes. One must therefore question why turn up & go passengers must pay such high fares compared to those who pre-book in Advance for specific trains? OK, I know what you are thinking - they must have cheaper advance fares so as to spread the loadings.

Let us suppose that someone pre-books an advance fare (11 weeks ahead) from Heathrow (via bus link to Reading) for some place out west - such as Bath or Cardiff. They are not sure when they will clear immigration and reach Reading so they play safe and pre-book a train for say 11am having landed at 8am. By good fortune, they arrive at Reading at 9.50am and then have to sit and wait while trains depart - with empty seats, for their destination as they must wait for the 11am train. Such passengers - who could be on their way, then 'clutter up’ stations. I have used Reading as an example because it caters for lots of Heathrow passengers, however, the same unfriendly user system exists for people who have a business meeting in say London and arrive at Paddington early enough to catch a non pre-booked train only to end up hanging around. This is surely not in the best interests of the TOC & certainly not the travelling public.

What I would like to see (for all rail travel) is a system where we have 3 price levels - peak, cheap and shoulder. Each train would be priced according to normal predictive demand and marked as such on the timetables. Some journeys - such as those in the middle of the day, could be really cheap and may even attract the Megabus crowd. Where a passenger is on a train on a journey that goes from cheap to peak, they end up with a shoulder fare.

So, given my example with Reading, the person who arrives at say 10am but booked to catch the 11am, assuming that both trains are ‘cheap’ would have the right to just board the earlier service and be on their way. If a person arrived late at say 5pm (peak) having already pre-booked a cheap rate train at 3pm, they would simply have to go to the ticket office and pay the price difference - taking into account what they have already paid.

Surely, such a system would be more user friendly and make better use of what will become an excellent train service. When special events are taking place - such as rugby in Cardiff, higher rate fares would apply on that day only and in the direction/time of predicted increased flows.

 

[SpacePhoenix]

Would the demand be there for the Reading-Basingstoke services to be extended (if the paths exist) to Southampton Central? It could possibly mean that Weymouth/Poole-Waterloo trains (SWR) wouldn't need to stop at Basingstoke