Where can CrossCountry trains reach 125mph?

[pompeyfan]

I’m not fully up to speed on XC route knowledge but how much of their routes are 125mph running? And how much of it is that line speed achievable?

 

[Bayum]

I’m not fully up to speed on XC route knowledge but how much of their routes are 125mph running? And how much of it is that line speed achievable?

ECML between Edinburgh and Doncaster is the area that sticks out for me.

 

[Bayum]

Potentially, somewhere around Reading and GWML land?
Not sure if any of the Manchester services have 125mph running on any sections.

 

[class26]

Derby to Birmingham is also largely 125 mph (as far as approx Water Orton). South of Brum is 100 mph max

 

[class26]

Potentially, somewhere around Reading and GWML land?
Not sure if any of the Manchester services have 125mph running on any sections.

Wolverhampton to Stafford is 125 mph

 

[Bayum]

I knew there was something between Derby and New Street, but I couldn’t remember if it was 125 or 100mph.

 

[class26]

I knew there was something between Derby and New Street, but I couldn’t remember if it was 125 or 100mph.

Should have also added there is a 50 limit through Burton.

Moderator note: to discuss the possibility of improving speeds through Burton please use the following thread:

https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/is-there-a-case-for-re-aligning-the-track-through-burton-on-trent.205432/

 

[hexagon789]

I’m not fully up to speed on XC route knowledge but how much of their routes are 125mph running? And how much of it is that line speed achievable?

Edinburgh-York, (longest bit is Darlington-York); Derby-Birmingham (two sections either a restriction for Burton iirc); 110 Bristol-Exeter (mostly 90-100, but there is a 7 mile stretch at the higher speed).

 

[class26]

Bristol to Exeter isn`t all 110, it`s only until approx Bridgewater then it becomes 100 mph

 

[PudseyBearHST]

Potentially, somewhere around Reading and GWML land?
Not sure if any of the Manchester services have 125mph running on any sections.

Yes, between Didcot Parkway and just West of Reading it’s all 120/125 although that‘s on the mainline only. Usually, crossscountry run on the relief line.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

105/110/115 is allowed Kidsgrove-Macclesfield on Birmingham-Manchester (110 via Crewe).
125 Bushbury-Stafford.
Some 110 between Birmingham and Coventry.
A bit of 110 in the Cherwell Valley.

 

[swt_passenger]

Yes, between Didcot Parkway and just West of Reading it’s all 120/125 although that‘s on the mainline only. Usually, crossscountry run on the relief line.

A high proportion of XC are booked mains, and have been for some years. It mostly follows the booked platform at Reading, if it’s P3 or one of the main through platforms they’ll normally use the mains between Reading and Didcot, and vice versa.

 

[O L Leigh]

A high proportion of XC are booked mains, and have been for some years. It mostly follows the booked platform at Reading, if it’s P3 or one of the main through platforms they’ll normally use the mains between Reading and Didcot, and vice versa.

Perhaps under the old layout but not any longer. The vast majority of XC services are actually booked to use the Relief lines. Platforming at Reading is not an issue either, as you can access P3, P7 or P8 from the Relief easily by being routed along the Festival line beneath the flyover, and the same on departure.

Besides, the timings don't even really merit 100mph running on that stretch. There's so much time that you could happily amble along that stretch at 80mph. Running on the Main at 125mph would just get you to Reading even earlier.

 

[swt_passenger]

Perhaps under the old layout but not any longer. The vast majority of XC services are actually booked to use the Relief lines. Platforming at Reading is not an issue either, as you can access P3, P7 or P8 from the Relief easily by being routed along the Festival line beneath the flyover, and the same on departure.

Besides, the timings don't even really merit 100mph running on that stretch. There's so much time that you could happily amble along that stretch at 80mph. Running on the Main at 125mph would just get you to Reading even earlier.

Well I can only go by what’s shown as booked on RTT‘s WTT. (Looking ahead a few months to get past the temporary changes).

However the question was where can they do 125 mph, and part of the answer is between Reading and Didcot. At least no one is saying they can’t because they don’t have ATP, which was the wrong answer you usually got a few years ago...

 

[O L Leigh]

Really...? Maybe XC is due an acceleration in timings then.

The ATP issue is certainly true between Westerleigh Jn and Bristol Parkway (not that you'd be able to hit the full 125mph and meet the speed reductions approaching Parkway), but not between Didcot and Reading as you say.

 

[class26]

There`s several northbound services that have had approx 30 minutes sliced off times between Birmingham and Newcastle recently, mainly due to the Derby modifications i believe and according to Modern Railways June edition XC are looking to speed up more services over this area..

 

[Mag_seven]

The ATP issue is certainly true between Westerleigh Jn and Bristol Parkway (not that you'd be able to hit the full 125mph and meet the speed reductions approaching Parkway), but not between Didcot and Reading as you say.

Yes there is a specific "dispensation" for non-ATP fitted trains on the mains between Didcot and Reading in the Western Region Sectional Appendix:

TRAINS NOT FITTED WITH AUTOMATIC TRAIN PROTECTION (ATP) – MAXIMUM PERMITTED SPEED

Trains not fitted with ATP may travel at permissible speeds between Reading West Junction and Didcot East Junction on the main lines. Over all other sections of line shown in Table A of this Sectional Appendix as being ATP fitted, the maximum speed for all trains not fitted with ATP must not exceed 110 mph at any point. This restriction is due to design limits of TPWS lineside equipment for trains fitted only with that system.

 

[Jamesrob637]

Yes, between Didcot Parkway and just West of Reading it’s all 120/125 although that‘s on the mainline only. Usually, crossscountry run on the relief line.

Not allowed to make 125 through Goring and Streatley or Cholsey, not sure about Pangbourne. They're starting to slow down at Tilehurst anyway.

 

[hexagon789]

Bristol to Exeter isn`t all 110, it`s only until approx Bridgewater then it becomes 100 mph

I know, hence why I said mainly 90-100 and only 7 miles of 110.

 

[PudseyBearHST]

Not allowed to make 125 through Goring and Streatley or Cholsey, not sure about Pangbourne. They're starting to slow down at Tilehurst anyway.

Yes which is why I said 120/125 (on the Up Main)

 

[Jamesrob637]

Yes which is why I said 120/125 (on the Up Main)

The Mains were fun in an HST. Virgin used to operate them Bournemouth to the North I believe.

 

[SteelWeelApeal]

Is there no 125 between Derby and Sheffield?
If not, then to summarise it sounds like three rough areas:

• Reading to Didcot
• Birmingham to Derby
• Doncaster to Edinburgh (by far the longest)

Some people have mentioned places between Birmingham and Manchester, but aren’t these only for tilting stock (and therefore not XC)?

 

[Ianno87]

Is there no 125 between Derby and Sheffield?
If not, then to summarise it sounds like three rough areas:

• Reading to Didcot
• Birmingham to Derby
• Doncaster to Edinburgh (by far the longest)

Some people have mentioned places between Birmingham and Manchester, but aren’t these only for tilting stock (and therefore not XC)?

Stafford-Wolverhampton is for all stock.

There is also a very short section of HST differential near Shieldmuir...thiugh might be for 110/115 rather than 125.

 

[PudseyBearHST]

The Mains were fun in an HST. Virgin used to operate them Bournemouth to the North I believe.

Everything is more fun on an HST

 

[InOban]

Is there any 125 N if Darlington? Or, for that matter, much over 100.
AIUI, if the max speed is 115 or less, trains only need one driver. And the end crumple zone wouldn't be required. Or is that a myth?

 

[swt_passenger]

Is there any 125 N if Darlington? Or, for that matter, much over 100.
AIUI, if the max speed is 115 or less, trains only need one driver. And the end crumple zone wouldn't be required. Or is that a myth?

The crumple zone requirements are different either side of 115 mph (or whatever the km/h nearest equivalent is), but they’re still necessary.

But do any trains still require two drivers at 125 mph?

 

[221129]

AIUI, if the max speed is 115 or less, trains only need one driver.

What?? Trains regularly travel at 125 with only a single driver...

 

[Jamesrob637]

Bottom of Hemerdon Bank and let gravity do its work whilst friction slows you down on the ascent into Plymouth I'd have a fright driving along the parallel road by the Plym and seeing any train at 125!

 

[Halish Railway]

Is there no 125 between Derby and Sheffield?

I believe that its 110 mph max, this coming about as a result of linespeed increases a couple of years ago, it certainly seemed like 110 mph when I went to Duffield.

 

[hexagon789]

But do any trains still require two drivers at 125 mph?

Not for years, pretty much since privitisation.