Whitchurch (Salop) to Scotland

Discussion in 'Fares Advice & Policy' started by AJW, 11 Nov 2011.

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  1. AJW

    AJW Member

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    I need to be in Edinburgh, actually Dunfermline, on Monday 21st November. What I would like to do is travel to Glasgow on Sunday 20th, through to Haymarket and onto Dunfermline on Monday morning and return to Whitchurch late Monday.

    Can I buy a return to Edinburgh (Waverley, Haymarket, Dunfermline?) and break the journey overnight in Glasgow? If not what is the best way to do this?
     
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  3. cuccir

    cuccir Established Member

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    From Whitchurch to Dunfermiline, an Anytime Return is £159. This permits travel via Glasgow, and allows you to break your outward journey overnight, as the ticket is valid for 5 days.

    An off-peak return is £89, but this does not permit break of journey on your outward trip.
     
  4. jkdd77

    jkdd77 Member

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    A Shrewsbury- Dunfermline Off-Peak Return is £108.70, and takes restriction code 8X, which allows break of journey on both legs.

    I *think* you would be allowed to resume your journey on the Monday morning on the second day of outward travel, although I am no longer certain due to the recent changes to the NRCOC.

    If so, I don't think you would be allowed to break the journey again at any intermediate station between Glasgow and Dunfermline, since the outward leg is normally only valid for one day.

    If you are allowed to break the journey again on the second day, then a Whitchurch- Dundee Off-Peak Return would be cheaper still, at £107.90 (2T), which also permits break of journey on both legs.
     
  5. cuccir

    cuccir Established Member

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    If you want to retain flexible travel, then you could do this journey more cheaply with:

    Whitchurch - Preston, £26.80 off peak retun
    Preston - Dunfermline, £106 anytime return

    Provided that you use trains in both directions which stop at Preston (as far as I know, all the Glasgow-Crewe trains stop at Preston). This still permits overnight break at journey at Glasgow on the way out.

    ---
    Re jkdd77's suggestion: AFAIK, new Terms and Conditions were introduced in October which prevent overnight break of journey on off-peak tickets. However, National Rail Enquiries currently shows the old T&Cs and therefore I can't see how the new ones are enforcable.
     
    Last edited: 11 Nov 2011
  6. AJW

    AJW Member

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    Been thinking about this some more. If I got an off peak return to Dunfermline is that valid via Glasgow?

    If so I could get to Glasgow on the Sunday, stay over night, buy a single Glasgow to Dunfermline on the Monday and then use the return on Monday to get back to Whitchurch.
     
  7. cuccir

    cuccir Established Member

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    This is not valid, because there is no break of journey allowed on a Whitchurch to Dunfermiline off-peak return. This includes stopping early in Glasgow.

    In practice, I can't imagine that a hypothetical traveller who attempted to do this would be stopped in any way.
     
  8. OwlMan

    OwlMan Established Member

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    It actually shows both the old and new in different places

    The old conditions are reached as cuccir said;
    The new conditions can be reached when using the journey planner and clicking on the ticket type in the Blue summary "Buy Now" box.
     
  9. AJW

    AJW Member

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    Just discovered that Whitchurch to Crewe on the Sunday is a replacement bus! Really don't want to do that. Investigating getting a lift to Chester or Crewe instead.

    Thanks for all your help so far. Given me lots of ideas as to what is and isn't possible. Up til now I have been trying to keep everything flexible but if I can get a definite finishing time in Dunfermline and it is early enough, one option is to return to Glasgow.
     
  10. jkdd77

    jkdd77 Member

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    A Whitchurch- Glasgow Off-Peak Return is £95.40 and a Glasgow- Dunfermline Off-Peak Day Return (valid after 09:15, but with evening restrictions) is £18.40 (Anytime Return is £23.60).

    I doubt it matters in view of the new NRCOC conditions, but Condition 16 says that:
    For the purposes of this Condition and Condition 11, you will be treated as breaking your journey if you leave a Train Company’s or Rail Service Company’s stations after you start your journey other than:
    (i) to join a train at another station, or
    (ii) to stay in overnight accommodation when you cannot reasonably
    complete your journey within one day, or

    (iii) to follow any instructions given by a member of a Train Company’s staff.

    To my mind, condition 16(ii) would apply to a necessary overnight break of journey in Glasgow, such that it is not actually considered as a BoJ, but the question is moot if the ticket is not valid on the second day anyway.
     
  11. scotsman

    scotsman Established Member

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    Just to clear up - Dunfermline is not Edinburgh. It's around 20 miles from Edinburgh, in Fife - on the opposite side of the river forth.

    You could get plan ahead to get a train that arrives too late for the last train to Edinburgh that would connect with a Dunfermline train - this would mean an arrival of around 2230. You're then free to stay in your hotel and travel on to Edinburgh (you don't have to change at Haymarket) and then Dunfermline
     
  12. cuccir

    cuccir Established Member

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    Just to clarify - is this still the case under the new Terms and conditions? My understanding was that they prohibit any overnight break of journey on all off peak tickets?
     
  13. bb21

    bb21 Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    Staying in overnight accommodation because the journey cannot be completed on the day is not considered a break of journey according to Condition 16(ii).

    You may also use the first connecting service the day after regardless of time restrictions attached to the ticket as it is a continuation of the previous day's travel.
     
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