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Why are Great Northern allowed to cancel midweek evening peak services seemingly at will?

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sprunt

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Yet again, this evening, a significant proportion of the Great Northern services from Moorgate have been cancelled due to a shortage of staff. The frequency with which this is now happening is ridiculous - on average, I'd say that while it's less often than once a week, it's more often than once every two weeks. It's a completely unacceptable (non) effort to provide the service - this isn't just a case of a driver being sick and there's nobody to cover - when I was at Moorgate earlier the 1715, 1720 and 1730 were all cancelled for want of drivers, and looking at the departures board now the 1845 and 1900 are cancelled. That's at least four (and possibly five - I don't know if the train for the 1715 departure would have time to form the 1900 service if it's not a stopper) staff short of the required number, which is pathetic.

I've sent a moany email to my MP asking her to draw Grayling's attention to the situation, but obviously nothing will be done, and GTR will no doubt keep pocketing the money for the service they don't appear from the outside to be even making a good faith attempt to provide. Rant over.
 
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londonboi198o5

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How do you know it is not down to driver sickness it very well could be.

Looking at it from another perspective could it be down to the new rolling stock. I remember seeing an article on the news that the new trains need to be “double manned” due to sighting issues with some signals at station starters so this could be the issue with the second member of staff being a driver double manning another trains resulting in a shortage of drivers.
And before anyone says it no it’s not just a case of moving a signal a few feet to overcome this problem
 

ComUtoR

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1715 - Moorgate to Welwyn Garden City (TG) Issue with Train Crew
1720 - to Stevenage (TI) Planning Error
1725 - Gordon Hill (M0) Onboard safety system
1730 - Welwyn Garden City (TI) Planning Error
1745 - Hertford North (YI) Late arrival of inbound service
1804 - Watton at Stone (YI) Late arrival of inbound service
1845 - Welwyn Garden City (TI) Planning Error
1900 - Welwyn Garden City (TI) Planning Error
 
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ForTheLoveOf

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1715 - Moorgate to Welwyn Garden City (TG) Issue with Train Crew
1720 - to Stevenage (TI) Planning Error
1725 - Gordon Hill (M0) Onboard safety system
1730 - Welwyn Garden City (TI) Planning Error
1745 - Hertford North (YI) Late arrival of inbound service
1804 - Watton at Stone (YI) Late arrival of inbound service
1845 - Welwyn Garden City (TI) Planning Error
1900 - Welwyn Garden City (TI) Planning Error
What exactly does planning error mean in this particular case?
 

sprunt

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How do you know it is not down to driver sickness it very well could be.

Looking at it from another perspective could it be down to the new rolling stock. I remember seeing an article on the news that the new trains need to be “double manned” due to sighting issues with some signals at station starters so this could be the issue with the second member of staff being a driver double manning another trains resulting in a shortage of drivers.
And before anyone says it no it’s not just a case of moving a signal a few feet to overcome this problem

Mass sickness on a bi-weekly basis for the last few months? Rotten bad luck that it happens to them so much more than any other TOC isn't it? And it's been going on since before the 717s entered regular service.

What exactly does planning error mean in this particular case?

I don't know, but according to GN on Twitter and the station staff they were all due to staff shortages.
 

sprunt

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1715 - Moorgate to Welwyn Garden City (TG) Issue with Train Crew
1720 - to Stevenage (TI) Planning Error
1725 - Gordon Hill (M0) Onboard safety system
1730 - Welwyn Garden City (TI) Planning Error
1745 - Hertford North (YI) Late arrival of inbound service

I think that 1745 should be 1735. Does cancellation due to late arrival of inbound service imply they stopped it short? That's a bit of a mickey take when the previous three trains were cancelled.
 

Bald Rick

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Nobody wants to cancel a train service. But if there’s no driver, what can you do?
 

jon0844

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I think that 1745 should be 1735. Does cancellation due to late arrival of inbound service imply they stopped it short? That's a bit of a mickey take when the previous three trains were cancelled.

It's possible they were turned at Finsbury Park or even King's Cross?
 

ComUtoR

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I don't know the specifics of Delay Attribution but when a service comes in it invariably makes another service. We often get late notice cancellations because it arrived late. This normally happens (at my TOC) because you can't make the service back and the long term impact becomes too detrimental. If your entire trip is 35 minutes and it arrives +20 then its not worth running it, you would destroy the service. Run it ECS or turn it back somewhere. We also run a metro service with 10 minute intervals at some places so running it late is pointless because there is one behind and all you do is stack trains. Quicker to run one with an altered stopping pattern and run the other on time to schedule.

The planning error can be a number of things so I'd leave that to the experts.

Anything staff related should be attributed to staff, but again, delay attribution is for those with mystical skills and rituals.
 

bramling

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Nobody wants to cancel a train service. But if there’s no driver, what can you do?

Ask the question why there’s not a driver?...

Two consecutive 2Cxx services in a row cancelled from King’s Cross just now, so it’s not just the Moorgates which are being affected.

Still, this is rail travel transformed for good. Notice how the RailPlan2020 publicity disappeared soon after last May and that particular branding hasn’t been seen or heard again since.

Let’s hope this is just a short-term blip. Presumably there’s still quite a bit of training going on, which can’t be helping?

Looking like my 365s home tonight will be making extra calls at the likes of Welwyn. How retro, I feel a year younger! ;)
 

jon0844

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A Horsham to Peterborough train filled in for the two cancelled Cambridge services, but obviously went from St Pancras instead of King's Cross. Probably little time to let people know, although with a stop at Finsbury Park there's a chance staff got to tell people to get ANY train (or tube) to there and pick it up?

With engineering work overnight (with buses) I wonder if there's special workings this week with regards to how the drivers can get trains into yards and then home? There look to have been some abnormal ECS movements tonight, presumably to have trains in the right place for tomorrow.

These works go on all week according to the GTR website.
 

bramling

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A Horsham to Peterborough train filled in for the two cancelled Cambridge services, but obviously went from St Pancras instead of King's Cross. Probably little time to let people know, although with a stop at Finsbury Park there's a chance staff got to tell people to get ANY train (or tube) to there and pick it up?

With engineering work overnight (with buses) I wonder if there's special workings this week with regards to how the drivers can get trains into yards and then home? There look to have been some abnormal ECS movements tonight, presumably to have trains in the right place for tomorrow.

These works go on all week according to the GTR website.

It was 1R66 (2154 KX to Letchworth) which had extra stops, as it often does when there’s some problem or other. I don’t think many made use of it though, just one punter got on at Finsbury as far as I could see.
 

bb21

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What exactly does planning error mean in this particular case?

Initial attribution should never be taken as gospel but for future reference TI is traincrew resource issues, ie. rostering, but not crew shortage which should go to TG or TH as appropriate.
 

jon0844

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Have they already issued the new rosters ahead of the new May timetable?
 
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