Why Circle and not District?

Discussion in 'London Underground' started by EM2, 29 Apr 2015.

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  1. EM2

    EM2 Established Member

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    Just before the first westbound H&C service from Upton Park at 05:25, there is a Circle Line service.
    As this is a rather rare occurence (Upton Park being some way from the Circle Line), I wondered why it's described as a Circle Line service, rather than a District Line service?
    Assuming that it terminates at Edgware Road (as Circle Line services do), the only bit of the route it uses which isn't shared with the District is the section just after Gloucester Road. Is that the only reason?
     
    Last edited: 29 Apr 2015
  2. edwin_m

    edwin_m Veteran Member

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    All the way from Tower Hill to Gloucester Road passengers will expect a "District" train to be going via Earls Court and a "Circle" via High Street Kensington, so I expect this would be the reason.

    However it might be clearer to show it as a District to Gloucester Road as far as Tower Hill then change it to show Circle. It might also be better for anticlockwise Circle trains to be advertised as Hammersmith and City once they pass Tower Hill, to emphasise the need to change at Edgware Road for those continuing on the "real" Circle via Bayswater. Does S stock have the ability to change indicated destination automatically when passing a certain station, like Metrolink trams?
     
  3. Quakkerillo

    Quakkerillo Member

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    I just looked on the tfl journey planner, seems this is a weekdays planned service from Barking (5.16) to Edgware Road, indeed advertised as a circle line service. Not sure why it runs this route though.
     
  4. glbotu

    glbotu Member

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    There are lots of "odd" early morning services on the SSL. I know in the 90s, the first train of the day from Bayswater southbound was a South Kensington terminator. I assume most of these run for stock positioning, but in active service as there are people who are willing to get them to get to work.

    I assume this service runs via Embankment so that it faces the "right" way at Edgware Road. This is done to reduce wheel wear on train that run the Circle Line. If it ran via Farringdon, it would be the left hand wheels on the middle of the Inner Circle, whereas going the way it does, makes the right hand wheels in the middle.
     
    Last edited: 29 Apr 2015
  5. MCR247

    MCR247 Established Member

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    Yes as Circle line trains are announced as "this a circle line train via x and y" depending on where in the route it is atm
     
  6. Dstock7080

    Dstock7080 Established Member

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    Only Circle Line trains change en-route, from "Circle via Victoria", "Circle via Embankment", "Circle via Liverpool Street" , "Circle to Hammersmith" etc with no input from the driver.
    The only code available in this instance quote is: 648 Edgware Road O/R from Barking.

    In the S7 Stock thread further down I've listed the 'unusual' workings to be introduced/continued in the new timetable from 17 May.
     
    Last edited: 29 Apr 2015
  7. swt_passenger

    swt_passenger Veteran Member

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    Coincidentally, I noticed something yesterday that doesn't really justify its own thread, but waiting at Paddington platform 16 during a gap in the eastbound pattern I saw a couple of westbound trains with the front display still showing 'Circle via Victoria'. At the time I thought this was incorrect, and thought it was supposed to change once beyond Vic on the inner rail (as just described by Dstock7080)?

    It must have been confusing for people when it went the wrong way after Edgware Rd?
     
  8. bluegoblin7

    bluegoblin7 Member

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    Assuming this was during the evening peak and beyond it's possible that these trains were diverted at Edgware Road and instead of running round the Circle they were sent to Hammersmith. The inner rail was suspended for some time in connection with the defective train at Bow Road. Could be a case that drivers just forgot to change their destinations over after being diverted.
     
  9. swt_passenger

    swt_passenger Veteran Member

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    This was around about 1130 when I saw it - which of course may still have been for similar reasons?
     
  10. Mutant Lemming

    Mutant Lemming Established Member

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    Some drivers still tend to be a bit maverick. I know it isn't the done thing to confuse the 'customer' but sometimes I would set the blind 'early' when on an end of peak Circle that either ran round to Barking or Hammersmith. My sad sense of humour thought there was something amusing in there being trains going in the opposite direction but terminating at the same place (i.e. running in to South Kensington O/R with Barking on the front passing a train going on the I/R with Barking on the Front). The job is far too serious for such things these days though.
     
  11. bluegoblin7

    bluegoblin7 Member

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    I was at home in bed at that point, so I haven't a clue if there were any disruptions I'm afraid! :lol:
     
  12. fairysdad

    fairysdad Member

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    A few weeks back, I was on a Circle from KXSP to Paddington on the fringe of the evening peak, which while at Edgware Road supposedly changed to a Circle Line train via Kensington, but ended up going round to Hammersmith as it was supposed to have - did surprise me and a few others as the announcements saying that the rear doors wouldn't open still fired off on the approach to Paddington, but they, of course, did open as we were at the H&C platforms rather than the District ones. I guessed it was just a bug in the system somewhere, but seems to happen more regularly! Not sure what did happen - driver hit a wrong button on his console perhaps? Did he have to reset and select the wrong Circle Line service?
     
  13. Dstock7080

    Dstock7080 Established Member

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    The software on S Stock TCMS (Train Control Management System) is extremely slow, and a choice sometimes has to be made with delaying departure while the correct destination is set, or departing and setting at the next platform (as set-up can't be done whilst on the move).
     
  14. tranzitjim

    tranzitjim Member

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    Is this a new thing now with the S7 stock being in service?
     
  15. Dstock7080

    Dstock7080 Established Member

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    It's been a continuous problem since the introduction of S Stock, the touch-screen being very unresponsive.
     
    Last edited: 3 May 2015
  16. Via Bank

    Via Bank Member

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    Why can't they simply create an extra route preset in the TCMS for these workings? Display it as a "District and Circle line train" or even just as "this train is for Edgware Road via Victoria." Then there'd be no need for the drivers to update the PIS en route.
     
  17. PeterY

    PeterY Member

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    Several months ago I was on a S stock train starting at Watford, next stop Hillingdon.

    Train must of thought it was at Uxbridge:D
     
  18. Dstock7080

    Dstock7080 Established Member

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    Looking at the destination code book I have, my previously quoted code of "648 Edgware Rd O/R from Barking" is non-Line specific and as I haven't been on these workings I can say what the CIS decides to show.
     
  19. JonathanH

    JonathanH Established Member

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    At the other end of the day, I caught the last 'Circle line' train from Edgware Road on a Sunday evening which runs to Barking. It announced itself as a District Line train to Barking. Presumably, the operation at the end of its journey is the important aspect of this since once this particular train passed Gloucester Road, no-one would need to know where it had come from.
     
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