WMM - Notice of Intention to prosecute- Digital Fraud Team

[Ricky Mahal]

Hi everyone,

I’m seeking advice about a situation I’ve found myself in with West Midlands Trains. I recently received an email from [email protected] about an incident on 22/05/2024, and I’m unsure how to proceed.

Here’s what happened:

• On 22/05/2024, I purchased a train ticket using an expired railcard.
• A ticket inspector raised the issue, confiscated the expired railcard (saying it would be discarded), and charged me the full fare for my journey.
• I immediately purchased a new railcard the same day because I hadn’t realised the old one had expired in September 2023. I had been using the same railcard since September 2019, so I mistakenly assumed it would auto-renew.
• Unfortunately, this means I had unknowingly been purchasing discounted tickets with the expired railcard from September 2023 to May 2024.

The email from West Midlands Trains states that the matter has been referred to their Digital Fraud Team, and they mentioned the possibility of prosecution. I want to emphasise that this was an honest mistake, and I’m really worried about what could happen next.

This is an email I was about to send but would appreciate any advice..

"Dear Digital Fraud Department,

I am writing in response to your letter regarding the incident on 22/05/2024.

I would like to begin by sincerely apologising for the oversight that led to this situation. I deeply regret any inconvenience caused.

I held a valid railcard continuously from 2019 to 2023. I believed it auto-renewed through my bank account, so I didn't realise I had to manually intervene to renew it. As I have never had to, I continued using it without realising it had expired. This was a genuine misunderstanding on my part, and I now understand the importance of verifying such details.

As soon as the issue was brought to my attention during the ticket check, I took immediate steps to rectify it by purchasing a new railcard on the same day. This experience has been a wake-up call for me, and I have since made it a priority to familiarise myself with the terms and conditions of travel to ensure full compliance in the future.

I fully understand the seriousness of fare evasion and its impact on the railway system and other passengers. I assure you that my actions were not intended to avoid paying the correct fare but were the result of an honest mistake. I deeply regret my oversight and take full responsibility for this situation.

I kindly request that you consider my explanation and the proactive steps I have taken to address this matter. If possible, I would greatly appreciate the opportunity to resolve this through an out-of-court settlement. I am willing to pay any reasonable administrative fees and the difference in fare to bring this matter to a prompt and fair resolution.

Thank you for your understanding and for considering my response. I am happy to provide any additional information or documentation required."

I’d appreciate any advice from others who’ve been in a similar situation or who understand how these cases are typically handled. Specifically:

• Should I respond to the email now or wait for further communication?
• Is it likely that this will go to court?
• Would it help to request an out-of-court settlement?

Thank you in advance for your help!

 

[AlterEgo]

Do not send the email. Do not acknowledge it. Do not correspond or make any comment on it.

They are out of time to prosecute you for these offences, and that's too bad for them. All they want is for you not to realise there's a six month limit and start trying to pay them lots of money.

They could in theory try civil action, but they've been too thick and feckless to even write to you about a criminal offence so far, so I think this is also unlikely.

 

[Ricky Mahal]

Do not send the email. Do not acknowledge it. Do not correspond or make any comment on it.

They are out of time to prosecute you for these offences, and that's too bad for them. All they want is for you not to realise there's a six month limit and start trying to pay them lots of money.

They could in theory try civil action, but they've been too thick and feckless to even write to you about a criminal offence so far, so I think this is also unlikely.

Thanks mate, really appreciate it!

What legal act is this under, do you have any other information on this topic?

Once again, thank you so much!

 

[Spaceship323]

It's not illegal to buy tickets with a discount, only to use them incorrectly...you haven't been caught using the other tickets so don't worry about it

 

[Kite159]

.

Do not send the email. Do not acknowledge it. Do not correspond or make any comment on it.

They are out of time to prosecute you for these offences, and that's too bad for them. All they want is for you not to realise there's a six month limit and start trying to pay them lots of money.

They could in theory try civil action, but they've been too thick and feckless to even write to you about a criminal offence so far, so I think this is also unlikely.

Or until they go down the fraud route passing the file over to the BTP

 

[SussexMan]

.

Or until they go down the fraud route passing the file over to the BTP

Have you any evidence that this has ever occurred in a similar situation and what evidence would they use showing that the tickets had been used by someone who didn't have a valid railcard?

 

[AlterEgo]

.

Or until they go down the fraud route passing the file over to the BTP

They aren’t going to do that, because there has been no fraud. The OP should not engage.

Have you any evidence that this has ever occurred in a similar situation and what evidence would they use showing that the tickets had been used by someone who didn't have a valid railcard?

This has never happened for a case of an expired railcard to my knowledge.

 

[Ricky Mahal]

Thanks everyone for your feedback I'll have a chat with my dad.
I just don't want to risk getting a criminal record over something so silly
Really grateful for the advice

 

[jfollows]

Thanks mate, really appreciate it!

What legal act is this under, do you have any other information on this topic?

Once again, thank you so much!

For example, https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1980/43/section/127
Of course you should take other advice and input. But it’s six months for summary-only offences in general.

Limitation of time.​

(1)Except as otherwise expressly provided by any enactment and subject to subsection (2) below, a magistrates’ court shall not try an information or hear a complaint unless the information was laid, or the complaint made, within 6 months from the time when the offence was committed, or the matter of complaint arose.
(2)Nothing in—
(a)subsection (1) above; or
(b)subject to subsection (4) below, any other enactment (however framed or worded) which, as regards any offence to which it applies, would but for this section impose a time-limit on the power of a magistrates’ court to try an information summarily or impose a limitation on the time for taking summary proceedings,
shall apply in relation to any indictable offence.
(3)Without prejudice to the generality of paragraph (b) of subsection (2) above, that paragraph includes enactments which impose a time-limit that applies only in certain circumstances (for example, where the proceedings are not instituted by or with the consent of the Director of Public Prosecutions or some other specified authority).
(4)Where, as regards any indictable offence, there is imposed by any enactment (however framed or worded, and whether falling within subsection (2) (b) above or not) a limitation on the time for taking proceedings on indictment for that offence no summary proceedings for that offence shall be taken after the latest time for taking proceedings on indictment.

 

[WesternLancer]

Thanks everyone for your feedback I'll have a chat with my dad.
I just don't want to risk getting a criminal record over something so silly
Really grateful for the advice

It's a good idea to chat it through with a relative as they will want to support you in any problem that has emerged.

One thing you can do, privately, is look through your online ticket purchase record (privately no need to share any info on that here) and work out how many journeys you did with a Railcard discount in the period when you in fact did not have a valid Railcard. That would start to give you an idea of the sum of money that they would like to get from you. Often they seek to obtain the money at the more expensive Anytime single fare for any journey, and often (but this seems to vary between train companies) with no allowance for what you may have already paid for a ticket - this is because the T&Cs of rail tickets mean that a ticket discounted by a railcard when no valid railcard is held is regarded as a ticket with no validity at all.

By working through your ticket purchasing account you can work out for yourself how much money is at stake.

Obviously if you have other questions about all this people here will be well placed to answer them, or share their opinions on what to do or the consequences of different courses of action.

 

[Ricky Mahal]

Thanks all for your help.
Having seeked advice i was advised to engage with them. As they were threatening to prosecute me for fraud and the 6 month rule doesn't apply to this.
I was told if it went to court there was a strong chance, the court would see this as a genuine oversight rather than deliberate fraud but I can't afford to take the risk.

 

[SCDR_WMR]

Thanks all for your help.
Having seeked advice i was advised to engage with them. As they were threatening to prosecute me for fraud and the 6 month rule doesn't apply to this.
I was told if it went to court there was a strong chance, the court would see this as a genuine oversight rather than deliberate fraud but I can't afford to take the risk.

They will not be taking you to court for fraud, however, they would like to describe your actions as being 'fraudulent'.

 

[skyhigh]

Having seeked advice i was advised to engage with them.

Who was this advice from? I can't see that it is in your interest.

 

[Spaceship323]

Please see the good advice in post #2, the train company will not prosecute you for fraud

 

[AlterEgo]

Thanks all for your help.
Having seeked advice i was advised to engage with them. As they were threatening to prosecute me for fraud and the 6 month rule doesn't apply to this.
I was told if it went to court there was a strong chance, the court would see this as a genuine oversight rather than deliberate fraud but I can't afford to take the risk.

Did you take this advice from a solicitor who specialises in these sorts of cases? Shocked they would advise self-incrimination if so. You’re better served by saying nothing whatsoever. You are quite simply not guilty of fraud; you’ve not committed that offence and there’s no evidence of it.

 

[skyhigh]

Did you take this advice from a solicitor who specialises in these sorts of cases?

I suspect the advice came from the OP's dad (post 8). If it came from a solicitor, they're not a very good solicitor.

 

[WesternLancer]

I think it’s perfectly reasonable to weigh up the advice with a family member and make your choice in that context. It’s one of the advantages of the forum that helps people do that

There’s excellent advice on this forum but I’m always mindful that I’m not on the receiving end of train companies threats when I post my views.

 

[Hadders]

I agree that sometimes we need to take a step back and understand why people feel the need to engage.

@Ricky Mahal was caught with an out of date railcard, not the biggest crime in the world. The train company identifies other instances of tickets purchased with a railcard when no valid railcard was held.

Train company sends a letter threatening prosecution. OP knows they were in the wrong and want to rectify the issue. The last thing they want is a criminal prosecution.

Now, we know that based on what we've been told that the train company cannot prosecute because they are out of time. If @Ricky Mahal had not engaged the train company would have sent more letters threatening all sorts of consequences. People in this situation migt feel like they are constantly 'looking over their shoulder'.

Sadly, we also know that train companies do not always follow the law or their own procedures. We've seen that in 76,000 cases recently. Yes a wrongful prosecution can be undone but how much stress and anxiety does that cost?

The OP could talk to a solicitor and if they were well versed in railway ticketing matters they could make the matter go away. But how much would it cost to get a solicitor to do sort this. One thing you can be certain of is that the train company would not pay the solicitors costs.

Alternatively, the OP can engage and agree a settlement (probably won't cost much more than engaging a solicitor to make it go away). The case gets resolved, and the OP sleeps easy at night.

I'm all in favour of helping people who want to fight a train company over something like this. Personally I think it's disgraceful that they threaten people with prosecution when realistically they know they cannot do this. But equally we do need to respect why people feel the need to engage and settle.

 

[Puffing Devil]

I don't believe that a Fraud act prosecution would stick. I can see how threats of legal action prey on people's mind when they have no previous experience of the legal system.

One factor to consider is the value of tickets purchased. Would WMT look to recover the discount, or charge full fare for each journey? I can't see a court being happy to support the latter with good representation.

For peace of mind, I would get a fixed fee for an initial interview with a solicitor specialising in rail matters. A well-worded letter may well result in no further action and WMT going off for a less challenging target.

 

[gray1404]

Unfortunately family members are often emotionally caught up in these issues when it concerns a relative. They are therefore not often the best people to get advice from.
The OP has received excellent advice here not to engage any further. They will not be getting prosecuted for fraud. However it is up to them if they wish to accept the advice.

 

[WesternLancer]

Unfortunately family members are often emotionally caught up in these issues when it concerns a relative. They are therefore not often the best people to get advice from.
The OP has received excellent advice here not to engage any further. They will not be getting prosecuted for fraud. However it is up to them if they wish to accept the advice.

Or family members often likely to have to deal with the consequences/ stress/ fallout so rather well placed to help a relative make a judgement call.
More likely than people on an online forum, however generous with their time, would be able to do.
Professional advisors would help see it through, but rarely for free.
Sometimes paying up to resolve or conclude a matter makes sense.

 

[Hadders]

This thread is to help @Ricky Mahal with their specific problem and we're now drifting off-topic. I'm going to lock this thread now as there relaly isn't any further advice we can give at the moment.

@Ricky Mahal - when you have an update for us report this post by clicking on the 'report' button in the bottom left hand corner which will alert the Moderating Team to re-open the thread.