Worcestershire Parkway station progress

[Sprinter107]

I guess in theory the low level platforms could potentially open up more options for Worcester Shrub Hill <-> Cheltenham Spa if the timings work out. Which I assume will be valid on a Worcester - Cheltenham ticket

Cant see any reason why a ticket wouldnt be valid for that journey. Itll be interesting to see what the connections are like. Hopefully, the Oxford train will get there before the Southbound XC service, rather than a few minutes afterwards.

 

[Kite159]

Cant see any reason why a ticket wouldnt be valid for that journey. Itll be interesting to see what the connections are like. Hopefully, the Oxford train will get there before the Southbound XC service, rather than a few minutes afterwards.

A brief glance and the connections are not great. XC seems to be roughly hourly (XX:58 towards Cardiff, XX:14 towards Birmingham), GWR seems to be around XX:23 towards London, around XX:50 towards Worcester. There are a few off-pattern GWR services which do reduce the wait. Probably more useful for anybody who just misses the 2 hourly GWR service towards Worcester at Cheltenham.

Depending on the Min Connection there does seem to be options for Cheltenham -> stations on the Cotswolds line in both directions

 

[Sprinter107]

A brief glance and the connections are not great. XC seems to be roughly hourly (XX:58 towards Cardiff, XX:14 towards Birmingham), GWR seems to be around XX:23 towards London, around XX:50 towards Worcester. There are a few off-pattern GWR services which do reduce the wait. Probably more useful for anybody who just misses the 2 hourly GWR service towards Worcester at Cheltenham

So it appears that anyone travelling from Worcester to or from the Cheltenham direction will have at least a 30 minute wait. Not so nice if the waiting facilities are basic, also making the journey time much longer.

 

[Class172]

Which I assume will be valid on a Worcester - Cheltenham ticket

Almost certainly given going via Parkway is less than 3 miles longer than the direct route.

Little wonder that XC are reluctant to stop at Worcs. Parkway if they are already rammed, obvious answer more coaches on the XC services, if there were they might still be rammed on arrival at WP because more passengers would join at earlier stations. If WP is to be just another feeder for London why build the lower level? Of course in the next few years Oxford station is to become a major rail hub with a station redevelopment a new platform 5 and likely a through platform 2. Change at Oxford for EWR trains to Milton Keynes, Bedford, Cambridge, Norwich and Ipswich. So passenger demand going south east to Oxford and beyond should be strong.

I don't foresee the demand northwards on XC to be that strong, but there certainly should be some southwards as this introduces completely new journey opportunities compared to anything currently available in the county (South Wales & better Cheltenham connectivity).

 

[Class 170101]

I don't foresee the demand northwards on XC to be that strong, but there certainly should be some southwards as this introduces completely new journey opportunities compared to anything currently available in the county (South Wales & better Cheltenham connectivity).

Surely direct services to Derby and Nottingham would be a draw to the north even if Birmingham is better via Shrub Hill / Foregate Stations?

 

[jimm]

However you could extend some of the Shrub Hill Terminators as these don't run via Foregate Street, assuming of course they fit on the single line to Worcester Parkway

Before assuming anything of the sort, maybe you need to look at the basic facts - such as there isn't the track capacity available on the single-line section between Norton junction and Evesham west junction, even before you get to things like needing signals to allow trains to turn back at the high-level platform at Parkway if there were big enough gaps in the Cotswold Line service to allow it.

There are all sorts of things you could do if the supply of funding was limitless, but there are far bigger investment priorities in the Worcester area than this, notably modern signalling and a sensible track layout, without all the single-line sections.

I haven’t seen the new timetable-how long is it timetabled to take from Parkway as opposed to Foregate St/Shrub Hill? Is there a penalty either way or are they broadly similar?

Trains to and from Parkway will inevitably be quicker than the central Worcester stations as they don't need to go to Droitwich, call there and negotiate the junctions there and at Bromsgrove. Journey time will be 30-35 minutes for Parkway-New Street journeys, compared with 40 to 45 minutes on the fastest Shrub Hill/Foregate Street services to and from New Street.

So it appears that anyone travelling from Worcester to or from the Cheltenham direction will have at least a 30 minute wait. Not so nice if the waiting facilities are basic, also making the journey time much longer.

The station is costing £22 million - the facilities are a bit more than basic.

This links page on the county council website has background information about the project and the visual gallery section has videos showing some of the progress on construction work

https://www.worcestershire.gov.uk/parkway.

 

[VT 390]

So it appears that anyone travelling from Worcester to or from the Cheltenham direction will have at least a 30 minute wait. Not so nice if the waiting facilities are basic, also making the journey time much longer.

Even with the wait it could still be quicker than waiting for the next direct Cheltenham service from central Worcester if you either miss it or the times are no good to you.

 

[4141]

A brief glance and the connections are not great. XC seems to be roughly hourly (XX:58 towards Cardiff, XX:14 towards Birmingham), GWR seems to be around XX:23 towards London, around XX:50 towards Worcester. There are a few off-pattern GWR services which do reduce the wait. Probably more useful for anybody who just misses the 2 hourly GWR service towards Worcester at Cheltenham.

Depending on the Min Connection there does seem to be options for Cheltenham -> stations on the Cotswolds line in both directions

But, I would guess, little demand for those connections, looking at other forms of public transport - Moreton in Marsh is served by a handful of Pulham's buses, Oxford by just three Swanbrook services a day, these all departing from the centre of town, while National Express don't have a service between Cheltenham and Oxford, and Cheltenham's rail station is quite a way from the town.

 

[Sprinter107]

Before assuming anything of the sort, maybe you need to look at the basic facts - such as there isn't the track capacity available on the single-line section between Norton junction and Evesham west junction, even before you get to things like needing signals to allow trains to turn back at the high-level platform at Parkway if there were big enough gaps in the Cotswold Line service to allow it.

There are all sorts of things you could do if the supply of funding was limitless, but there are far bigger investment priorities in the Worcester area than this, notably modern signalling and a sensible track layout, without all the single-line sections.



Trains to and from Parkway will inevitably be quicker than the central Worcester stations as they don't need to go to Droitwich, call there and negotiate the junctions there and at Bromsgrove. Journey time will be 30-35 minutes for Parkway-New Street journeys, compared with 40 to 45 minutes on the fastest Shrub Hill/Foregate Street services to and from New Street.



No, because you didn't go back into post 616 and edit it so that that anyone else reading it can clearly understand which part of it is a quote from Parallel's previous post and which bit is your response to that quote.



The station is costing £22 million - the facilities are a bit more than basic.

This links page on the county council website has background information about the project and the visual gallery section has videos showing some of the progress on construction work

https://www.worcestershire.gov.uk/parkway.

When I said basic, I meant at night, if maybe it's not going to be staffed for all trains, when waiting rooms etc tend to get locked. That then goes to basic facilities.

 

[Noddy]

Trains to and from Parkway will inevitably be quicker than the central Worcester stations as they don't need to go to Droitwich, call there and negotiate the junctions there and at Bromsgrove. Journey time will be 30-35 minutes for Parkway-New Street journeys, compared with 40 to 45 minutes on the fastest Shrub Hill/Foregate Street services to and from New Street.

So a roughly 10-20% saving per (train) journey or say 20min per day. Obviously depends on where you’re starting from and if you have flexible work times but not to be sniffed at.

When I said basic, I meant at night, if maybe it's not going to be staffed for all trains, when waiting rooms etc tend to get locked. That then goes to basic facilities.

Looking at the artist impressions and in progress publicity videos/photos it looks like the entrance to the platforms (both upper and lower level) will be indoor or at least enclosed-I presume these areas will have some seating. See here: http://www.worcestershire.gov.uk/news/article/1688/worcestershire_parkway_rail_station

 

[R G NOW.]

Not 100% clear

"As well as the Government's funding commitment the Department for Transport has agreed to support talks with train operators to ensure they use the two platforms at Norton.

They will serve current Cotswold Line services, heading to Oxford and London, of which talks are already advanced with the train industry, and cross-country services linking to destinations like Bristol and Cardiff."

I guess it will be on the single line section as well as the north/south line

From what I was told, the station wont be serving Bristol directly.

The arrangement is.

cross country services from Manchester Piccadilly to Bristol temple meads, = non stop.
cross country services from Nottingham to Cardiff central are to stop from December.

I hope this helps.

 

[R G NOW.]

The demise of "The Grayling" removes one not insignificant barrier to electrification.

yes! we must have the line between yate and Bromsgrove electrified as it would help the country's carbon footprint situation and a section running into Gloucester as well would be nice, but they need to also do the Filton bank. Cross country could have duel trains i.e 800,s which could use the over head power all the way to Bristol.

Not sure what they would do with the Gloucester road bridge at the top end of Cheltenham station. Estimated cost 771 million.

P.S. From one post, I see they have already done the signalling from Birmingham to ashchurch. it is Gloucester that needs the money, the old signalling there is now on its last legs.

 

[jimm]

When I said basic, I meant at night, if maybe it's not going to be staffed for all trains, when waiting rooms etc tend to get locked. That then goes to basic facilities.

The station will be staffed until the wee small hours, as someone will have to lock up after the arrival of the new 22.50 service from London Paddington, which will terminate there at 01.06. Shrub Hill closes shortly after midnight, once the 21.48 from Paddington has arrived.

From what I was told, the station wont be serving Bristol directly.

The arrangement is.

cross country services from Manchester Piccadilly to Bristol temple meads, = non stop.
cross country services from Nottingham to Cardiff central are to stop from December.

I hope this helps.

This has been known for a very long time now.

 

[GoneSouth]

It seems to me that Worcestershire County Council have a pretty poor understanding of the services £22M (figure quoted in this thread, apologies if this is incorrect) can buy. There’s a video linked on this site that has a tour of the station with captions that say the following

Stairs to platform 1 for trains to Birmingham via Worcester

Walkway to platform 2 for trains to Bristol via Gloucester

http://www.worcestershire.gov.uk/news/article/1688/worcestershire_parkway_rail_station

AIUI there will be no trains to Bristol and there is no way for a train heading north to Birmingham to go via Worcester.

All a bit sloppy and misleading there from WCC!

Direct link to video here:

 

[GoneSouth]

The station will be staffed until the wee small hours, as someone will have to lock up after the arrival of the new 22.50 service from London Paddington, which will terminate there at 01.06. Shrub Hill closes shortly after midnight, once the 21.48 from Paddington has arrived.

Very impressive later departure for Worcester there, sadly no equivalent for Chelters

 

[Noddy]

It seems to me that Worcestershire County Council have a pretty poor understanding of the services £22M (figure quoted in this thread, apologies if this is incorrect) can buy. There’s a video linked on this site that has a tour of the station with captions that say the following

Stairs to platform 1 for trains to Birmingham via Worcester

Walkway to platform 2 for trains to Bristol via Gloucester

http://www.worcestershire.gov.uk/news/article/1688/worcestershire_parkway_rail_station

AIUI there will be no trains to Bristol and there is no way for a train heading north to Birmingham to go via Worcester.

All a bit sloppy and misleading there from WCC!

Direct link to video here:

I think sloppy rather than intentionally misleading. If they were assuming/hoping that direct trains to Bristol were calling at Platform 2 they would be very unlikely to be going via Gloucester. And Platform 1 trains to Birmingham via Worcester is clearly just a mistake, and is actually less appealing than something like ‘faster, direct trains to Birmingham’.

 

[4141]

Very impressive later departure for Worcester there, sadly no equivalent for Chelters

Without wanting to drag this off topic, I have to agree, with the last service departing at 22.01, whereas there used to be a 23:45 Swansea train with a waiting connection at Swindon to get into Chelters just after 02:00 - and long before that the 01:25 newspapers, although that would only get you as far as Gloucester...

 

[jimm]

There has long been a through GW service from Bristol, Gloucester and Cheltenham arriving at Worcester Shrub Hill after 22.00, which runs not far ahead of the last Cardiff-Birmingham XC service. The GW service then runs back from Shrub Hill all the way to Bristol - currently leaving at 22.28.

This arrangement of services will continue after December - with the northbound GW service running later than now and the gap shrinking between it and the XC train so they will be just over 12 minutes apart between Gloucester and Ashchurch. The odds of people travelling to Worcestershire Parkway on that last XC train of the day in order to reach central Worcester are going to be very small indeed.

 

[yorkie]

Just a reminder that this thread is for what is actually happening.

We do welcome people posting suggestions for changes to infrastructure or service patterns etc, but we do ask that these are posted in the Speculative Ideas section please.

Also a reminder that our forum rules state that if you have any concerns with any post to use the report button. Please don't get into arguments on the thread; simply report the post, informing us of the concerns, and do not reply/react to it please.

Thanks

 

[DaveHarries]

[.....], but there certainly should be some southwards as this introduces completely new journey opportunities compared to anything currently available in the county (South Wales & better Cheltenham connectivity).

Much as I like Shrub Hill and Foregate Street due to the continued survival of mechanical signalling at those stations I would consider going via. Worcestershire Parkway if work needed to send me to Worcester with the need to return by train. It would depend on what would be quicker, especially if the opportunity was there to link up with a Gloucester - Bristol TM service that was not operating through Worcester.

Dave

 

[takno]

Much as I like Shrub Hill and Foregate Street due to the continued survival of mechanical signalling at those stations I would consider going via. Worcestershire Parkway if work needed to send me to Worcester with the need to return by train. It would depend on what would be quicker, especially if the opportunity was there to link up with a Gloucester - Bristol TM service that was not operating through Worcester.

Dave

Wouldn't you make that decision based on where you actually needed to be? I mean I like mechanical signalling as much as the next man who runs a website showing trains signal-by-signal which doesn't work in mechanically-signalled areas, but my main reason for liking shrub hill and foregate street would be that they were easily accessible for places I lived for 20 years. The sweet sweet colour lights at parkway and data feed from WMSC don't even come into it.

 

[S-Bahn]

Does anyone know the proposed date for the start of the Cardiff-Nottingham services stopping there?

 

[Class172]

Worcestershire County Council have published the most recent set of drone footage showing the station in a fairly completed state – mainly internal decoration left to do it appears.

 

[jimm]

Does anyone know the proposed date for the start of the Cardiff-Nottingham services stopping there?

The whole station will open on the same day - but a definite date for that to happen has yet to be given. It is hoped it will be mid-December.

From the Worcester News

A MAJOR new railway station is still on course to open by the end of the year as the final preparations are being made to make it ready for trains to stop.

The final touches are being made to Worcestershire Parkway in time for it to open when the train timetable changes in mid-December.

With construction work all but over, Worcestershire County Councilis hoping a series of rigorous tests run smoothly so the station stays on course to open by the end of the year.

https://www.worcesternews.co.uk/new...e-parkway-station-stays-course-open-december/

 

[II]

Good to see we are on course for a December opening. Let's hope any 'final approval' red tape doesn't prove too difficult to cut through as we saw with Kenilworth.

 

[jimm]

Some tickets for travel from Worcestershire Parkway from Sunday, December 15, are now showing on the gwr.com booking system but what has been uploaded seems to be a fairly random selection of ticket types and destinations at the moment - probably should be taken as no more than a declaration of intent at the moment.

 

[Class 170101]

I wonder what GW will do with this train if the station doesn't open on time
https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/Y94629/2019/12/20/advanced

 

[The Planner]

I wonder what GW will do with this train if the station doesn't open on time
https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/Y94629/2019/12/20/advanced

Run it to Pershore and run Pershore to Worcester Hereford Sidings as 5W45 instead of from Worcestershire Parkway.

 

[R G NOW.]

Did you read my previous post pointing out that from Gloucester anyone going to Oxford will be far better off going via Didcot, unless they aren't in any great hurry - in addition, their chances of getting a seat on an hourly GWR IET service going to Didcot from December will be much better than trying to get on an XC two-car Class 170 to or from Worcestershire Parkway. And they won't have to pay the no doubt very reasonable fare set by XC (sarcasm alert). The GWR Bristol-Malvern services only run every couple of hours and are of precious little use for any purpose as a result.

I think anyway if you go to the ticket office at Gloucester you will be sold a ticket which will say the route is via Stroud.

Also just had my neighbour tell me that the station has cost 10 million. I thought that it is a lot and lots more money than that, due to the size of it.

 

[R G NOW.]

Having read some of the very early posts on this thread. Some were about rerouting trains via WOS and out via Droitwich. My suggestion is with the new Worcester parkway then the cross country trains from Cardiff would depart at the same times as they do now. The only change needed is to depart them 3 mins earlier from Gloucester and Cheltenham then they will have time to call at Worcester parkway, Departing from university at the usual times.

I have my thinking cap on. Another advantage of this station is that G.W.R. could then run their trains to terminate at this station, instead of running through to Great Malvern. Then that would allow everyone in the Worcester area to get trains to Bristol, Bath, Gloucester, Cheltenham and all the way to Weymouth even on into Wales. Lovely.

But NR will need to provide signals at each end of the platforms and double crossovers also at both ends to allow reversals in both directions.