Wrexham, Shropshire and Marylebone Railway Company

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86242

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The following was posted on the wnxx forum

It may of of interest...
EMBARGOED UNTIL 00.01 ON WEDNESDAY 1ST FEBRUARY 2006

NORTH WALES & SHROPSHIRE - PROPOSED NEW RAIL SERVICES


A new train service providing a direct link from North Wales and
Shropshire to London is proposed to start in 2007.

Renaissance Trains - the company that successfully promoted Hull
Trains - is joining forces with Laing Rail - owners of the Chiltern
Railways franchise - to form the Wrexham, Shropshire and Marylebone Railway Company (WSMR) and to promote new long distance rail services between Wrexham, Shrewsbury, Telford and London, a line of route not currently served by through trains. Negotiations have been underway with Network Rail for some time and the company expects to sign a Track Access Agreement to run up to five trains a day in each direction starting in 2007.

WSMR will use modern diesel trains, which it will operate between
Wrexham, Shropshire and London's Marylebone station providing excellent access to all parts of the city via London Underground. Trains will serve Shrewsbury, Telford, Cosford and Wolverhampton and - subject to discussions the company will be having with interested groups in Wales - run to and from Wrexham in North Wales, calling additionally at Ruabon, Chirk and Gobowen (for Oswestry).

The journey time between Shrewsbury and London will be a little over
two and a half hours and the trains will serve business and leisure
needs, including weekend operations. The journey time to Wrexham is expected to be around three and a quarter hours. Trains will carry buffets, will be crewed with locally recruited personnel and comprise both reservable first and standard accommodation.
 
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David

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Bets on types of trains to be used...

Class 47 and mark 2/3 - 100/1
Class 67 and mark 3's - 25/1
HST's - 20/1
New build of 22x units - No bets taken
 

nutter

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I live on the shrewsbury-wolves line and this would be great, with a 45 minute walk i can get to London :lol: . I hope they bring in the stored HST's since virgin changed into an MU company but i can't see it personally. My bet is a turbostar style DMU. Lets see what happens. (It better be an open access franchise). I'm surprised to see Cosford in the stations list as it's only really used by the RAF on Friday afternoons and Monday mornings
 

Andrew

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I reckon 168s (won't the trains need Chiltern ATP?) - and haven't Chiltern have already tendered for more units thinking they were taking over parts of Central Trains pretty soon - which now won't happen for a few years. In which case when CT is split up won't their units will still have lease agreements for a few more years? And seeing as the company looks like it'll work pretty closely with Chiltern (same route, partly same owner) I think stock sharing is likely.

What's the max speed on the route? Fastsest will be bewteen Birmingham and Wolverhampton? and I doubt that's 125 in which case I think a Turbostar-style Chiltern DMU is very likely.
HSTs are too old to count as modern, and too unreliable, and break down too much. And they'd have to go somewhere else for exams. And I doubt there's enough demand to go for anything big like that or LHCS.
 

AlexS

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Wrexham to Shrewsbury = 70ish
Shrewsbury - Wolves = 90 max
Wolves to Brum = 75
Brum to Leamington = 90-100 max (depending on your location)
Leamington to Banbury = 90-100 (dunno whether this is one of the flash 221 125mph bits)
Banbury to Marlyebone = guess 75-80ish.

Im betting on a Hull Trains style 170, with tripcocks.
 

nutter

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I know Shrewsbury to Wolves is 70mph at the moment but NR have recently relaid the up line east of Cosford and bits of the down line west of Cosford. NR have also recently put up new signal posts all though I'd say they're to close to be 90mph (I haven't seen the signal heads so they might be multi aspect). There are rumors that the line speed will be improved to 90 when the new signals come on.
 

nutter

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This may sound stupid from a local but is the Buildwas line the Ironbridge line. Thanks for letting me know when the signals will come on line, a conductor and 2 drivers told me last year they'll be on by xmas.
 

AlexS

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The Ironbridge is in Coalbrookdale, which is next to Buildwas, which is where the powerstation is.

The line used to carry on to Randlay etc, hence why the Lightmoor Junction (I found the name :) ) box is so called, which is closing along with Codsall and Cosford boxes.

Buildwas powerstation is commonly called Ironbridge PS, yes.

Signals have been fitted since November, with some work still be undertaken on the track, expect the first trials of the signalling to occur within a month or two from now, with full switch over the from analogue signalling to power signalling in May currently scheduled.
 

nutter

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I thought Madley Junc. controlled all the line towards Buildwas. You are a fountain of knowlege. They haven't finished fitting the signals at the moment. Cosford loops are still semaphore and the down line though Cosford is all semaphore. Last time I went though Cosford (Friday) there was still 3 ladders for signal posts in the base. Gone are the days when it was just waste land. I can see the yard having track soon if the RAF base gets this new contract.
 

AlexS

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Niope, Madeley Junction only controls it as far as Lightmoor Junction. The colour light signals have pretty much been fitted, but are covered with black bags at the moment. I remember a couple of years ago the yard as Cosford was full of track, they only finished pulling it up recently, the new track has been put in there in order to allow the departmental trains to stable between duties.
 

yorkie

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Andrew said:
HSTs are too old to count as modern, and too unreliable, and break down too much. And they'd have to go somewhere else for exams. And I doubt there's enough demand to go for anything big like that or LHCS.
I've never been on an HST that's broken down, and I travel a lot.

I think you'll find the chances of an HST failing are less than a Pendo (for example), despite the fact that electric trains are theoretically lower maintenance and more reliable than diesel.
 

Andrew

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OK, so "break down" was probably a bit of a stupid thing to say. I'm going by what I've read in various places about mpc (not the be all and end all of reliability measures) and 390s have pretty much broken the 10,000mpc barrier. HSTs seem to vary down to a low of about 7,000mpc. I think it's MML's whose seem to be doing particularly badly at the moment.

I'm happy to be proven wrong by anyone "inside" who has better figures - very very happy in fact. Goodness knows the HSTs should continue for a few years yet!
 

Humberside

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The latest Rail magazine reports Network Rail has backed the plan which should speed up approval of the new service

Just an idea, but why aren't they planning to stop at Tame Bridge Parkway to tap into the North Birmingham market? (some services will operate Bescot and Stretford)
 

matt

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If this service runs it could possibly be operated by a Class 67 which was what the Marylebone to Wrexham EWS management train was the other week
 

theblackwatch

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If this service runs it could possibly be operated by a Class 67 which was what the Marylebone to Wrexham EWS management train was the other week
The original plans were to use re-engined ex TPE Class 158s on this service. With the 67 trial though, things could have changed, or various options are still being looked at.
 

Techniquest

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Surely not MK2s in this day and age on the mainline! MK3s are the way forward! OK, so that's old-style thinking, but MK2s are worse!

I'd expect Turbostar-style units on this one myself.

yorkie mentioned on the first page here that he's never been on a broken-down HST. Guess what, I have! T'was a few years ago (no more than 4), stuck at Moreton-in-Marsh for ages, then an announcement tells us we will be terminating at Worcester Shrub Hill due to a problematic power car, with a bus replacement to Hereford. It takes FOREVER to go from Shrub Hill to Hereford on a coach! Direct might not be so bad, but calling at all of the stations wasn't helping! Quite late we were by the time we reached Hereford!

Oh, and a recent bash back in May (recent it might not be actually, but it doesn't seem long ago) involving the 0721 off Hereford to Paddington as far as Worcester FS revealed the leading power car to be shut down after Colwall Tunnel. Lovely. It left the rear one a LOT of work to do! Which was most evident listening to the departure off Worcester, the noise was incredible!

Those are two failures I can recall, probably been a LOT more!
 

metrocammel

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OK, so "break down" was probably a bit of a stupid thing to say. I'm going by what I've read in various places about mpc (not the be all and end all of reliability measures) and 390s have pretty much broken the 10,000mpc barrier. HSTs seem to vary down to a low of about 7,000mpc. I think it's MML's whose seem to be doing particularly badly at the moment.

I'm happy to be proven wrong by anyone "inside" who has better figures - very very happy in fact. Goodness knows the HSTs should continue for a few years yet!
Really though, (like it or not) most PC's are going to be MTU'd which has already dramatically improved the reliability of PC's dramatically, so HST reliablility should now equal, if not better "modern" units. They are however probably impractical for this new service, plus where would the PC's come from? True there are some stored, but many of the ex-Virgin ones were run to the ground (and stored in the open for several years) and are beyond economical repair, eg 43101. Also, I imagine these trains would only be formed of 3 to 4 coaches, which although a HST can (and has) operated in this fashion, it seems uneconmical to have such power (over 3000hp) for such a small train - and Im sure would cost more to operate than a flimsy, lightweight unit.
 
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