X Country trains cancelled west of Exeter

[Halsebee]

For the last two evenings, at least, X Country services have not being running west from Exeter towards Plymouth. This is something to do with Voyagers vulnerability to spray at Dawlish, which is pretty well known,I think. But the weather isn't bad at present, and I understand they've been cancelled as a precaution. Can anyone clarify just how much risk, or lack of risk, they are prepared to accept before cancelling. If they are cancelling when the weather is really not at all bad, doesn't look good for the winter, they might end up hardly running at all?
Also why is it only in the evening they've been cancelled recently? Could it be high tides or something like that?

 

[plymothian]

Yes they are very vulnerable to salt water when it over tops the train due to the electrics on the roof.

There are very high tides at the moment, combined with an onshore wind that pushes big waves (and whales!) over the sea wall.

Network Rail issues weather warnings specifically for the sea wall and there are 2 methods of working during bad weather: Level 1, where a Pilotman rides with each train along the Down Main between Dawlish Warren and Teignmouth to assist the driver in examining the line and monitor the sea state; and Level 2, where all trains must use the bi-directional Up Main.

Since a number of Voyagers got stranded on the sea wall and effectively shut down the railway to/from the South West, to prevent another stranding NR now issue Voyager vulnerability warnings and all Voyager worked diagrams get curtailed at Exeter St David's during the high tides when the wind is likely to cause over topping waves.

This Tuesday and Wednesday, XC trains have been cancelled during morning and evening tides.

 

[SPADTrap]

Spray is probably the wrong word!

 

[jopsuk]

Are the West of England Class 802 SET Hybrids being specified to cope with the weather along this stretch?

 

[Envoy]

This stretch of coast actually faces south east so is very vulnerable when the winds are coming from that direction - as they are at present due to High Pressure being stuck over Scandinavia.

It surely would be a good idea for a Class 800 to be sent down to Dawlish now - whilst these conditions prevail, to see if any problems are encountered. Hence, if problems were encountered, modifications could be applied and tested before an entire fleet rolls off the production lines.

 

[robbeech]

That would explain the confusion yesterday then. I got the 1442 from Newcastle that was posted as going to Plymouth and announced as going to Plymouth at Newcastle but after Darlington it was on the board as Plymouth but announced as Exeter. Much mumbling amongst the handful of people in that coach ensued. I got off at York so it made no difference to me though I did notice the sign at York still said Plymouth.

 

[Domh245]

Are the West of England Class 802 SET Hybrids being specified to cope with the weather along this stretch?

Assuming that they keep to the design of the IEP units, then yes, resistance to water spray (or words to that effect) has been specified

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

Are the West of England Class 802 SET Hybrids being specified to cope with the weather along this stretch?

There's a provision in the IEP train spec about resilience to salt spray - the DfT learned the Voyager lessons.

Isn't there an 80x test train running down to Plymouth this week?
If it is running but Voyagers aren't, that tells a story.

 

[Rapidash]

Even by my admittedly high standard, it's been rough at Dawlish this week. Not even a week old, and this autumn is looking to be interesting!

1007 out of Paignton is cancelled again today. Must be the third time this week?

 

[iantherev]

There's a provision in the IEP train spec about resilience to salt spray - the DfT learned the Voyager lessons.

Isn't there an 80x test train running down to Plymouth this week?
If it is running but Voyagers aren't, that tells a story.

It's been running but the paths haven't coincided with high tides.

 

[PHILIPE]

For the last two evenings, at least, X Country services have not being running west from Exeter towards Plymouth. This is something to do with Voyagers vulnerability to spray at Dawlish, which is pretty well known,I think. But the weather isn't bad at present, and I understand they've been cancelled as a precaution. Can anyone clarify just how much risk, or lack of risk, they are prepared to accept before cancelling. If they are cancelling when the weather is really not at all bad, doesn't look good for the winter, they might end up hardly running at all?
Also why is it only in the evening they've been cancelled recently? Could it be high tides or something like that?

They were canned in the morning as well yesterday and have been in the mornings on many occasions..

 

[iantherev]

The difficulty in calling the situation is that weather in this corner of Devon can be very localised - I'm sitting in Axminster watching a gentle breeze moving the trees but the Sea Front at Seaton would be much more bracing. When the wind is ESE at Dawlish there's quite a run up the Channel across Lyme Bay for a swell one wind gust to develop.

 

[Rapidash]

Having just gone along the wall, I can assure everyone it's a wee bit windy. Waves topped a hst going the other way. Lots of pebbly detritus on the platforms

 

[NorthernSpirit]

When I went down there eight weeks back it was a HST in both directions, the sea looking towards Exmouth was somewhat reminiscent of a millpond.

 

[D1009]

I see there are strong easterly winds forecast for this Sunday (23rd) at Dawlish. If this forecast does not change we should expect Voyager cancellations around high tide which is at 1218.

 

[jopsuk]

Helpfully though the moon is at 3rd quarter so it is a neap tide.

 

[LewFinnis]

Sounds like a good reason for re-opening the old LSWR route!

 

[BestWestern]

A depressingly stupid situation. Perhaps Voyagers could be deployed in place of shipping containers to shore up the wall next time it's breached. They really aren't much good to anybody when they're on rails.

Incidentally, who gets the bill for the cancellations? It doesn't seem to be anybody's immediate fault really; NR for not controlling the sea or XC for having been lumped with awful rolling stock.

 

[Southernrover]

I was at Plymouth yesterday and the 12:25 Glasgow Central was an HST (not sure if it's booked for that).
Voyagers were running west of Exeter yesterday as the morning Penzance-Man Picc ran as did the morning York-Plymouth.
Could have coincided with low tide I guess.
Not sure of today's position.

 

[PHILIPE]

I was at Plymouth yesterday and the 12:25 Glasgow Central was an HST (not sure if it's booked for that).
Voyagers were running west of Exeter yesterday as the morning Penzance-Man Picc ran as did the morning York-Plymouth.
Could have coincided with low tide I guess.
Not sure of today's position.

Yes. Booked HST. In any case, it is Sunday (23rd) that is being talked about in terms of high winds so things should be normal until then

 

[Skipness]

Yes they are very vulnerable to salt water when it over tops the train due to the electrics on the roof.

There are very high tides at the moment, combined with an onshore wind that pushes big waves (and whales!) over the sea wall.

Network Rail issues weather warnings specifically for the sea wall and there are 2 methods of working during bad weather: Level 1, where a Pilotman rides with each train along the Down Main between Dawlish Warren and Teignmouth to assist the driver in examining the line and monitor the sea state; and Level 2, where all trains must use the bi-directional Up Main.

Since a number of Voyagers got stranded on the sea wall and effectively shut down the railway to/from the South West, to prevent another stranding NR now issue Voyager vulnerability warnings and all Voyager worked diagrams get curtailed at Exeter St David's during the high tides when the wind is likely to cause over topping waves.

This Tuesday and Wednesday, XC trains have been cancelled during morning and evening tides.

I travelled to Plymouth on Wednesday on the 10:30 from Derby. This is normally an HST diagram, but a Voyager had been substituted (cue problems with cancelled seat reservations. The tide was low at Dawlish, sea like a mill pond and legions of dog walkers on the beach.
The whale already mentioned in this thread only got as far as the beach, would have been "interesting" if it had washed over the sea wall!
I believe the camping coaches at Dawlish are to be removed as life expired. Replace with Voyagers?!!

 

[PHILIPE]

XC Canning trains through Dawlish again due to winds. Disruption could last until 1900

 

[83G/84D]

I was on board the 1544 XC service from Temple Meads today.The earlier westbound XC service was terminated at Exeter St David's and the 1544 would as well.When the 1544 arrived at Taunton a late running Penzance bound GW service was in an adjacent platform but left a minute after the XC service arrived!
A 45 minute wait ensued for the next Penzance bound HST.
The later cross country service was due to terminate at Exeter St Davids after following a Penzance bound GW service for Penzance,into Exeter.Again no hold for Cornish passengers on the XC service

The guard on the 1544 apologized but said GW were not prepared to delay their services for XC services terminating short!

 

[crewmeal]

The guard on the 1544 apologized but said GW were not prepared to delay their services for XC services terminating short!

You would think that these operators would work for the benefit of the customers not to be so selfish and work for themselves!

 

[83G/84D]

It was a good run through Dawlish (albeit it was dark) as well which makes me wonder if it was really bad enough to terminate XC services at Exeter.

Sometimes I do wonder if TOC's are more interested in performance figures for their services than the interests of passengers.

To not hold a late GW service at Tauntonfor a matter of a few minutes when it will clearly not make PPM is daft.

I suppose someone has their reasons.

 

[BestWestern]

It was a good run through Dawlish (albeit it was dark) as well which makes me wonder if it was really bad enough to terminate XC services at Exeter.

Sometimes I do wonder if TOC's are more interested in performance figures for their services than the interests of passengers.

I would think in this case the concern was sets getting past Dawlish and then being unable to get back out again. That would, in turn, cause problems for passengers later.

 

[Skipness]

I was on the 6:06 ex Edinburgh (13:44 ex Exeter) which is usually an HST. (see my post #21 above from October) There were indeed strong winds and large waves at Dawlish but the tide was low so not breaking near the sea wall. Several passengers commented on the weather conditions and the potential for later disruption.
Thankfully I wasn't travelling last Monday when Taunton was the furthest west both XC and GWR were running.

 

[D1009]

Voyagers currently terminating at Exeter due to high South Easterly winds, with high tide there due at 1750. I was on the 1541 HST from Newton Abbot, and there was definitely spray hitting the side of the train a couple of times even then.

 

[AnthonyRail]

Wonder how the IEPs will manage.

 

[Darandio]

Wonder how the IEPs will manage.

Should be fine, given that spray protection is part of the design requirement.