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Busaholic

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I think KP is a great player and we are weaker without him. His omission reflects badly on management who were unable to deal with a fantastic talent who is clearly a fantastic ego monster and a right pita to deal with while his behavior after omission (book/media etc) looks bad on him.

That said he was never going to get back in as he has burnt his bridges with the ECB and Strauss. They should have just told him to sod off and never come back, the fact they didn't makes them look stupid, although they seem to have been excelling at that recently!

I'm sure they, whoever they are, would love to have said this but we've been here before in cricket and the Kerry Packer 'rebel' series and the allegations of 'restraint of trade' that were, spuriously imo, made by some of those 'rebel' cricketers, backed financially no doubt by the Packer crowd, against cricket boards. So it remains as the elephant in the room. By the way, the last player to score a triple century in county cricket was Mike Carberry who Pietersen doesn't rate! QED?
 
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DownSouth

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And we should certainly ignore what the Australians are saying - they would love to have him messing up the team for them.
Which Australians?

He got 355 not out in the end.
I'm sure they, whoever they are, ...
da-da-da-da-de-da-da-de-da...
[youtube]aV2DLkDPwM8[/youtube]
... but we've been here before in cricket and the Kerry Packer 'rebel' series and the allegations of 'restraint of trade' that were, spuriously imo, made by some of those 'rebel' cricketers, backed financially no doubt by the Packer crowd, against cricket boards. ...
I thought that, in England at least, this was more in relation to the 'rebel' tours of South Africa in the 1980s which the ICC keeps classifying/declassifying as Test Matches whenever they need a story to distract from the real news - such as the BCCI's continued refusal to comply with the World Anti-Doping Code.

This will raise its ugly head again very soon with the Essel Group having another crack at running a parallel T20 league - and not sticking to just India this time.
... By the way, the last player to score a triple century in county cricket was Mike Carberry who Pietersen doesn't rate! QED?
Ah, but Justin Langer - former Test great and allegedly a candidate to drink from the poisoned chalice - does rate Carberry.
 
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Busaholic

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[

Ah, but Justin Langer - former Test great and allegedly a candidate to drink from the poisoned chalice - does rate Carberry.

Depends who you consider offers a poisoned chalice - latest word here is (a) that Langer could never forsake the baggy green and (b) that he's lined up to take over from Lehmann once the Aussies have been duly thrashed this summer.

The other Aussie being mentioned in dispatches re England manager is that perennial nearly-man, Tom Moody, for whom I personally have a lot of respect. If he were to be offered a one-day management role I'd be cock-a=hoop.
 

DarloRich

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I'm sure they, whoever they are, would love to have said this but we've been here before in cricket and the Kerry Packer 'rebel' series and the allegations of 'restraint of trade' that were, spuriously imo, made by some of those 'rebel' cricketers, backed financially no doubt by the Packer crowd, against cricket boards. So it remains as the elephant in the room. By the way, the last player to score a triple century in county cricket was Mike Carberry who Pietersen doesn't rate! QED?

I dont rate Carberry either - he wasn't up to it in Australia but neither were many of the others!

They, the ECB, should have told KP that he wouldn't be considered for selection, end of story.

They could have dressed it up as some form of disciplinary issue as he was still centrally contracted. I am sure the ECB contracts will have various bringing into disrepute clauses within them. His book was quite incendiary after all!
 

Busaholic

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Would anybody now be surprised to find that Pietersen had played his last match for Surrey? A score of 355 not out in your last first class innings, now that would merit a special mention in the history books!
 

Whistler40145

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I rate Pietersen as a batsman, but he's no doubt caused ill feeling in the dressing room, but saying that, I've absolutely no time for either Strauss or Cook.
 

Greenback

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It's been a messy business all along. Both parties must should some of the responsibility for what has happened. KP should not have been told that the door was still open if that wasn't the case, but he has undoubtedly had more than a hand in his own downfall.
 

Whistler40145

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All we now need is for Jason Gillespie to get the Head Coach's job and want KP in the England squad and that'll wind up Strauss!
 

Xenophon PCDGS

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It's been a messy business all along. Both parties must should some of the responsibility for what has happened. KP should not have been told that the door was still open if that wasn't the case, but he has undoubtedly had more than a hand in his own downfall.

How very strange it is, that as soon as Pietersen finds there is no place for him in the England team that a report is issued to the press that he will not be playing in the Indian Premier League on account of both calf and Achilles injuries.

So was he willing to turn out for England carrying these injuries that were never mentioned in recent times...<(
 

DownSouth

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I dont rate Carberry either - he wasn't up to it in Australia but neither were many of the others!
Has he improved after spending a full season at domestic level following his introduction to Test cricket (yes, I know he previously played one Test against Bangladesh a few years before but back then that didn't count) as is often the case for batsmen?

That's the position that Phil Hughes was in when he died last year, he was coming off the back of spending a couple of years at domestic level to hone his technique and come back into Test cricket (the Border-Gavaskar Trophy side was to be announced with his name in it the following day) as a more mature player.

The other Aussie being mentioned in dispatches re England manager is that perennial nearly-man, Tom Moody, for whom I personally have a lot of respect. If he were to be offered a one-day management role I'd be cock-a=hoop.
Tom Moody is a great "Mr Fixit" coach but not a long-term option, I can't see Strauss hiring him as it would be a blatant admission that things are in a really bad place.

He's not just an ODI specialist, when he was brought in by Sri Lanka he did a fair job of turning them into a credible Test team.

Having him as a consultant in the run up to the home World Cup in 2019 (like Australia did with Mike Young for this year) would be a good move. Poor match awareness was a huge part of England's problems in this year's group stage knockout fiasco, and anyone who saw Moody play or who has heard him as a commentator would know he reads the progress of a match about as well as anyone in the world at the moment.

They, the ECB, should have told KP that he wouldn't be considered for selection, end of story.
No. They should have simply stated that the selectors will pick the eleven players they consider the best side available, and that their decision will be final.

At the least that would have kept him in the country, earning buckets of money for both his county side and the opposition teams when playing away matches.

They could have dressed it up as some form of disciplinary issue as he was still centrally contracted. I am sure the ECB contracts will have various bringing into disrepute clauses within them. His book was quite incendiary after all!
From memory, he had to wait until his ECB contract finished (without renewal) before he released his hefty doorstop (Damian Fleming's book is a much better read, you'll at least get a laugh and the guarantee that the 'author' has actually read it himself) and so disrepute rules would not be enforceable.

If he was contracted at this time, he would not have released the book as yet. But if the ECB shenanigans played out the same way with him being contracted he would have a very significant employment law case against them, which would certainly result in a settlement potentially in the range of hundreds of thousands of pounds.

It's been a messy business all along. Both parties must should some of the responsibility for what has happened. KP should not have been told that the door was still open if that wasn't the case, but he has undoubtedly had more than a hand in his own downfall.
Indeed, for all the 'problems' caused by KP, the ECB has been desperate to trump him in that department.

But when they got knocked out of the World Cup at the same stage as the United Arab Emirates with their best ODI batsman in the commentary box, and when they couldn't win a Test series against the West Indies second stringers, it's easy to see why chasing small victories suddenly became a reasonable strategy.

All we now need is for Jason Gillespie to get the Head Coach's job and want KP in the England squad and that'll wind up Strauss!
He'd be better off declining the job now that he's seen how Andrew Strauss likes to run things. Taking the Adelaide Strikers job could not have come at a better time.

Or he could accept it, on the condition of Strauss being literally marched out of the building and tasered by security, only once Australia have won the first three Tests by a combined margin of 600 runs, one innings and eight wickets.
 
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Greenback

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How very strange it is, that as soon as Pietersen finds there is no place for him in the England team that a report is issued to the press that he will not be playing in the Indian Premier League on account of both calf and Achilles injuries.

So was he willing to turn out for England carrying these injuries that were never mentioned in recent times...<(

I thought exactly the same thing, Paul.

Meanwhile, I have some sympathy for the views expressed by Matthew Hayden that whoever gets the coach job will end up as nothing more than an ECB stooge.
 

Tetchytyke

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As an Aussie, I'm rather enjoying the sideshow of two South Africans squabbling about who gets to play for England.

FWIW I think it was the right call to bin KP. He dug his own grave with that book. The rest of the team have made it clear they won't play with him.

And as a Yorkshireman, here's hoping Gillespie runs a mile from the lot of them.
 
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Busaholic

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Colin Graves should never have given KP reason to think a couple of centuries in 2nd division championship would be enough to propel him back into the test team. For a start, Graves hadn't even taken up his position, and secondly if those are the criteria why is Ned Eckersley of Leicestershire not being touted in the same way? Who?? Exactly!
 

Greenback

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I agree that Peterson dug his own grave, and I don't think Graves should have given any undertaking either way.

As for Ned Eckersely, people will doubtless say 'Who?' because unlike KP, he hasn't been an established batsman in Test cricket, nor has he written any books that have become headlines in the media! Sometimes it's better to be relatively anonymous!
 

Xenophon PCDGS

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I hope England have a rethink and bring in Lyth to open against New Zealand and Australia.

Both Adam Lyth and Mark Wood have now been named in the 12 man England squad that will face New Zealand in the first Test Match at Lord's.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
As for Ned Eckersely, people will doubtless say 'Who?' because unlike KP, he hasn't been an established batsman in Test cricket, nor has he written any books that have become headlines in the media! Sometimes it's better to be relatively anonymous!

It is seeing a posting like that above that takes me back to 1962 and my first year at Manchester University, when Lancashire appointed Joe Blackledge as captain of their first XI. He had played a number of matches in Germany for the Army then played for the Lancashire second XI, but was unknown to many in the County Championship. He only lasted one season as captain.

Knowing of your deep interest in the sport of Rugby Union, one item of interest is that Joe Blackledge was the uncle of the England Rugby Union team captain, Bill Beaumont, whose career in sport was far more impressive than that of his uncle.
 
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Whistler40145

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Read an article in the latest Wisden Cricketer magazine that Sachin Tendulkar and Shane Warne are working on a new 20 over series for retired international cricketers, including the likes of Gilchrist, Ponting, Flintoff.
 

DownSouth

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Well this is interesting - the ABC is reporting today that Justin Langer has confirmed he received a call from Andrew Strauss offering him the England coaching position, and that he then signed a contract!






The contract is a renewal of his position as head coach of Western Australia and the Perth Scorchers.
 

Whistler40145

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Well I didn't think for one moment with the Ashes series coming up an Aussie would take on the job. I've heard that Mickey Arthur, the ex-Aussie & South African Coach is very interested in the England Coaching job.
 
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DownSouth

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I thoroughly approve of Mickey Arthur taking the job. He would be a good fit for the team culture and a worthy successor to Peter Moores.
 

DownSouth

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Well I didn't think for one moment with the Ashes series coming up an Aussie would take on the job.
What, like Saker did to mastermind the England attack for the 2009 (correction - actually 2010-11) series?

Mickey Arthur took Australian citizenship three years ago, by the way.
Looks like we both agree DownSouth.
For very different reasons!
 
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muddythefish

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Mickey Arthur was the best Australia coach of the past 30 years. I thoroughly enjoyed watching his teams.
 
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Busaholic

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Well this is interesting - the ABC is reporting today that Justin Langer has confirmed he received a call from Andrew Strauss offering him the England coaching position, and that he then signed a contract!






The contract is a renewal of his position as head coach of Western Australia and the Perth Scorchers.

If this is what ABC reported, then it's at odds with the reports in one of last Sunday's British newspapers quoting Langer as seriously considering any such offer with his head, but not with his heart, and in the end it was family considerations that swayed him to stay put: not that he was formally offered anything anyway, it's not in Strauss's gift! Just two old Middlesex buddies chewing the cud!
The same newspaper indicated there is a real possibility of Ashley Giles being offered the job, the speculation being that Gillespie J. might turn down the job if not allowed to help pick the team, which is code for 'if told he is not allowed to consider Pietersen K. for selection'.
 

Xenophon PCDGS

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In a batting performance remarkably like an England Test Match batting collapse this afternoon, Leicestershire in their second innings went from being 20-0 to 29-7 against Lancashire....:shock:.....A late rally availed them naught as they were all out for 78 and Lancashire won by 244 runs.

Good bowling return by Lancashire pace bowler, Tom Bailey, of 9 - 5 - 12 - 5.



--- old post above --- --- new post below ---


All we now need is for Jason Gillespie to get the Head Coach's job and want KP in the England squad and that'll wind up Strauss!

Well, he will be holding talks tomorrow with Strauss about the vacant England role of head coach, so I wonder if he will remember to bring that specific matter that you quote above at their meeting...:roll:
 
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Busaholic

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I have a solution to the KP problem that should be acceptable to everyone/no-one (delete as applicable) concerned.

Five tests in this Ashes summer (are they coming round sooner or am I getting older?). Keep tests nos. 1, 3 and 5 under the present set-up, give tests 2 and 4 to Geoff Boycott and Michael Vaughan to select the teams for, doubtless appointing a certain South African as the captain, with a power of veto on any of their selections. That way we could certainly compare and contrast the performances. That said, any player selected and not wishing to play under the second regime would be allowed to be excused and this would not affeact their official standing. I'd imagine four or five of the last XI to represent England might not be selected by KP and co, including Cook and Broad.

A good idea or what? Answers preferably BEFORE the first day's play v NZ tomorrow.

PS Rhetorical question above/
 
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Whistler40145

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Good grief, I wouldn't let Boycs choose a team, he'd have players in the side that'd take 5 hours to score 10 runs!
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Now, Lyth should make his England debut, but would you choose Jordan or Wood?
 

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