First West of England (Bristol, Bath & The West)

[TheGrandWazoo]

"Below is a selection of vehicles we currently have for disposal. If the exact vehicle specification you require is not on the list, give us a call and we will check our fleet list to try and find the vehicle you are looking for."

Sounds to me that if the price is right they would accept offers on other vehicles.

I think you've read it wrong. The wording says that "Below is a selection of vehicles we currently have for disposal. If the exact vehicle specification you require is not on the list, give us a call and we will check our fleet list to try and find the vehicle you are looking for."

A selection - it isn't the full list! Of course, if some spanner rocked up and offered £250k for a B7TL, then I'm sure they'd snatch their hands off but they're not inviting offers for the fleet. In fact, they're actively looking for e200s to join so expect more of the MAN and MCV to leave Faresaver and be disposed of to or via NextBus

 

[Class 33]

The axing of the 51. Many people are furious about this. A petition to save the 51 currently has over 2000 signatures. And a protest is due to take place at Broad Walk Shopping Centre today between 12pm and 12:45pm. http://www.bristolpost.co.uk/the-br...s-or-doctors/story-29612954-detail/story.html

Hope it gets TV news coverage on ITV News Westcountry and/or BBC Points West News. Though the axing of the 20 didn't get any TV news coverage, though thankfully that situation was resolved with the replacement service 520.

At least two bus companies have expressed an interest in taking over the service. Maybe Wessex Connect and Abus?

Whilst the 51(or an alternative new replacement service) is not running though, I can imagine that this will effect both the 2 and the 376. As with there being no 51, people travelling between Wells Road and Centre/Broadmead will only have the 2 and 376 to use now. Which will mean increased volumes of passengers and increased loading/unloading times at bus stop, and increased journey times!

How busy is the 51 at peak times travelling to and from Centre/Broadmead?

 

[LeylandLynx]

The axing of the 51. Many people are furious about this. A petition to save the 51 currently has over 2000 signatures. And a protest is due to take place at Broad Walk Shopping Centre today between 12pm and 12:45pm. http://www.bristolpost.co.uk/the-br...s-or-doctors/story-29612954-detail/story.html

Hope it gets TV news coverage on ITV News Westcountry and/or BBC Points West News. Though the axing of the 20 didn't get any TV news coverage, though thankfully that situation was resolved with the replacement service 520.

At least two bus companies have expressed an interest in taking over the service. Maybe Wessex Connect and Abus?

Whilst the 51(or an alternative new replacement service) is not running though, I can imagine that this will effect both the 2 and the 376. As with there being no 51, people travelling between Wells Road and Centre/Broadmead will only have the 2 and 376 to use now. Which will mean increased volumes of passengers and increased loading/unloading times at bus stop, and increased journey times!

How busy is the 51 at peak times travelling to and from Centre/Broadmead?

When I use to get the 51 home, I would get on the 5:15 bus from the City Centre. It was usually always a double decker and, unless there was a 2 right in front, both decks would fill up with every seat taken, so much so that sometimes people would come up the stairs only to find no availbale seats, and then would have to go back down and stand up.

 

[Class 33]

When I use to get the 51 home, I would get on the 5:15 bus from the City Centre. It was usually always a double decker and, unless there was a 2 right in front, both decks would fill up with every seat taken, so much so that sometimes people would come up the stairs only to find no availbale seats, and then would have to go back down and stand up.

Busy then. The 2 and 376 would probably be pretty full at this sort of time too. Which means not only would these services be full and standing, it will also mean a number of people being unable to board and having to wait for the next bus and hope they can get a seat(or standing space!) on that!

I've always said that an extra city service is needed really to run via the upper part of Wells Road. To take pressure off the 376, 2, and 51. As the 376 is a country service, yet a lot of people use it between Broadmead, Wells Road, and Whitchurch. Which causes extra loading/unloading times and slows down journey times.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

See Steve White is reporting that 32069 is now repainted and lettered up for Bath Spa Uni services. Don't know if already repainted 32075 has been done

 

[THarris123]

Busy then. The 2 and 376 would probably be pretty full at this sort of time too. Which means not only would these services be full and standing, it will also mean a number of people being unable to board and having to wait for the next bus and hope they can get a seat(or standing space!) on that!

I've always said that an extra city service is needed really to run via the upper part of Wells Road. To take pressure off the 376, 2, and 51. As the 376 is a country service, yet a lot of people use it between Broadmead, Wells Road, and Whitchurch. Which causes extra loading/unloading times and slows down journey times.

It'll be completely packed on 2 and 376. Both are usually full at peak anyway. 51 is currently full on most peak duties, so you can imagine the mess.

Worse thing is as you say, it ensures more city travellers on the country route of 376, so that then means that people trying to get all the way to Glastonbury have another 30 min wait, compared to a 10 min wait for a bus to Broadwalk. Not fair and not good. The crowds on 376 were one reason why I gave up in Bristol, so now there's no hope.

I'm in Bristol on 9th, so will be able to tell if it's anymore packed at peak.

Don't forget Cityfox might be interested or maybe even CT plus??
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

See Steve White is reporting that 32069 is now repainted and lettered up for Bath Spa Uni services. Don't know if already repainted 32075 has been done

I assume that 32069 has been swapped for 32352?

Do we know why they're putting 15 year old deckers on university routes?

Maybe we'll see 32062-76 in Bath?

 

[winston270twm]

The axing of the 51. Many people are furious about this. A petition to save the 51 currently has over 2000 signatures. And a protest is due to take place at Broad Walk Shopping Centre today between 12pm and 12:45pm. http://www.bristolpost.co.uk/the-br...s-or-doctors/story-29612954-detail/story.html

Hope it gets TV news coverage on ITV News Westcountry and/or BBC Points West News. Though the axing of the 20 didn't get any TV news coverage, though thankfully that situation was resolved with the replacement service 520.

At least two bus companies have expressed an interest in taking over the service. Maybe Wessex Connect and Abus?

Whilst the 51(or an alternative new replacement service) is not running though, I can imagine that this will effect both the 2 and the 376. As with there being no 51, people travelling between Wells Road and Centre/Broadmead will only have the 2 and 376 to use now. Which will mean increased volumes of passengers and increased loading/unloading times at bus stop, and increased journey times!

How busy is the 51 at peak times travelling to and from Centre/Broadmead?

I personally think Wessex taking on the 51 would be a good move, First clearly want them out of UWE & there sounds like there's plenty of demand for the 51 which First are abondoning in favour of moving resources to further compete with Wessex at Bath (U2) & Bristol (new UWE service)

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

It'll be completely packed on 2 and 376. Both are usually full at peak anyway. 51 is currently full on most peak duties, so you can imagine the mess.

Worse thing is as you say, it ensures more city travellers on the country route of 376, so that then means that people trying to get all the way to Glastonbury have another 30 min wait, compared to a 10 min wait for a bus to Broadwalk. Not fair and not good. The crowds on 376 were one reason why I gave up in Bristol, so now there's no hope.

I'm in Bristol on 9th, so will be able to tell if it's anymore packed at peak.

Don't forget Cityfox might be interested or maybe even CT plus??
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---


I assume that 32069 has been swapped for 32352?

Do we know why they're putting 15 year old deckers on university routes?

Maybe we'll see 32062-76 in Bath?

I would expect that the U5/U6 are simply not as lucrative as the U1 and also don't have the level of year round traffic (not as many overseas and post grad students?).

So repaint, refurb, pop some dateless plates on them and they'll be ok for another 3 years.

As for guessing the batch, I'm assuming there's a typo there? They may just paint the ones allocated and a couple of others rather than some neat little batch as that's what they did with the W-PAE ones?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

I personally think Wessex taking on the 51 would be a good move, First clearly want them out of UWE & there sounds like there's plenty of demand for the 51 which First are abondoning in favour of moving resources to further compete with Wessex at Bath (U2) & Bristol (new UWE service)

I always sound a note of caution on this sort of thing; perhaps more so as I do think the 51 cut is perhaps the most surprising and was always going to be contentious. However, here goes....

Firstly, I'm always surprised how it seems that services are reported by people on this forum and others as being absolutely packed etc etc or that they very popular etc. Yet bus companies, with their wealth of data from ticket machines on every journey seem to make the decision to cut very profitable services?

Moreover, we've seen this before with cutting of the 20. This was supposed to be some veritable goldmine yet... no-one came in for it. The usual suspects were mentioned (e.g. Wessex, Abus, Severnside) and the CityFox negotiation via Twitter which came to nought. We have also heard it with the 52 and 57 - both allegedly "very important" and yet barely able to sustain a service without it being mainly worked around schools workings at marginal cost

Now, I do have the concerns about the possible impact on the Wells Road corridor. Not so much on the 376 but more on the 2. Country passengers inbound are already on the 376 and a good number will be joining at the bus station though I concede there may be some issues. However, the 2 will be asked to deal with most of the traffic.

The main question is how much of the traffic is for the route post Broadwalk (and can be accommodated by the new 50), and how much is actually just being abstracted from the 2 and 376. I hope FB have got their sums correct.

 

[THarris123]

I would expect that the U5/U6 are simply not as lucrative as the U1 and also don't have the level of year round traffic (not as many overseas and post grad students?).

So repaint, refurb, pop some dateless plates on them and they'll be ok for another 3 years.

As for guessing the batch, I'm assuming there's a typo there? They may just paint the ones allocated and a couple of others rather than some neat little batch as that's what they did with the W-PAE ones?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---


I always sound a note of caution on this sort of thing; perhaps more so as I do think the 51 cut is perhaps the most surprising and was always going to be contentious. However, here goes....

Firstly, I'm always surprised how it seems that services are reported by people on this forum and others as being absolutely packed etc etc or that they very popular etc. Yet bus companies, with their wealth of data from ticket machines on every journey seem to make the decision to cut very profitable services?

Moreover, we've seen this before with cutting of the 20. This was supposed to be some veritable goldmine yet... no-one came in for it. The usual suspects were mentioned (e.g. Wessex, Abus, Severnside) and the CityFox negotiation via Twitter which came to nought. We have also heard it with the 52 and 57 - both allegedly "very important" and yet barely able to sustain a service without it being mainly worked around schools workings at marginal cost

Now, I do have the concerns about the possible impact on the Wells Road corridor. Not so much on the 376 but more on the 2. Country passengers inbound are already on the 376 and a good number will be joining at the bus station though I concede there may be some issues. However, the 2 will be asked to deal with most of the traffic.

The main question is how much of the traffic is for the route post Broadwalk (and can be accommodated by the new 50), and how much is actually just being abstracted from the 2 and 376. I hope FB have got their sums correct.

Yes it is a typo sorry - i meant 32069. It could be that they're doing the same as they did with 18 - re brand it, chuck some old rubbish on there, build up the brand and then bring in New vehicles next year?

51 is a bit different. Having seen and experienced 20, it was clearly not picking up the passengers. Even the 50 doesn't pick up enough from what I've seen. 52 and 57 certainly don't pick up enough custom - peak is different as I usually saw both quite packed, the rest of the day was pathetic.

Whenever I've seen 51 it is always pretty full, however most of the time it would be singles I saw. Peak always and still has people standing - i never saw that on 20, 52 or 57.

I'd probably say about 30-50% of passengers on 51 go to Broadwalk and about 20-30% could use 2 or 376. That's at least an extra 15-20 passengers per journey to queue onto the other services.

I think it is just a way to get more using 2 and 376 to justify the new vehicles and maybe to even push a business case through for having 376 every 20 mins. By my reckoning, 376 isn't worth every 20 mins, but a few extra journeys could be added in. Certainly something needs to be done to take some of the city traffic off 376 as it makes it so slow getting in for work.

 

[Private Baxter]

Yes it is a typo sorry - i meant 32069. It could be that they're doing the same as they did with 18 - re brand it, chuck some old rubbish on there, build up the brand and then bring in New vehicles next year?

51 is a bit different. Having seen and experienced 20, it was clearly not picking up the passengers. Even the 50 doesn't pick up enough from what I've seen. 52 and 57 certainly don't pick up enough custom - peak is different as I usually saw both quite packed, the rest of the day was pathetic.

Whenever I've seen 51 it is always pretty full, however most of the time it would be singles I saw. Peak always and still has people standing - i never saw that on 20, 52 or 57.

I'd probably say about 30-50% of passengers on 51 go to Broadwalk and about 20-30% could use 2 or 376. That's at least an extra 15-20 passengers per journey to queue onto the other services.

I think it is just a way to get more using 2 and 376 to justify the new vehicles and maybe to even push a business case through for having 376 every 20 mins. By my reckoning, 376 isn't worth every 20 mins, but a few extra journeys could be added in. Certainly something needs to be done to take some of the city traffic off 376 as it makes it so slow getting in for work.

Though not as well used, the loss of the 379 will also have an impact on 376, and that is more likely to push forward a case for upping the 376 to every 20 mins. Either way, I think loss of 51 and 379 will increase loadings on both 2 and 376.

 

[LeylandLynx]

Yes it is a typo sorry - i meant 32069. It could be that they're doing the same as they did with 18 - re brand it, chuck some old rubbish on there, build up the brand and then bring in New vehicles next year?

51 is a bit different. Having seen and experienced 20, it was clearly not picking up the passengers. Even the 50 doesn't pick up enough from what I've seen. 52 and 57 certainly don't pick up enough custom - peak is different as I usually saw both quite packed, the rest of the day was pathetic.

Whenever I've seen 51 it is always pretty full, however most of the time it would be singles I saw. Peak always and still has people standing - i never saw that on 20, 52 or 57.

I'd probably say about 30-50% of passengers on 51 go to Broadwalk and about 20-30% could use 2 or 376. That's at least an extra 15-20 passengers per journey to queue onto the other services.

I think it is just a way to get more using 2 and 376 to justify the new vehicles and maybe to even push a business case through for having 376 every 20 mins. By my reckoning, 376 isn't worth every 20 mins, but a few extra journeys could be added in. Certainly something needs to be done to take some of the city traffic off 376 as it makes it so slow getting in for work.

The 51 is usually rather quiet during off-peak times on inbound journeys. However, outbound off-peak journeys tend to be a little busier, occasionally filling just over half a double-decker, but it can be pretty quiet too. The 50 on the other hand is a different story. The double-deckers are almost invariably over half-full on inbound off-peak journeys, with the exception of late afternoons perhaps.

But the 51 seems busier now during off-peak times because the schools have broken up and loads of families are going out with their kids.

Another thing popped into my mind. A few years ago First withdrew inbound journeys from Belland Drive and later withdrew the entire Windways estate and Tanorth Raod section of the route from the 51. This may have contributed to declining passenger numbers during off-peak journeys. Instead, First tacked on this segment of the route onto the 50, but the 50 does not serve Broad Walk, and thus probably less people used that section of the route.

 

[Marc]

i think anybody else doing 51 would need to make it a differant propasition to the 50. perhaps even make it limited stop between broadwalk and the city to make it much quicker than 50. the new 50 is going to be really slow between rookary farm and windways estate, epsecially if there is the usual crappy parking around the place.

ive seen on twitter that city fox have been talking to some bristol counsellors but they still dont have any buses or a license to run them so whats the point.

im sure abus would do a good job of it but 52 and 57 have been reduced over the past few years.

 

[nesw]

Remember there's always Mr. Stockley and 'Cityfox bus'.

 

[carlberry]

i think anybody else doing 51 would need to make it a differant propasition to the 50. perhaps even make it limited stop between broadwalk and the city to make it much quicker than 50. the new 50 is going to be really slow between rookary farm and windways estate, epsecially if there is the usual crappy parking around the place.

ive seen on twitter that city fox have been talking to some bristol counsellors but they still dont have any buses or a license to run them so whats the point.

im sure abus would do a good job of it but 52 and 57 have been reduced over the past few years.

It's good to hear that City Fox are going to rescue it. It's bound to be a happy ending now, like all the previous routes they've offered to rescue!

 

[winston270twm]

Remember there's always Mr. Stockley and 'Cityfox bus'.

Cityfox 'photoshop' bus you mean, even if the op ever runs a bus service, it will never be taken seriously.

 

[Colly405]

Cityfox 'photoshop' bus you mean, even if the op ever runs a bus service, it will never be taken seriously.

By enthusiasts possibly, but would the public care? Surely to them a bus is a bus, and if the good folk of south Bristol need a bus service that First aren't providing then does it matter to them who provides it, whether it is Abus. Wessex, Bath Bus, City Fox or anyone else?

 

[Marc]

By enthusiasts possibly, but would the public care? Surely to them a bus is a bus, and if the good folk of south Bristol need a bus service that First aren't providing then does it matter to them who provides it, whether it is Abus. Wessex, Bath Bus, City Fox or anyone else?

yes it does because you cant use a dayrider on anyone but first. sotuh bristol is all dayriders and season tickets for fare payers.

 

[THarris123]

yes it does because you cant use a dayrider on anyone but first. sotuh bristol is all dayriders and season tickets for fare payers.

So the Bristol rider and Avon Rider tickets aren't available then?

 

[carlberry]

So the Bristol rider and Avon Rider tickets aren't available then?

Not on Cityfox they arnt, or Stagecoach at the moment.

 

[Class 33]

i think anybody else doing 51 would need to make it a differant propasition to the 50. perhaps even make it limited stop between broadwalk and the city to make it much quicker than 50. the new 50 is going to be really slow between rookary farm and windways estate, epsecially if there is the usual crappy parking around the place.

With there being otherwise only the 2 and 376 for passengers between Wells Road and Broadmead, making the new 51 limited stop won't help ease overcrowding much on these services. The new 51 would need to serve all bus stops.

It's the 376 country service which should be limited stop between Broad Walk and Temple Meads really. But that's only if there are enough other city services running via Wells Road.

Anyway according to what councillor Gary Hopkins said at the protest yesterday, it does look fairly promising that a solution will be found in that another operator will take over the service from September 4th. This should be known for sure within the next 10 days. http://www.bristolpost.co.uk/live-p...217-s-51-bus/story-29615986-detail/story.html

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Not on Cityfox they arnt, or Stagecoach at the moment.

Surely, CityFox would have to be running bus services to join the scheme.

Given that most of the Stagecoach work are SGC tenders, they may well be expected to accept AvonRiders - just that it isn't publicised.

 

[ooo]

So the Bristol rider and Avon Rider tickets aren't available then?

For families and children it would be much more expensive with the lack of a family ticket and the small discount for children.

 

[THarris123]

Not on Cityfox they arnt, or Stagecoach at the moment.

Cityfox don't operate any services though. Stagecoach only operate in South Glos.

 

[swifty]

Anyone seen how many of the Bath bendies have been out on Balloon Shuttles?

 

[Marc]

So the Bristol rider and Avon Rider tickets aren't available then?

but that asumes that people will buy them instead of first dayriders at the start of the day whitch they wont because 95% of passenger dont even know what they are. to most passengers in bristol - especialy south bristol where first have always had the market sown up - first run the buses. they dont care what colours they are or what name it says on the side. a bus is a bus and if they bougt a dayrider they will expect to use it. that is why nobody else stands a chance.

 

[Colly405]

but that asumes that people will buy them instead of first dayriders at the start of the day whitch they wont because 95% of passenger dont even know what they are. to most passengers in bristol - especialy south bristol where first have always had the market sown up - first run the buses. they dont care what colours they are or what name it says on the side. a bus is a bus and if they bougt a dayrider they will expect to use it. that is why nobody else stands a chance.

Have First really had South Bristol sown up? The 52, 57/67, 349, 511, 512 ,513 ,514 ,515 and A4 are all current, all S Bristol and all not First.

 

[vicbury]

Anyone seen how many of the Bath bendies have been out on Balloon Shuttles?

I only saw one 55-reg one today, belting out plenty of black smoke.. Didn't catch the number despite waiting behind it for a good 10 minutes unfortunately. Think it was 10179.

I caught an Enviro 400 MMC in one direction and a 57-reg B9 Gemini in the other. Both branded for the 1/2. Got to say I preferred the B9 despite having to stand.

Overall I thought the shuttle was well organised and was happy to pay the £2 supplement over a day ticket. Shame it doesn't go further into Ashton Court than the regular buses though, next year I might chance getting one of the North Somerset services instead.

Also pleasing to see how many people changed from the shuttle bus onto the 39 towards Bath, which was full and standing leaving Temple Meads circa 2015. The 39 going every 20 minutes next month will go down very well, I imagine.

Finally, travelling to Bristol this afternoon, the driver of the 39 went down the Keynsham Bypass. Oops. Shame he went back to Keynsham at Hicks Gate!

 

[THarris123]

I saw 10179 doing the fiesta shuttle and 10178 was parked up NIS on the M32 route heading out of Bristol (next to Holiday bin)
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Looking at 178 route map on First page - good to see a picture of Bath there and it appears to not be running on a Sunday from Sept according to that map!

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

I saw 10179 doing the fiesta shuttle and 10178 was parked up NIS on the M32 route heading out of Bristol (next to Holiday bin)
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Looking at 178 route map on First page - good to see a picture of Bath there and it appears to not be running on a Sunday from Sept according to that map!

That is a cock up! 4 Sun journeys tendered

 

[ValleyLines142]

Loads of buses on the Balloon Shuttle today, including 10178, 10179, 32763, 33956, 35115, 37164, 37321, 37328, 37331, 37594 and 39191.

Last year I remember paying the extra to upgrade my Day Rider but having realised the X2 and X3 stops closer (just outside UWE Bower Ashton) I wondered why on earth I bothered. Therefore this year I decided to get the X2.

Unfortunately, Bristol was in complete lockdown all day due to a suspect package found in a vehicle outside the police station, with the police practically shutting off all of the city centre from Union Street to the Horsefair and the Haymarket. Some of the diversions buses were taking were very unusual. The 75/76 appeared to be running from Broad Quay, then up Park Street, loop around the Triangle, back down Queens Road and past the bus station regaining the usual route at the Bearpit. Lawrence Hill services (i.e. 42-49) appeared to be running from the Bearpit via Queens Road, Park Street, the centre, Baldwin Street, Wine Street and via Old Market and out like the 36, same for the 1/2 except turning right onto Victoria Street. Hotwells services appeared to be doing the same, coming from Anchor Road/Canons Marsh. Very unusual diversion indeed but Queens Road and Old Market were the only two ways in and out of the city for the best part of six hours.

In the end I had to get the Balloon Shuttle despite my theory, as that was possible the only route that wasn't affected! Plenty of buses although I did have 10179 both ways, which was a squeeze, annoying when there were plenty of deckers on also.