Platform Overshoot - Do They Happen Often?

[GaryMcEwan]

Currently travelling from Croy to Glasgow Queen Street which was meant to be stopping at Lenzie.

As we were approaching Lenzie the driver was coming in far too fast and had to slam on the brakes in the result the front 3 carriages of a 6 carriage train overshot the platform. Does this happen often?

This is the very first time where I've been on a train where it's overshot the platform.

 

[stephens]

I've been on two trains that have overshot the platform:
1) A VTWC northbound service failed to stop at Milton Keyes. Stopped in emergency and eventually had to reverse back into the station. TM obviously had not noticed that the train was not in the platform and announced to mind the gap between train and platform.
2) Commute from Preston to Blackpool, Northern service forgot to stop at Kirkham. Had to reverse to pick up passengers who were panicking as the following train was cancelled.

 

[6Gman]

Never overshot - but twice missed a stop.

Tiverton Parkway many years ago. Taplow earlier this year.

In neither case was there any attempt to stop - Driver simply thought Taunton/ Maidenhead was next stop!

 

[HarleyDavidson]

Missed a few over the years, mostly down to low adhesion or on one occasion trying to do a "controlled" stop for a signaller and missed the station by the best part of ½ mile!

Last time I did it was nearly 10 years ago now.

 

[GaryMcEwan]

When the driver overshot tonight, he couldn't reverse back into Lenzie so 70+ passengers were a tad annoyed about going into Queen Street to then go back to Lenzie.

The train that we were on doesn't usually stop at Lenzie as it was an Edinburgh to Glasgow Express, so I wonder if driver forgot then remembered as he was going at some lick on the approach to Lenzie.

 

[HarleyDavidson]

When the driver overshot tonight, he couldn't reverse back into Lenzie so 70+ passengers were a tad annoyed about going into Queen Street to then go back to Lenzie.

The train that we were on doesn't usually stop at Lenzie as it was an Edinburgh to Glasgow Express, so I wonder if driver forgot then remembered as he was going at some lick on the approach to Lenzie.

If the driver had been given a SSO for Lenzie he may well have forgotten about it, especially if it was issued via the GSM-R and was thinking about the next "booked" stop, if it's a paper SSO it's a little harder to forget unless it dropped onto the floor.

If I get a paper SSO then it goes in front of me by the speedo or under the edge of it, that way it can't go anywhere, if they issue it via GSM-R then the schedule sheet gets amended and put in the same place as a paper one would.

I've had one signaller chance his luck asking me to do a SSO at New Malden, just as I hit the points at the end of the platform there, errr, nah sorry mate bit too late that one!

We've also had them where they've amended the diagram. but not put anything on the schedule, so the driver doesn't know anything of the extra stop until either passcom goes off or the guard or signaller says something.

 

[bramling]

Currently travelling from Croy to Glasgow Queen Street which was meant to be stopping at Lenzie.

As we were approaching Lenzie the driver was coming in far too fast and had to slam on the brakes in the result the front 3 carriages of a 6 carriage train overshot the platform. Does this happen often?

This is the very first time where I've been on a train where it's overshot the platform.

Pretty rare but by no means unheard of, although more common at this time of year. Normally either due to adhesion problems, or the driver forgetting the stop and then throwing it all on but too late - especially if it’s a service that has an untypical stopping pattern. Much more rarely it may be down to poor brakes on the train. It’s very rare indeed for a driver to simply misjudge their braking, although even this can happen for example due to getting braking markers mixed up.

For those who think driverless might be better, ATO does it too - normally at rather more inconvenient moments too.

 

[Dhassell]

There was a case a few months ago where a GWR driver forgot to stop at Pilning, pretty easy to miss considering it's only served twice each way on a saturday!

 

[coxxy]

Doesn't happen all the time but not unheard of.. especially this time of year being leaf fall etc.. very easy for drivers to end up in a slide..

 

[thedbdiboy]

I remember back in the 1980s the one section of line where the 501s on the London LM DC lines could get up a head of speed was in the up direction between Carpenders Park and Hatch End (my stop) - it was a gentle downhill with the longest gap between stations on the Watford-Euston line and many of the drivers used to let the units fly, making a fairly hard brake application that needed to come on as the train went under the footbridge to the north of the station. On one occasion the driver was a little late off the mark and sailed all the way through Hatch End to end up with the front unit off the platform. I was in the front coach so opened the door (yippee - no central locking back then) and waved back to the guard. The train backed up, I got off and went home. All splendid fun......

 

[ChiefPlanner]

I remember back in the 1980s the one section of line where the 501s on the London LM DC lines could get up a head of speed was in the up direction between Carpenders Park and Hatch End (my stop) - it was a gentle downhill with the longest gap between stations on the Watford-Euston line and many of the drivers used to let the units fly, making a fairly hard brake application that needed to come on as the train went under the footbridge to the north of the station. On one occasion the driver was a little late off the mark and sailed all the way through Hatch End to end up with the front unit off the platform. I was in the front coach so opened the door (yippee - no central locking back then) and waved back to the guard. The train backed up, I got off and went home. All splendid fun......

Hatch End was well known for "failures to call" ...even in 501 days , and especially in 313 days. Tree lopping brought out the sandal wearers , so the message was passed on "no lopping -no train service - choose ?" .....

About 2/3 a day generally in leaf fall season ...

 

[Steddenm]

Not a failure to stop, but I was at Bristol Parkway once when a CrossCountry HST set stopped at the old VT STOP marker on the platform leaving coaches hanging off the platform. The guard hadn't noticed and unlocked the doors (on platform 4) which the platform staff were screaming at passengers NOT to get off the train. The doors were hastily locked and the HST moved back up to the corrects stop marker.

Also I was working as security on a football special (chartered train) between Liverpool Lime Street and London Euston for some kind of football cup final, and the loco and coaching stock was too long for the platform at Euston and thereby leaving two coaches hanging off the end of the platform. The train was originally booked to terminate at Wembley Central but due to the length of the train it was extended to Euston. Very panicked announcements on the train by the guard (I think it was West Coast Railway Company) saying passengers move towards the front of the train. On the way back it was even worse as the departure boards at the station said we were departing Platform 1, yet we were in Platform 18 (I think). There was TWO charters both timed to leave about five minutes apart to Liverpool Lime Street that night for the football, and both were listed as Platform 1.

 

[fowler9]

Back in the day I remember a few near overshoots on class 37 hauled services from Liverpool to Cardiff at West Allerton, never an actual overshoot though. More recently I can remember a few stopping short with the rear unit hanging off the back of the platform.

 

[Y Ddraig Coch]

Happened twice to be both times either late 80's or early 90's both times on a 101 , first time over shot Conwy station ended up in the tunnel. Guard made the driver reverse giving it 3 on the buzzer then 1 when in postion.

Next time a bit more serious but in them days everyone got up and got on with it rather than trying to claim and exagerate, we overshot at Llandudno, hit the buffers pretty hard, everyone was stood ready to get off and quite a few ended up on the floor. Nobody really hurt as far as I remember although I was quite young.

 

[whhistle]

While I understand it does happen, it does worry me that drivers simply "forget" their journey details.

 

[gordonthemoron]

sometime early 90's, Northbound ECML train overshot the platform at Grantham completely

 

[bramling]

While I understand it does happen, it does worry me that drivers simply "forget" their journey details.

It’s not as simple as forgetting. Stopping patterns vary, and it’s very easy to drive on autopilot because of the repetitive nature of the driving job, particularly if one nearly always non-stops a station when running on that line or whilst driving that traction. Autopilot driving is very common, and comes about through always doing the same actions in the same places which for the most part is how to drive a train on a given route.

 

[Arglwydd Golau]

Only once happened to me. as far as I can recall. Colwyn Bay, returning from Crewe to Llanfairfechan on a 47 hauled train around1986. The A55 expressway had just opened adjacent to the railway, the train overshot the platform by about 3 coach lengths. Of course, it could have been adhesion issues, but at the time I thought that the driver was racing the cars.....

 

[Mordac]

Only happened to me once, on the 06:15 from Edinburgh to Manchester (and yes, it was Autumn). Driver overshot the platform by about two coaches at Oxenholme.

Then he had to contact the signaller, so the walk of shame through the train to the rear cab, and reverse. After all this rigmarole, we had to be looped to allow the Voyager from Edinburgh to overtake us, meaning I could have got the later train and got to Lancaster earlier!!!

Why must the driver go to the rear cab, rather than just reverse this short distance from the front?

 

[Bromley boy]

Only happene
Why must the driver go to the rear cab, rather than just reverse this short distance from the front?

It does seem silly, but it’s just the way it is. The thinking is you need to be able to see where you are going if you set back. Even if it’s only a few feet.

You also need the signaller’s permission to set back. More often than not they will tell you to proceed to the next station to minimise delays.

 

[Antman]

I've seen a few drivers forgetting to stop but never an overshoot although I should think it's easily done this time of year with the leaf fall although not much rain recently.

 

[Dieseldriver]

While I understand it does happen, it does worry me that drivers simply "forget" their journey details.

Not sure how it's worrying. In terms of an operational incident, a fail to call is the safest one. There are many factors of train driving to consider and it is easy to overlook a station with irregular stopping patterns due to a multitude of reasons. A fail to call is taken seriously and has potential career implications (as does any incident) so every Driver dreads having these kind of incidents.

 

[coxxy]

Why must the driver go to the rear cab, rather than just reverse this short distance from the front?

At the point where you can't see where your driving the move becomes propelling.. and believe me there's a whole host of other rules for propelling. Plus not to mention on a doo service there would be no one to tell you if your on the platform at the back of not and risking another..

 

[Spartacus]

Not too long ago all the Hull - Manchester TPEs were express between Leeds and York, except for one evening peak (later two) which was booked to stop at Dewsbury with a 170(and which was almost a booked relief in itself). Almost inevitably the driver would occasionally slip into automatic and you'd be taken through to Huddersfield. Once stopped right at the Huddersfield end of the platform as the guard had reminded the driver when he'd not started to apply the brake in the usual place!

 

[ComUtoR]

While I understand it does happen, it does worry me that drivers simply "forget" their journey details.

I can do 100+ stops in a single day. The most I've every counted was 144. Statistics alone means that missing one is pretty easy to do.

There are many reasons why a Driver 'forgets'

 

[Antman]

Not sure how it's worrying. In terms of an operational incident, a fail to call is the safest one. There are many factors of train driving to consider and it is easy to overlook a station with irregular stopping patterns due to a multitude of reasons. A fail to call is taken seriously and has potential career implications (as does any incident) so every Driver dreads having these kind of incidents.

I think a forget to call is just one of those things, no great harm done and passengers (sometimes!) see the funny side and in extreme cases just put them in a taxi back to their intended destination.

 

[RPM]

While I understand it does happen, it does worry me that drivers simply "forget" their journey details.

People often seem shocked and incredulous that drivers occasionally miss a stop but it isn't really that difficult to understand. Distractions can occur. Stopping patterns sometimes seem designed to catch drivers out. It is often necessary to brake for a station way before it is visible. A very short lapse of concentration is all that it takes.

 

[Thebaz]

I've been on trains twice where that has happened, must be 12 or more years ago now. One was a rush hour train (8-car 455) from LBG to Dorking where the first stop was scheduled to be Forest Hill. About 20 seconds after we'd gone careering through the station - I could see the looks of surprise on the faces of the waiting passengers - the driver came on to the tannoy to apologise for the failure to call "due to driver error" as he put it. We arrived at Sydenham 2E and waited there for time to catch up. Another time I was on a fast Thameslink service (319 formation) to Brighton and the driver forgot to slow down in time for the Haywards Heath stop, overshooting the platform by a good amount. This service was reversed back into the station. Considering the lick we were going at he did a pretty good job of stopping it anywhere near the station!

 

[bramling]

I've been on trains twice where that has happened, must be 12 or more years ago now. One was a rush hour train (8-car 455) from LBG to Dorking where the first stop was scheduled to be Forest Hill. About 20 seconds after we'd gone careering through the station - I could see the looks of surprise on the faces of the waiting passengers - the driver came on to the tannoy to apologise for the failure to call "due to driver error" as he put it. We arrived at Sydenham 2E and waited there for time to catch up. Another time I was on a fast Thameslink service (319 formation) to Brighton and the driver forgot to slow down in time for the Haywards Heath stop, overshooting the platform by a good amount. This service was reversed back into the station. Considering the lick we were going at he did a pretty good job of stopping it anywhere near the station!

I can readily think of 3x occasions:

1) 2x 4Cig the driver missed Stonegate on the up, which the guard subsequently said was due to him believing the train was not booked to call there. The guard pulled him down, but the train ended up past the platform, and subsequently continued. In this case, a simple case of varying calling patterns on the route.

2) 1x 365 missed New Southgate. This was on what was at the time the 16:52 King's Cross to Letchworth. An unusual service in that it was at the time the only booked 365 service to call at New Southgate, so easy to see how the driver could make an oversight. The driver realized at the last minute, but still missed the platform, and subsequently the train continued onwards.

3) 2x 465 nearly missed Hildenborough on the down. This was on a very cold day with plenty of ice and snow about. Driver evidently didn't anticipate the conditions and completely missed the platform thanks to a massive amount of wheelslide. I think this particular platform is notorious for this, the following train had difficulty stopping too and ended up with most of the front unit off the platform.

 

[ANorthernGuard]

Calling patterns are so mixed up on some routes its a surprise that they don't happen more often