Work on Hope Valley line approved

[skifans]

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/network-rail-hope-valley-capacity-order

Addition of a the second platform and Dore, passing loop at Bamford, and work to the Dore south curve to allow a train to wait for a path on the midland mainline without impacting hope valley services has been approved.

Sadly no ETA seems to be present in the documents but hopefully it isn't to long.

Summary of Secretary of State’s decision
For the reasons given in this letter, the Secretary of State has decided to make
this Order and that the planning direction should be given

The Order and planning direction, if made, would authorise NR to construct, operate
and maintain new passing facilities and associated railway infrastructure on the Manchester
to Sheffield Hope Valley route between Bamford and Hathersage and at Dore. It would
comprise two packages of works, one at Bamford (“the Bamford Package”) and one at Dore
(“the Dore Package”). The Bamford Package includes the Bamford Loop which would be
around 1,062 metres long and adjacent to the existing railway. To facilitate the loop,
associated works would be required including the replacement of the Hathersage West foot
crossing with a footbridge. The Dore Package includes the extension of the Dore South
curve and associated works along with capacity improvements to the Dore & Totley Station,
including the creation of a second track through the station. The Order would also authorise
the compulsory acquisition and the temporary use of land for the purposes of the works
and confer powers in connection with the construction, operation and maintenance of the
works. In this letter the proposals are referred to as “the scheme”.

 

[furnessvale]

Good news, but what an amazing read. After 120+ pages of the inspector dismissing objections, the whole thing ground to a halt by ONE objection. Fortunately this was sorted "out of court" after the inquiry. Phew!

 

[TheBigD]

Deleted

 

[Flyingsprinter]

A service between Manchester and derby/Leicester would be very useful indeed. Getting from the north west to the East Midlands is a pain.

 

[Dentonian]

How is the capacity going to be used???
3rd express service between Manchester and Sheffield??? Hourly local service??? New services between Manchester and Derby/Leicester???

Excuse my ignorance of precise routings (in South Yorkshire), but is "Hope Valley" a misnomer, or does Manchester-Stockport-Sheffield count as Hope Valley, even though it is a completely different line through Greater Manchester and into Derbyshire? What I understand as the Hope Valley Line only has stopping services - and with speeds that would make the MP from Telford quoted on another thread apoplectic (lol).

 

[TheBigD]

Deleted

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

It just says 3tph fast trains Sheffield-Manchester, 1tp2h local passenger and 3tp2h freight (max 640m).
There were objections that the NR case mentions freight for Ferrybridge and Cottam (now closed/closing) and Drax (not normally routed this way).
The inspector actually recommended refusal because of impact on access to a private pipeline, but this was resolved after the enquiry.
DfT has given TWA approval, but the detailed works have to be approved by the planning authority before they can start.
A footbridge and lift are needed at Dore for the new platform, so it will be interesting to see if something nicer than the usual ugly modular structure is installed.
There were some very interesting objections, mostly about damaging the local heritage, including one from a 90-year-old engineer.

 

[Dentonian]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hope_Valley_line

Thanks. As I should have worked out. I suppose in rail parlance, the route through New Mills, Marple and crossing north of Stockport is effectively a "branch" line, and won't be affected in any way by this development.

 

[CdBrux]

It just says 3tph fast trains Sheffield-Manchester, 1tp2h local passenger and 3tp2h freight (max 640m).
There were objections that the NR case mentions freight for Ferrybridge and Cottam (now closed/closing) and Drax (not normally routed this way).
The inspector actually recommended refusal because of impact on access to a private pipeline, but this was resolved after the enquiry.

That seems quite a low service for the stoppers? I'm also surprised that freight for two power stations that are closing can seriously make it into a business case so I assume it would be required even without these?

 

[furnessvale]

That seems quite a low service for the stoppers? I'm also surprised that freight for two power stations that are closing can seriously make it into a business case so I assume it would be required even without these?

Presumably the business case for freight had been made some time ago . Even so, limestone for Cottam and Ferrybridge has been replaced by a need for limestone in the south east so no change really.

 

[kevconnor]

I thought it had been said if the upgrades were provided it would allow for 1tph on the hope valley stopper or was the related to another limiting factor (DMU Shortage?) rather than line capacity?

 

[Domh245]

Thanks. As I should have worked out. I suppose in rail parlance, the route through New Mills, Marple and crossing north of Stockport is effectively a "branch" line, and won't be affected in any way by this development.

As noted in the wikipedia article, the hope valley line is defined by Network Rail as being Dore West Junction to Edgeley Jn 1. The route via New Mills doesn't have a proper name, but the running lines are noted as Up/Down Romiley (New Mills Sth Jn - Romiley), Up/Down Reddish Branch (Romiley - Ashburys East Jn) and Up/Down Woodley Branch (Romiley - Hyde North)

 

[Ianno87]

Presumably the business case for freight had been made some time ago . Even so, limestone for Cottam and Ferrybridge has been replaced by a need for limestone in the south east so no change really.

Freight generally is good for business cases due to the lorry miles saved from the road.

 

[aylesbury]

Good to see work on this lovely and important line ,is the resignaling going ahead if so when will it happen?

 

[edwin_m]

That seems quite a low service for the stoppers? I'm also surprised that freight for two power stations that are closing can seriously make it into a business case so I assume it would be required even without these?

Isn't the stopper supposed to be going up to 1TPH on Monday-Friday at some point? It is strengthened by some calls by other trains in the peak hours, which hopefully can be replaced by calls in an extra stopper or semi-fast as they make the "fast" Manchester-Sheffield service slower and more crowded at times when the city-to-city demand is greatest. The places served only by the stopper are pretty tiny. This is also one of the few routes to have better service at the weekends, when there is no freight and significant leisure traffic from both cities.

Freight generally is good for business cases due to the lorry miles saved from the road.

The Hope Valley is the rail access for several major quarries and cement plants, with their only alternative being some highly unsuitable roads.

 

[davyp]

Excuse my ignorance of precise routings (in South Yorkshire), but is "Hope Valley" a misnomer, or does Manchester-Stockport-Sheffield count as Hope Valley, even though it is a completely different line through Greater Manchester and into Derbyshire? What I understand as the Hope Valley Line only has stopping services - and with speeds that would make the MP from Telford quoted on another thread apoplectic (lol).

The "Hope Valley " line goes from Edgeley No2 Junction in Stockport. via the Hazel Grove Chord and on through Nw Mills South Junction, Chinley, the Edale Vally and on to Dore.

Sorry, didn't notice the post above. Doh!

 

[furnessvale]

The "Hope Valley " line goes from Edgeley No2 Junction in Stockport. via the Hazel Grove Chord and on through Nw Mills South Junction, Chinley, the Edale Vally and on to Dore.

Sorry, didn't notice the post above. Doh!

I seem to recall calling it the Hope Valley line before the Hazel Grove chord was even built.

 

[jw]

The current level of service on the route is two fast passenger trains per hour and one stopping train every two hours. The scheme would allow that level of service to rise to three fast trains per hour and one stopping train each hour.

From the decision letter. 3 fast services and hourly stopper.

 

[Altfish]

IIRC there are currently two fast services an hour.
1. The EMT Liverpool to Norwich service
2. The TPE Man Air to Cleethorpes service
I can't see much mileage in a Manchester to Derby/Leicester train going this way, surely via Stoke or Crewe makes more sense.
Maybe a Manchester to Sheffield shuttle.
There is already one stopper per 2-hour - I think - so double the service, hence the passing loop

 

[Ianno87]

IIRC there are currently two fast services an hour.
1. The EMT Liverpool to Norwich service
2. The TPE Man Air to Cleethorpes service
I can't see much mileage in a Manchester to Derby/Leicester train going this way, surely via Stoke or Crewe makes more sense.
Maybe a Manchester to Sheffield shuttle.
There is already one stopper per 2-hour - I think - so double the service, hence the passing loop

There isn't capacity via Stoke or Crewe. And you have to reverse to get to Leicester or Nottingham (if you go via Derby)

 

[Bevan Price]

IIRC there are currently two fast services an hour.
1. The EMT Liverpool to Norwich service
2. The TPE Man Air to Cleethorpes service
I can't see much mileage in a Manchester to Derby/Leicester train going this way, surely via Stoke or Crewe makes more sense.
Maybe a Manchester to Sheffield shuttle.
There is already one stopper per 2-hour - I think - so double the service, hence the passing loop

The Northern May 2018 "consultation" timetable shows some gaps filled in the M-F 2 hourly local services, although not all trains call at every station. The busier saturday service has been hourly for several years, and in good weather, some trains are well-filled with "walking" groups, mostly to/from Edale & Hope.

 

[edwin_m]

I think because the "North" is in control of the project, the third service will definitely go to Sheffield. The Manchester-Sheffield train service has always been much worse than the Manchester-Leeds service serving a roughly comparable city, despite (or because of) the roads also being much worse.

 

[Bletchleyite]

The Northern May 2018 "consultation" timetable shows some gaps filled in the M-F 2 hourly local services, although not all trains call at every station. The busier saturday service has been hourly for several years, and in good weather, some trains are well-filled with "walking" groups, mostly to/from Edale & Hope.

It is said to be those trains and those users who saved it from closure in favour of Woodhead.

 

[HowardGWR]

Regarding the 'which is the Hope Valley Line', in fact, Wikipedia leaves it open. The introduction says (east to west):
'From the western portal of the tunnel, the line runs through Chinley, then splits. The northern branch runs via New Mills Central toward Manchester Piccadilly. The southern branch passes through the Disley Tunnel before merging with the Buxton line and then heading to Stockport to join the main line to Manchester.'
I would have thought that the Hope Valley line is the bit that runs through the Hope Valley, surely? In other words, between the two long tunnels.

 

[Domh245]

Regarding the 'which is the Hope Valley Line', in fact, Wikipedia leaves it open. The introduction says (east to west):
'From the western portal of the tunnel, the line runs through Chinley, then splits. The northern branch runs via New Mills Central toward Manchester Piccadilly. The southern branch passes through the Disley Tunnel before merging with the Buxton line and then heading to Stockport to join the main line to Manchester.'
I would have thought that the Hope Valley line is the bit that runs through the Hope Valley, surely? In other words, between the two long tunnels.

Perhaps if you were looking at objectively, the "Hope Valley" line would be that between Totley and Cowburn tunnels (or at least the former Midland Railway's Dore & Chinley line) - but in the sectional appendix (ie as definitive as you'll get for the time being) the route between Dore West Junction and Edgeley Junction No. 1 (NW9001) is described as "Hope Valley Lines" - as noted above the lines via New Mills Central don't have any reference to Hope Valley

 

[swt_passenger]

This is a TWA order consent. A planning function. Has it got funding as well?

 

[Iskra]

I think because the "North" is in control of the project, the third service will definitely go to Sheffield. The Manchester-Sheffield train service has always been much worse than the Manchester-Leeds service serving a roughly comparable city, despite (or because of) the roads also being much worse.

The South Yorkshire conurbation consists of, Sheffield, Barnsley, Doncaster and Rotherham areas: combined population = 1,365,680 ...services continue to Cleethorpes (40,000), Chesterfield (70,000) and Nottingham (c.330,000)= 1,797,180.
West Yorkshire conurbation: Huddersfield (Kirklees), Wakefield, Leeds, Bradford = 1,991,859 ...services continue to York (198,000), Hull (260,000), Darlo (106,000), Scarborough (52,000) Selby, (14,000), Durham (65,000), Middlesbrough (174,000), Newcastle (576,000) and with a change Sunderland (275,000) = 3,684,196.

Unless you count serving over double the population as comparable, you are mistaken. Sheffield gets 7 carriages per hour, with Leeds services getting 13.5 carriages per hour, with the Leeds services ultimately serving well over double the population. That's before you take into consideration that a 158 carriage has a higher seating density than a 185.

 

[snowball]

This is a TWA order consent. A planning function. Has it got funding as well?

It's in the CP5 Enhancements Delivery Plan and I think at one time it had a target date, but the last several updates, probably since the Hendy report, have all said "Subject to TWAO" instead of a date. If you can find any original CP5 lists it'll probably be in them.

Edit: see page 44 of this:

https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=2&ved=0ahUKEwjIrOmjhqTZAhVMa8AKHTjFC0EQFggxMAE&url=https://www.railfuture.org.uk/ox-cam/docs/NR-CP5-Enhancements-Delivery-Plan.pdf&usg=AOvVaw0hKLfK3pSvtYZTtXLhqWD-

In March 2014 it was supposed to be available by the end of 2018.

Further edit: mentioned in this interview as having slipped from CP5 to CP6, so presumably has to be resubmitted for financial approval:

https://www.railmagazine.com/news/rail-features/i-sense-real-change-at-the-moment?p=3

 

[MichaelAMW]

Perhaps if you were looking at objectively, the "Hope Valley" line would be that between Totley and Cowburn tunnels (or at least the former Midland Railway's Dore & Chinley line) - but in the sectional appendix (ie as definitive as you'll get for the time being) the route between Dore West Junction and Edgeley Junction No. 1 (NW9001) is described as "Hope Valley Lines" - as noted above the lines via New Mills Central don't have any reference to Hope Valley

Moreover, the tracks themselves are only named up and down Hope Valley between Disley tunnel and Edgeley Jct; the rest of the route they are up and down main, with a bit of up and down Manchester around Dore.

 

[swt_passenger]

It's in the CP5 Enhancements Delivery Plan and I think at one time it had a target date, but the last several updates, probably since the Hendy report, have all said "Subject to TWAO" instead of a date. If you can find any original CP5 lists it'll probably be in them.

Edit: see page 44 of this:

https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=2&ved=0ahUKEwjIrOmjhqTZAhVMa8AKHTjFC0EQFggxMAE&url=https://www.railfuture.org.uk/ox-cam/docs/NR-CP5-Enhancements-Delivery-Plan.pdf&usg=AOvVaw0hKLfK3pSvtYZTtXLhqWD-

In March 2014 it was supposed to be available by the end of 2018.

Further edit: mentioned in this interview as having slipped from CP5 to CP6, so presumably has to be resubmitted for financial approval:

https://www.railmagazine.com/news/rail-features/i-sense-real-change-at-the-moment?p=3

VMT for taking the trouble to chase all that up...