Caledonian Sleeper

[Highlandspring]

The isolation necessary to effect repairs took out electrical subsections as far as south as Abington.

 

[TimboM]

The isolation necessary to effect repairs took out electrical subsections as far as south as Abington.

Cheers for the info.

 

[6Z09]

I don’t think BR would have kept spare locos & drivers just for the Sleeper. It’s nothing to do with “fragmented railway”

I am pretty sure there would have been a loco availble at Edinburgh in B R days. On friday night there was not hence after a good effort by many to get the southbound Highlander away as soon as possible it sat at Haymarket for two hours!

 

[TimboM]

I am pretty sure there would have been a loco availble at Edinburgh in B R days. On friday night there was not hence after a good effort by many to get the southbound Highlander away as soon as possible it sat at Haymarket for two hours!

The 66 came from Millerhill Yard - 6 miles from Haymarket. The two hours presumably included a fair bit of 'working out what to do' time...?? (same in any era!)
GB did have a spare loco on-hand in Waverley - it was another 90 though, so in the particular circumstances in question wasn't any help.
Presumably in BR days, the loco(s) on hand in Edinburgh would be diesels capable of hauling a Load 13/14 + dead electric the 100 miles to Carlisle?

Going the other way, 1S25 spent only 20 mins at Carlisle, so 66421 (borrowed from another company) must've been already ready and waiting.

 

[Hipster Dashie]

This is a really cool thread! Some of the technicalities are going over my head a wee bit but the content is interesting nonetheless.

By the way, I got a reply from customer services regarding the folding bike situation. If it goes in the guard wagon then almost certainly I'll need to get up at Edinburgh to move it. Their advice is to keep it in the room if I want to avoid that situation.

I wonder why this is? Presumably I would say it is to a) reduce the work for their own staff having to move heavy objects, and b) from a liability point of view, so they can't end up damaging your stuff or accidentally sending it on the wrong portion of the train.

 

[InOban]

From Millerhill? Are there not diesel locos based at Mossend?

 

[TimboM]

From Millerhill? Are there not diesel locos based at Mossend?

Might have been (DB ones probably) - but Millerhill Yard is almost 30 miles closer to Haymarket and had a GB 66 sat in it.

The DRS 66 to work 1S25 from Carlisle came from Kingmoor depot 2 miles away.

 

[Deafdoggie]

I am pretty sure there would have been a loco availble at Edinburgh in B R days. On friday night there was not hence after a good effort by many to get the southbound Highlander away as soon as possible it sat at Haymarket for two hours!

Yes there would have been. But if you believe that BR would still be using locos and not progressed to DMU/EMU like we have done, then I’d say you were wrong. The situation isn’t because we don’t have BR, but because we aren’t in the 1980’s

 

[Sleepy]

This is a really cool thread! Some of the technicalities are going over my head a wee bit but the content is interesting nonetheless.

By the way, I got a reply from customer services regarding the folding bike situation. If it goes in the guard wagon then almost certainly I'll need to get up at Edinburgh to move it. Their advice is to keep it in the room if I want to avoid that situation.

I wonder why this is? Presumably I would say it is to a) reduce the work for their own staff having to move heavy objects, and b) from a liability point of view, so they can't end up damaging your stuff or accidentally sending it on the wrong portion of the train.

Really ?? is it beyond the wit of Serco to move a few bikes labelled with destination ! So much for wonderful privatised companies. The railwaymen of 60 years ago will be laughing their socks off.

 

[Highlandspring]

From Millerhill? Are there not diesel locos based at Mossend?

Organising a loco at short notice in the middle of the night is never straightforward and requires lots of factors to come together:

• Where is the nearest loco from the same FOC?
• Are there other FOC locos in the vicinity that could reasonably be used?
• Is any other FOC involved willing to allow their assets to be used (NR can only comandeer locos once they’re out on the network and then only to clear the line)?
• Is the available loco compatible with the route(s) and rolling stock?
• Is there a suitable driver available?
• What route knowledge does the driver have?
• What traction knowledge does the driver have?
• Are there possessions or isolations which would prevent a particular loco being used?
• Could possessions or isolations be given up in a reasonable timescale to allow a loco to pass?

There’s actually a huge amount of inter-company cooperation and good will involved in these things but it’s no use having a DB Cargo class 66 available at Mossend with a driver sat on it if there’s a possession on which would take 4 hours to give up preventing it leaving the yard, or if the only available driver books off at 0400 and it’s 0330 now....

 

[Norther Monkey]

What happened to last night's Aberdeen portion? The service shows as cancelled, but looks like it ran as ECS at roughly the same timings.
Perhaps of more interest, what happened to the passengers?

 

[alistairlees]

What happened to last night's Aberdeen portion? The service shows as cancelled, but looks like it ran as ECS at roughly the same timings.
Perhaps of more interest, what happened to the passengers?

The Euston to Aberdeen and Fort William were cancelled last night (stock out of position) with everyone on the Euston Inverness. Buses from Kingussie for Fort William passengers; and ScotRail trains from Perth for Aberdeen ones. I don't know any more details.

 

[Norther Monkey]

The Euston to Aberdeen and Fort William were cancelled last night (stock out of position) with everyone on the Euston Inverness. Buses from Kingussie for Fort William passengers; and ScotRail trains from Perth for Aberdeen ones. I don't know any more details.

Real Time Trains shows the Fort William portion running normally, just the Aberdeen portion cancelled.

 

[Kite159]

Looks like 1S25 is late departing Euston tonight

 

[TimboM]

Organising a loco at short notice in the middle of the night is never straightforward and requires lots of factors to come together:

• Where is the nearest loco from the same FOC?
• Are there other FOC locos in the vicinity that could reasonably be used?
• Is any other FOC involved willing to allow their assets to be used (NR can only comandeer locos once they’re out on the network and then only to clear the line)?
• Is the available loco compatible with the route(s) and rolling stock?
• Is there a suitable driver available?
• What route knowledge does the driver have?
• What traction knowledge does the driver have?
• Are there possessions or isolations which would prevent a particular loco being used?
• Could possessions or isolations be given up in a reasonable timescale to allow a loco to pass?

There’s actually a huge amount of inter-company cooperation and good will involved in these things but it’s no use having a DB Cargo class 66 available at Mossend with a driver sat on it if there’s a possession on which would take 4 hours to give up preventing it leaving the yard, or if the only available driver books off at 0400 and it’s 0330 now....

It's almost like you sit in a control room dealing with these things for real rather than in an armchair!!

 

[TimboM]

Real Time Trains shows the Fort William portion running normally, just the Aberdeen portion cancelled.

The FTW was certainly due to run ECS. Might have been that it was conveying staff and therefore ran as a Class 1, or just not amended in the system.

 

[tigerroar]

Tonight's sleeper from Euston has been cancelled.

What rights do passengers have? When I go, nothing other than waking up in Inverness will do for me.

 

[agbrs_Jack]

Tonight's sleeper from Euston has been cancelled.

What rights do passengers have? When I go, nothing other than waking up in Inverness will do for me.

My thoughts exactly!
If it's cancelled the Kyle train is impossible to make (0855) but the Wick one is if they can get you to Glasgow before 7am.

 

[Essexman]

Tonight's sleeper from Euston has been cancelled.

What rights do passengers have? When I go, nothing other than waking up in Inverness will do for me.

‘Technical fault’ according to website.

 

[47271]

Tonight's sleeper from Euston has been cancelled.

What rights do passengers have? When I go, nothing other than waking up in Inverness will do for me.

They need to get you to your destination and, if your arrival there is 60 minutes or more minutes late, then they need to give you your money back.

The most usual way of handling the first part of this is to provide accomodation on the train in the platform, and then put you on an early train to Glasgow. What have you been offered so far?

Can they get you on the Lowlander?

 

[TimboM]

Tonight's sleeper from Euston has been cancelled.

What rights do passengers have? When I go, nothing other than waking up in Inverness will do for me.

The Guest Charter on the CS website (sleeper.scot) explains the "rights" of passengers in these situations.

Per CS Twitter, passengers are being offered the option of moving to the Lowlander and then onward travel with ScotRail from Glasgow/Edinburgh in the morning arranged by CS, or the option of cancelling and rebooking/getting a refund.

 

[Highlandspring]

It was a fault in the Aberdeen seated coach. The stock is running empty to Edinburgh and will split as usual, 1Y11 runs as booked, 1S25 starts there as a passenger service and 1A25 cancelled with the coaches running empty to Aberdeen.

 

[185143]

I'm booked on this service tonight, from Crewe.

I arrived into Crewe very early (to allow for valuable supping time!). Saw the train was delayed. Spoke to a dispatcher who checked TRUST and saw train still at EUS, advised me to make myself known to Team Leader. Saw on twitter the CS was cancelled, so returned and informed her of that.

Team Leader put me on a pendo to Preston, whilst onboard CS rang me and informed me of the cancellation. Been told to wait at Preston for the Lowlander (at 03:45!! (That came with a LOT of apologies!)) And travel on a ScotRail service tomorrow. When I reach Inverness, I'm to head to head office to sort out a refund.

My main concern however, is that I'm booked to return to London on the sleeper tomorrow night...

 

[philthetube]

I am pretty sure there would have been a loco availble at Edinburgh in B R days. On friday night there was not hence after a good effort by many to get the southbound Highlander away as soon as possible it sat at Haymarket for two hours!

You are probably right, in the same way as there would probably be a Mk 1 Dmu sat spare as well, nothing to do with BR in this case and all to do with not much of that stock in use in the area.

 

[alistairlees]

All highlander passengers should hopefully fit on the lowlander which should be moving soon.

 

[alistairlees]

And just departed Euston 20 late.

 

[TimboM]

My main concern however, is that I'm booked to return to London on the sleeper tomorrow night...

As noted above, 1S25 (INV portion) will still run in the morning EDB-INV as a passenger/day train.

This will mean 67013 + the stock is in position for your train to London tomorrow night.

The issue is with the ABD brake/seats - INV stock is (for now!) OK.

 

[Gathursty]

Quick question.

Where do the North and Southbound Caledonian sleepers (the Highland one) pass each other normally?

 

[Highlandspring]

Between Wamphray and Lockerbie.

 

[Gathursty]

Between Wamphray and Lockerbie.

Many thanks. Far too far away from me to see unfortunately.