BritRail pass, and the EU

[bakerstreet]

Re the availibility of the BritRail fare/pass.

I think I'm right in the following.

The UK Government wanted to offer UK residents to be able to buy tickets for the 2012 Olympics at preferential rates and with priority.

The EU said no as we were all part of Europe and it would be unfair.

So given that we are all part of the EU, is it anti EU to offer BritRail prices to EVERYONE outside of the UK but not within thus denying UK residents getting this beneficial fare.

Can you think of any other examples of industries where this is the case?

I don't smoke but I can buy cheaper cigarettes in other EU countries for consumption here, I can go on a booze cruise to Calais to buy cheaper alcohol.

If you were to buy and use a BritRail pass in the UK as a UK resident, how do you think the case would fare if it went to the haig or other EU court?

 

[First class]

I would imagine it would:

1) Cost you a lot of money to pursue
2) Would result in the product being discontinued

Although I agree entirely with the logic you use!

 

[OwlMan]

As the same rules apply to Interail (can not be used in own country) and this is available all over Europe I would assume that this is legal under European Law.

Peter

 

[GodAtum]

If a get a friend in the Eu to buy a Britrail pass for me, would I be able to use it?

 

[A60K]

No, still not permitted.

 

[mezdup]

No, still not permitted.

That's so unfair!

Discriminatory comes to mind

 

[Greenback]

Re the availibility of the BritRail fare/pass.

I think I'm right in the following.

The UK Government wanted to offer UK residents to be able to buy tickets for the 2012 Olympics at preferential rates and with priority.

The EU said no as we were all part of Europe and it would be unfair.

So given that we are all part of the EU, is it anti EU to offer BritRail prices to EVERYONE outside of the UK but not within thus denying UK residents getting this beneficial fare.

Can you think of any other examples of industries where this is the case?

I don't smoke but I can buy cheaper cigarettes in other EU countries for consumption here, I can go on a booze cruise to Calais to buy cheaper alcohol.

If you were to buy and use a BritRail pass in the UK as a UK resident, how do you think the case would fare if it went to the haig or other EU court?

Hi Andrew do you have a source for the Olympic story? If it's correct, and the cheaper prices were offered on the basis of residency, then it aounds the same circumstances as the Birtrail Pass situation. But as First Class has said, the likely outcome would not be that UK residents could buy Britrail passes, but that they would be withdrawn for all EU residents - this would not be good for tourism though!

 

[bakerstreet]

Hi Andrew do you have a source for the Olympic story? If it's correct, and the cheaper prices were offered on the basis of residency, then it aounds the same circumstances as the Birtrail Pass situation. But as First Class has said, the likely outcome would not be that UK residents could buy Britrail passes, but that they would be withdrawn for all EU residents - this would not be good for tourism though!

Here is one such story

http://www.kentmessenger.co.uk/kentonline/news/2010/march/17/no_priority_forolympic_tickets.aspx

The BBC have also run this I believe.

Re the BritRail pass, presumably even if you had managed to purchase a BritRail pass online, in your name and to your home address it would be fraud if you tried to use it? Or would it be more of an offence aligned to off route, off peak ticket on peak train etc.. I think I can guess : )

 

[Matt Taylor]

But surely we should be entitled to cheaper 2012 tickest on the basis that we are paying for it via our taxes?

 

[Greenback]

Interesting. This story seems to be concerned more about whether the British public will be able to get tickets at all!

The whole residency issue seems to be a very grey area. I mean, what does residency mean? Suppose I have two homes, one in Spain and one in the UK. How long must I stay in my Spanish home to count as a resident? Would I just have to pay the local taxes? Could I not stay there at all and claim to be a resident? I don't knwo what the answers are, but hopefully ther eis some clarification somewhere!

Going back to the Britrail issue, it does seem unfair when EU law appears to work to the advantage of others!

 

[flymo]

Just out of curiosity, when on train staff or ticket barrier staff check these Britrail tickets, do they also ever ask for proof that the holder is not a UK resident?

The reason I ask is that I am a British Citizen but I have lived in Hong Kong for the last 16 years and have permanent residency in HK. Therefore I meet the criteria for the issue and use of a Britrail ticket, i.e. not a UK resident, but still talking in a Geordie accent would the on train staff think I'm trying it on so to speak. I am able to prove I am a HK permanent resident as I carry identification to that effect but I just wonder if the train crews on here would comment as to how the Britrail ticket is checked, simply a date check or something more?

Ta.

 

[Railjet]

Just out of curiosity, when on train staff or ticket barrier staff check these Britrail tickets, do they also ever ask for proof that the holder is not a UK resident?

The reason I ask is that I am a British Citizen but I have lived in Hong Kong for the last 16 years and have permanent residency in HK. Therefore I meet the criteria for the issue and use of a Britrail ticket, i.e. not a UK resident, but still talking in a Geordie accent would the on train staff think I'm trying it on so to speak. I am able to prove I am a HK permanent resident as I carry identification to that effect but I just wonder if the train crews on here would comment as to how the Britrail ticket is checked, simply a date check or something more?

Ta.

I have a similar situation with the Inter-Rail pass, which I legitimately buy in the European country where I am resident (minimum residency requirement is 6 months), but often use in the UK.

The pass shows: name, country of residence and passport number (in my case, UK passport). I have never had a problem in the UK - indeed I have never been asked to show my passport, let alone "prove" my residence, despite conversing quite freely with ticket inspectors .

 

[mickey]

Therefore I meet the criteria for the issue and use of a Britrail ticket, i.e. not a UK resident, but still talking in a Geordie accent would the on train staff think I'm trying it on so to speak. I am able to prove I am a HK permanent resident as I carry identification to that effect

Do you have to speak to hand over a ticket?

Don't worry about it - as you said, you can prove you qualify if necessary. Though in effect a simple statement 'I live in HK' will nearly always suffice.
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Suppose I have two homes, one in Spain and one in the UK. How long must I stay in my Spanish home to count as a resident? Would I just have to pay the local taxes? Could I not stay there at all and claim to be a resident? I don't knwo what the answers are, but hopefully ther eis some clarification somewhere!

Going back to the Britrail issue, it does seem unfair when EU law appears to work to the advantage of others!

6 months usually qualifies you for residency. Whether it's six continuous months I don't know, but I suspect you'd have no problem as long as you can show you moved there at least six months ago. I think you have to buy it outside the UK though.

It doesn't work to British people's disadvantage at all, as we are perfectly entitled to buy inter-rail passes for other European countries. (Britrail is a separate issue as it's not for Europeans.) Since the scheme specifically says it's designed for people to explore other countries than the one in which they live I very much doubt it will fall foul of EU law. In this respect it's different from the Olympics, where the question is about whether we should have a special rule that no one else has to follow, while with train tickets we're all equal in our entitlement, it's just that the tickets are for different places.