Class800
Established Member
Sunderland to Newcastle need to go via the King Edward bridge not the High Level bridge on the approach to Newcastle Central, in order to avoid a reversal in Newcastle.
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Trivia: What's the longest possible journey a train could make between two UK stations without reversing?
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backontrack
Established Member
Of course, I'd factored that in
I think you can even do this:
Westbury - Melksham - Chippenham - Swindon - Oxford - Leamington - Nuneaton - (Aldridge) - Walsall - Kidderminster - Hereford - Newport - Cardiff - Rhoose - Bridgend - Pontarddulais - Shrewsbury - Chester - Crewe - Wolverhampton - Birmingham.
Peterthegreat
Established Member
How do you get from Walsall to Kidderminster?Of course, I'd factored that in
I think you can even do this:
Westbury - Melksham - Chippenham - Swindon - Oxford - Leamington - Nuneaton - (Aldridge) - Walsall - Kidderminster - Hereford - Newport - Cardiff - Rhoose - Bridgend - Pontarddulais - Shrewsbury - Chester - Crewe - Wolverhampton - Birmingham.
backontrack
Established Member
Brierley Hill Line.
But it probably won't work to be honest, because it means we don't get to go through Walsall later.
Westbury - Melksham - Chippenham - Swindon - Oxford - Evesham - Hereford - Newport - Cardiff - Rhoose - Bridgend - Pontarddulais - Shrewsbury - Chester - Crewe - Wolverhampton - Birmingham will do.
Class800
Established Member
I believe it's a rare routing in passenger service, but I believe it is occasionally used and is possible to use - running from the Sunderland direction via the King EdwardOf course, I'd factored that in
backontrack
Established Member
Wonderful. I'm working on a map of what I think is the longest-possible journey, at present; it should be uploaded soon
Peterthegreat
Established Member
Isn't the Brierley Hill line severed?
backontrack
Established Member
So... I think this is the ultimate routing.
PART ONE
Penzance to Birmingham New Street
Penzance - Plymouth - Exeter - Taunton - Frome - (avoiding Westbury) - Reading - Guildford - Havant - Southampton - Salisbury - Westbury - Chippenham - Swindon - (Didcot west curve) - Oxford - Leamington Spa - Birmingham Snow Hill - Kidderminster - Worcester Foregate Street - Hereford - Newport - Cardiff - Barry - Bridgend - Briton Ferry - Pontarddulais - Craven Arms - Shrewsbury - Nantwich - (Crewe south curve) - Stafford - Wolverhampton - Birmingham New Street.
PART TWO
Birmingham to London St Pancras
Birmingham New Street - Water Orton - Tamworth (High Level) - Burton-upon-Trent - (Castle Donington) - Ilkeston - Chesterfield - (Killamarsh) - Swinton - Doncaster - Fitzwilliam - Wakefield Kirkgate - Mirfield - Hebden Bridge - Blackburn - Bolton - Manchester Victoria - Ashton - (Droylsden) - Denton - Stockport - Chinley - Sheffield - Darnall - Shirebrook - Nottingham - Newark Castle - Lincoln - Sleaford - Peterborough - Hitchin - Hertford North - Finsbury Park - London St Pancras.
PART THREE
London St Pancras to Cambridge
London St Pancras - City Thameslink - Herne Hill - Tulse Hill - Streatham - Wimbledon - Wallington - West Croydon - Crystal Palace - Balham - Clapham Junction - Wandsworth Road - Denmark Hill - Lewisham - Abbey Wood - Slade's Green - Crayford - Sidcup - Lee - Grove Park - Chislehurst - Swanley - Otford - Sevenoaks - Tonbridge - Ashford International - Dover Priory - Margate - Chatham - Ebbsfleet International - Barking - South Tottenham - Harlow Town - Audley End - Cambridge.
PART FOUR
Cambridge to York
Cambridge - Bury St Edmunds - Ipswich - Colchester - Chelmsford - Stratford - Willesden Jn - Watford Jn - Bletchley - Bedford - Corby - Melton Mowbray - Leicester - Nuneaton - Tamworth (Low Level) - Rugeley - Stoke - Crewe - Styal - Manchester Piccadilly - Deansgate - Eccles - Wigan North Western - Preston - Lancaster - Carnforth - Ulverston - Barrow-in-Furness - Workington - Dalston - Armathwaite - Settle - Skipton - Shipley - Woodlesford - Castleford - Sherburn-in-Elmet - York.
PART FIVE
York to Wick
York - Northallerton - Eaglescliffe - Hartlepool - Sunderland - (King Edward Bridge) - Newcastle - Dunbar - (Edinburgh South Suburban) - Slateford - Carstairs - Wishaw - Holytown - Motherwell - Hamilton Central - Newton - Rutherglen - Glasgow Central (Low Level) - Anniesland - Maryhill - Lenzie - Falkirk Grahamston - Linlithgow - Dalmeny - Cowdenbeath - Markinch - Perth - Dundee - Aberdeen - Nairn - (Rose Street Curve) - Beauly - Dingwall - Tain - Helmsdale - Georgemas Jn - Wick.
PART ONE
Penzance to Birmingham New Street
Penzance - Plymouth - Exeter - Taunton - Frome - (avoiding Westbury) - Reading - Guildford - Havant - Southampton - Salisbury - Westbury - Chippenham - Swindon - (Didcot west curve) - Oxford - Leamington Spa - Birmingham Snow Hill - Kidderminster - Worcester Foregate Street - Hereford - Newport - Cardiff - Barry - Bridgend - Briton Ferry - Pontarddulais - Craven Arms - Shrewsbury - Nantwich - (Crewe south curve) - Stafford - Wolverhampton - Birmingham New Street.
PART TWO
Birmingham to London St Pancras
Birmingham New Street - Water Orton - Tamworth (High Level) - Burton-upon-Trent - (Castle Donington) - Ilkeston - Chesterfield - (Killamarsh) - Swinton - Doncaster - Fitzwilliam - Wakefield Kirkgate - Mirfield - Hebden Bridge - Blackburn - Bolton - Manchester Victoria - Ashton - (Droylsden) - Denton - Stockport - Chinley - Sheffield - Darnall - Shirebrook - Nottingham - Newark Castle - Lincoln - Sleaford - Peterborough - Hitchin - Hertford North - Finsbury Park - London St Pancras.
PART THREE
London St Pancras to Cambridge
London St Pancras - City Thameslink - Herne Hill - Tulse Hill - Streatham - Wimbledon - Wallington - West Croydon - Crystal Palace - Balham - Clapham Junction - Wandsworth Road - Denmark Hill - Lewisham - Abbey Wood - Slade's Green - Crayford - Sidcup - Lee - Grove Park - Chislehurst - Swanley - Otford - Sevenoaks - Tonbridge - Ashford International - Dover Priory - Margate - Chatham - Ebbsfleet International - Barking - South Tottenham - Harlow Town - Audley End - Cambridge.
PART FOUR
Cambridge to York
Cambridge - Bury St Edmunds - Ipswich - Colchester - Chelmsford - Stratford - Willesden Jn - Watford Jn - Bletchley - Bedford - Corby - Melton Mowbray - Leicester - Nuneaton - Tamworth (Low Level) - Rugeley - Stoke - Crewe - Styal - Manchester Piccadilly - Deansgate - Eccles - Wigan North Western - Preston - Lancaster - Carnforth - Ulverston - Barrow-in-Furness - Workington - Dalston - Armathwaite - Settle - Skipton - Shipley - Woodlesford - Castleford - Sherburn-in-Elmet - York.
PART FIVE
York to Wick
York - Northallerton - Eaglescliffe - Hartlepool - Sunderland - (King Edward Bridge) - Newcastle - Dunbar - (Edinburgh South Suburban) - Slateford - Carstairs - Wishaw - Holytown - Motherwell - Hamilton Central - Newton - Rutherglen - Glasgow Central (Low Level) - Anniesland - Maryhill - Lenzie - Falkirk Grahamston - Linlithgow - Dalmeny - Cowdenbeath - Markinch - Perth - Dundee - Aberdeen - Nairn - (Rose Street Curve) - Beauly - Dingwall - Tain - Helmsdale - Georgemas Jn - Wick.
By running Reading - Guildford - Havant you are missing a longer loop of running Reading - Acton Main Line - Olympia - Clapham Junction - Gatwick - Preston - Hove - Havant
Can you re-route after City Thameslink to avoid Clapham Junction ? If so you may loose a few miles but less than you gain.
Can you re-route after City Thameslink to avoid Clapham Junction ? If so you may loose a few miles but less than you gain.
backontrack
Established Member
Yes, that's excellent.
An alternate routing could be:
City Thameslink - London Bridge - New Cross - Anerley - West Croydon - Sutton - Wimbledon - Streatham - Tulse Hill - Herne Hill - Peckham Rye - Lewisham
Peterthegreat
Established Member
A longer route through Yorkshire on part 2 would be Doncaster to Wakefield Kirkgate via Askern and Pontefract Monkhill. It might even be longer to go Doncaster, Templehirst, Selby Canal, Gascoigne Wood, Pontefract Monkhill to Wakefield Kirkgate. However you would then need to amend part 4 to run from Shipley to York via Leeds and Garforth.
Is it longer to go from Worcester to Newport via Hereford or via Bristol Parkway?
MadMac
Member
One point of note is that to get from Dunbar to the Sub, you’d have to go through Millerhill Yard: I don’t think that move’s signalled for passenger trains, if that’s a consideration.
backontrack
Established Member
Ahh. Well, the difference between that and via Waverley isn't long, and in any case I think as a one-off for this theoretical thread, it might be possible...
That's excellent! Thank you. Definitely via Pontefract, and I'm unsure as to whether Gascoigne Wood and Garforth is longer than Askern and Leeds; my hunch is that it is...
I'm not sure, but I think it may well be via Bristol Parkway. Excellent spot! Thank you
This is the new routing:
Can that be improved?
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London Trains
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Reading to Clapham Jct could be slightly lengthened by not running straight down the GWML:
Reading - Wokingham - Ascot - Staines - Feltham - Richmond - Gunnersbury - Acton Central - Shepherds Bush - Clapham Jct
Reading - Wokingham - Ascot - Staines - Feltham - Richmond - Gunnersbury - Acton Central - Shepherds Bush - Clapham Jct
Oh this bloody forum. I've spent 12 hours diddling on this and drawing out routes on top of NARA and writing out the results. It was really really long and all. Then when I click "post reply" the stupid thing throws a wobbly and loses the whole bloody lot. Fills me with the urge to defecate, it really does.
So here we go again: a tangled mix of other people's suggestions and my own chopping of it about. It's probably best to regard this as a fork of the original project beginning from post 15, because I've been too involved with working stuff out to read what was going on at the same time, and I didn't expect so much to have happened either. And I haven't looked at Scotland because NARA doesn't go north of York. Junctions/curves of whose existence I was dubious have been checked using streetmap dot co dot uk OS 1:25000 maps, which usually seem to be pretty up to date.
THE SOUTH WEST: Penzance, Taunton, Westbury, Reading, Guildford, Southampton, Bath, Severn Tunnel
WELSH LEEKAGE: Newport, Cardiff, Barry, Bridgend, Swansea district, Central Wales, Shrewsbury, Wrexham, Birkenhead, Liverpool loop
CHESHIRE AN' STUFF: Chester, Northwich, Sandbach, Crewe avoider, Stafford, Wolverhampton, Stour Valley, Birmingham New Street
BRUMMY LOOP: Camp Hill, Lickey, Cheltenham, Swindon, Didcot west curve, Oxford, Evesham, Worcester, Kiddy, Birmingham Snow Hill
GW FROM THE NORTH: Solihull, Leamington, Banbury, Wycombe, Greenford, Ealing, Acton
THE MIDLAND: Dudding Hill line, MML, Kettering, Manton, Syston, Trent
COAL WOZ ERE: Trent avoider, Earwash route, Pinxton, Kirkby in Ashfield, Shireoaks, South Yorks Joint, Doncaster, Selby
AND BACK DOWN AGAIN: Hambleton, Pontefract, Swinton, Rotherham, Beighton, Chesterfield, Derby, Trent, Nottingham, Newark
THIS BIT IS INCREDIBLY BORING: Lincoln, Sleaford, Spalding, Peterborough, ECML, Hertford loop, Thameslink tunnel
ATTACK OF THE MUTANT SQUIRRELS: South London squirrel's nest, Tonbridge, Ashford, Dover, Ramsgate, Strood, Ebbsfleet
EAST ANGLIAN CIRCUIT: Barking, Tottenham, Cheshunt, Cambridge, Ipswich, Chelmsford, Stratford, NLL
L&B: Willesden, WCML, Northampton, Coventry, Stechford, Perry Barr
CAN'T REMEMBER WHERE I'M GOING: Walsall, Sutton Park line, Nuneaton, nearly Leicester, Coalville, Burton, Lichfield
HILLS OF THE NORTH REJOICE: Rugeley, Stoke, Crewe, WCML, Carnforth, Cumbrian coast, S&C
HILLS OF THE NOT SO FAR NORTH ARE A BIT YUCK: Hellifield, Blackburn, Bolton, Manchester Vic, Todmorden, Hebden Bridge
HILLS OF EVEN LESS FAR NORTH GET QUITE NICE AGAIN: Huddersfield, Standedge, Stalybridge, Stockport, Hazel Grove, Whaley Bridge, Peak Forest loop, Chinley, Edale, Sheffield
MORE NOT COAL AGAIN: Barnsley, Wakefield Kirkgate, Normanton, Leeds, Church Fenton, York
ONWARD: To Scotland
NARA doesn't go any further north than York, so neither have I.
So here we go again: a tangled mix of other people's suggestions and my own chopping of it about. It's probably best to regard this as a fork of the original project beginning from post 15, because I've been too involved with working stuff out to read what was going on at the same time, and I didn't expect so much to have happened either. And I haven't looked at Scotland because NARA doesn't go north of York. Junctions/curves of whose existence I was dubious have been checked using streetmap dot co dot uk OS 1:25000 maps, which usually seem to be pretty up to date.
THE SOUTH WEST: Penzance, Taunton, Westbury, Reading, Guildford, Southampton, Bath, Severn Tunnel
WELSH LEEKAGE: Newport, Cardiff, Barry, Bridgend, Swansea district, Central Wales, Shrewsbury, Wrexham, Birkenhead, Liverpool loop
CHESHIRE AN' STUFF: Chester, Northwich, Sandbach, Crewe avoider, Stafford, Wolverhampton, Stour Valley, Birmingham New Street
BRUMMY LOOP: Camp Hill, Lickey, Cheltenham, Swindon, Didcot west curve, Oxford, Evesham, Worcester, Kiddy, Birmingham Snow Hill
GW FROM THE NORTH: Solihull, Leamington, Banbury, Wycombe, Greenford, Ealing, Acton
THE MIDLAND: Dudding Hill line, MML, Kettering, Manton, Syston, Trent
COAL WOZ ERE: Trent avoider, Earwash route, Pinxton, Kirkby in Ashfield, Shireoaks, South Yorks Joint, Doncaster, Selby
AND BACK DOWN AGAIN: Hambleton, Pontefract, Swinton, Rotherham, Beighton, Chesterfield, Derby, Trent, Nottingham, Newark
THIS BIT IS INCREDIBLY BORING: Lincoln, Sleaford, Spalding, Peterborough, ECML, Hertford loop, Thameslink tunnel
ATTACK OF THE MUTANT SQUIRRELS: South London squirrel's nest, Tonbridge, Ashford, Dover, Ramsgate, Strood, Ebbsfleet
EAST ANGLIAN CIRCUIT: Barking, Tottenham, Cheshunt, Cambridge, Ipswich, Chelmsford, Stratford, NLL
L&B: Willesden, WCML, Northampton, Coventry, Stechford, Perry Barr
CAN'T REMEMBER WHERE I'M GOING: Walsall, Sutton Park line, Nuneaton, nearly Leicester, Coalville, Burton, Lichfield
HILLS OF THE NORTH REJOICE: Rugeley, Stoke, Crewe, WCML, Carnforth, Cumbrian coast, S&C
HILLS OF THE NOT SO FAR NORTH ARE A BIT YUCK: Hellifield, Blackburn, Bolton, Manchester Vic, Todmorden, Hebden Bridge
HILLS OF EVEN LESS FAR NORTH GET QUITE NICE AGAIN: Huddersfield, Standedge, Stalybridge, Stockport, Hazel Grove, Whaley Bridge, Peak Forest loop, Chinley, Edale, Sheffield
MORE NOT COAL AGAIN: Barnsley, Wakefield Kirkgate, Normanton, Leeds, Church Fenton, York
ONWARD: To Scotland
NARA doesn't go any further north than York, so neither have I.
Class800
Established Member
Denton - specify which one - presume you mean the Parliamentary line Guide Bridge to Stockport (Part 2)
Slade Green not Slade Green (Part 3)
Ebbsfleet International to Barking (Part 3) - how will you do that? The HS2 line is separate and runs to Stratford International, unaware of any connection to Barking
Peterthegreat
Established Member
There is a connection at Dagenham Junction.
You would cover the section between Birkenhead Hamilton Square and Liverpool James St twice, once in each direction.
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Peterthegreat
Established Member
Nope because you go through Crewe later.
oddiesjack
Member
i don't think its possible to access the Midland line towards Peak Forest directly from the "wessie" line through Whaley Bridge at Buxton, you can only take the Hindlow branch off the "wessie" .
backontrack
Established Member
That's bloody exceptional. All of this is absolutely the toppest of notches. You've even worked in some things that I couldn't - like Coalville and Greenford.
Might need to iron out a couple of wrinkles. You can't go through Hamilton Square twice, and you also can't use the south throat at Crewe twice. Hmm.
The only way you can get through Crewe twice is by doing Chester then using the avoiding towards Stafford, then later on doing from Stoke into Crewe then northbound. In that respect, I think you're OK with Shrewsbury - Chester - Crewe - Stafford. It's the stretch from Sandbach to Crewe that stuffs it up, so the Northwich detour is dropped.
I've been looking at a route that allows you to go through Liverpool - sadly, you can't do both that AND go through Crewe twice. You can get down from the Liverpool Loop to Central, but at Garston there's no connection onto the WCML - so you go via Birchwood and Styal. I thought I had a route that would get you on the right track - there to Wilmslow, Middlewich, Northwich and Chester - but sadly you'd have to reverse at Chester.
Still, no bother - just run Shrewsbury - Chester - Crewe - Stafford. It's an excellent routing, otherwise!
Peterthegreat
Established Member
I am not sure the line avoiding Crewe station from the Chester line is still in situ so you would need to go through Crewe station.
Andyjs247
Member
Coming from Chester you could go via Northwich, Middlewich and the Manchester Independent Lines at Crewe
Peterthegreat
Established Member
But you then go back through Sandbach!
London Trains
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I havent figured out how this could fit into the routing, but a route around Liverpool could add a fair few miles:
Crewe - Wilmslow - Styal - Manchester Piccadilly - Trafford Park - Warrington Central - Hunts Cross - Liverpool Central - Birkdale - Meols Cop - Burscough Bridge - Wigan Wallgate
Then you can go towards Hindley or down the WCML.
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