Avanti West Coast cancellations

[Frankton Junct]

A cousin of mine visiting from New Zealand is booked on the 11:30 Euston to Glasgow Central today and so I will track the progress of this service. I warned my cousin of the daily service disruptions. Visitors from abroad usually don't know the geography of Britain or the railway network or their rights during disruptions and so travel by rail here can be confusing and stressful for them.

I note that this morning, the first morning of the Commonwealth Games, the 07:59 9G07 to Birmingham New Street was cancelled (but it seems to have run as ECS as 5G07 - I assume it had a driver but no guard) then the 08:23 9G98 was cancelled. The 08:43 Euston to Edinburgh via Birmingham New Street 9S54 departed at 09:10 - I assume this service was delayed due to loading passengers displaced from 9G07 and 9G98.

 

[gazzaa2]

With LNWR off and LNER limited, Avanti need a better weekend.

 

[dk1]

I note that this morning, the first morning of the Commonwealth Games, the 07:59 9G07 to Birmingham New Street was cancelled (but it seems to have run as ECS as 5G07 - I assume it had a driver but no guard) then the 08:23 9G98 was cancelled. The 08:43 Euston to Edinburgh via Birmingham New Street 9S54 departed at 09:10 - I assume this service was delayed due to loading passengers displaced from 9G07 and 9G98.

Looks like 9S54 was delayed awaiting traincrew.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 29 Jul 2022 ==

With LNWR off and LNER limited, Avanti need a better weekend.

I won’t hold my breath on that one.

 

[peter166]

Numerous cancellations today. 25 listed on Journeycheck at the last count plus several trains starting/terminating short. So much for a more reliable temporary timetable. Once again the weekend appears to have started early.

 

[Pinus contorta]

Hoping none of the travelling athletes get caught up in Avanti cancellations. Not ideal preparation for them standing on a train.

 

[Meyrick]

Yes, essentially. Manchester has been cut to 1tph.

This isn't true at all?

 

[Bletchleyite]

Numerous cancellations today. 25 listed on Journeycheck at the last count plus several trains starting/terminating short. So much for a more reliable temporary timetable. Once again the weekend appears to have started early.

They clearly haven't cut enough.

What's hard about setting a timetable they can deliver and being honest about the situation?

They really are an awful TOC.

 

[peter166]

This isn't true at all?

Its not far off if you take into account the many cancellations to/from Manchester

Avanti West Coast JourneyCheck - Train times and live real time delay/cancellation/disruption information.

Avanti West Coast JourneyCheck provides real time, up-to-date train times and train disruption information keeping you informed about any delays or cancellations on the network and helping you know what to do when your journey is affected. Train Cancellations, Delays, Alterations and...

www.journeycheck.com

 

[Merseysider]

Numerous cancellations today. 25 listed on Journeycheck at the last count plus several trains starting/terminating short. So much for a more reliable temporary timetable. Once again the weekend appears to have started early.

That appears to include the very first services from Wolverhampton (0500), Manchester (0505) and 2nd train of the day from Liverpool (0605). There’s no hope

 

[Carlisle]

That appears to include the very first services from Wolverhampton (0500), Manchester (0505) and 2nd train of the day from Liverpool (0605). There’s no hope

Not that surprising if they’re normally pretty quiet services anyway given their extremely early departure times & less commuting on Fridays.

 

[londonmidland]

When travelling at weekends, I’ve noticed North of Preston it’s a ‘free for all’ with crowds of TPE and Avanti pax both using each other’s services (the ones that actually run)

Often passengers are left on the platform because it’s too crowded to board. It really doesn’t give a good impression to both first time and frequent travellers.

 

[Urban-Savage]

Hi - after some advise if possible
Looking at travelling to London on Sat 13th Aug - ex Liverpool - early am / return Monday off peak - appreciating the current chaos - what i cant clearly see is - is there a planned service these days and are there any planned strikes - the sale of the industrial unrest at present means i cant see the wood for the trees sadly!

Cheers

 

[87015]

They clearly haven't cut enough.

What's hard about setting a timetable they can deliver and being honest about the situation?

They really are an awful TOC.

You can’t re-roster with no goodwill. Doesn’t matter what you’ve cut to if you can’t diagram to it and given imposed rostering is at the root of much of the issues, was hardly going to help.

 

[800001]

Avanti staff have been sent the attached

 

[Bletchleyite]

You can’t re-roster with no goodwill. Doesn’t matter what you’ve cut to if you can’t diagram to it and given imposed rostering is at the root of much of the issues, was hardly going to help.

If imposed rostering is already the issue, just impose another one. It can't be any worse.

I don't entirely get why actual rosters have to be agreed, and don't see why that sort of micromanagement by Unions is tolerated. I do get that it isn't acceptable just to change peoples' shift times, but if you're on shift you do what your employer wants between those times. For instance today I've been asked to do some data checking instead of my normal work, and I'm doing it, because I'm being paid to do it so I do what I'm told.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 29 Jul 2022 ==

Avanti staff have been sent the attached

That seems to imply that they think people are "pulling sickies".

 

[jfollows]

That seems to imply that they think people are "pulling sickies".

I agree.
If my employer had ever told me that I should only take sick leave from work in cases of "genuine sickness" I'd have started to think about resigning if I wasn't already. I don't think this is going to help the situation in any way. Someone needs to come up with a fresh approach, easier said than done.

 

[800001]

I agree.
If my employer had ever told me that I should only take sick leave from work in cases of "genuine sickness" I'd have started to think about resigning if I wasn't already. I don't think this is going to help the situation in any way. Someone needs to come up with a fresh approach, easier said than done.

Wonder if the Letter is actually from Grant Shapps

 

[Bletchleyite]

If my employer had ever told me that I should only take sick leave from work in cases of "genuine sickness" I'd have started to think about resigning if I wasn't already.

Why? Guilty conscience?

An interesting question is whether people are pulling sickies or not. I suspect they're not and this is just a symptom of relationship breakdown (plus levels are higher everywhere because of COVID). But if they are then that's gross misconduct.

 

[6Gman]

Avanti staff have been sent the attached

The floggings will continue until morale improves.

 

[jfollows]

Why? Guilty conscience?

Ha, no, but more seriously I was able to work in an environment in which I could trust my employer and there was some "give and take" in the sense that the employer didn't enforce all the contractual obligations (working hours etc.) whereas I was prepared to go "above and beyond" where circumstances warranted. I think a lot of us have been there, but not everyone.
In the case of my first significant employer, IBM, I resigned when I felt the balance had tilted to being expected to go "above and beyond" but getting nothing in return for it, and an increasing enforcement of "the rules" by my employer. So I left.
More relevantly, here, it's clear that this trust is pretty non-existent between the people who run Avanti and the people who run its trains. That's unfortunate, to say the least. Something radical needs to be done to fix this, and I don't see it happening. In the meantime I'm not placing any personal reliance on them, in other words I won't be using their trains until this is fixed.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Ha, no, but more seriously I was able to work in an environment in which I could trust my employer and there was some "give and take" in the sense that the employer didn't enforce all the contractual obligations (working hours etc.) whereas I was prepared to go "above and beyond" where circumstances warranted. I think a lot of us have been there, but not everyone.
In the case of my first significant employer, IBM, I resigned when I felt the balance had tilted to being expected to go "above and beyond" but getting nothing in return for it, and an increasing enforcement of "the rules" by my employer. So I left.
More relevantly, here, it's clear that this trust is pretty non-existent between the people who run Avanti and the people who run its trains. That's unfortunate, to say the least. Something radical needs to be done to fix this, and I don't see it happening. In the meantime I'm not placing any personal reliance on them, in other words I won't be using their trains until this is fixed.

Completely agree with this, but I've always been of the view that sick leave is for when you're sick and not for other purposes. Most UK companies are very generous in providing effectively unlimited* amounts of this on full pay, and in return for this it is only right that it isn't abused. So I don't see an issue with companies reminding people of this if they might be seen as abusing it.

Some people think it's OK to call in sick with a hangover, for instance. On the railway if you have gone and done that then you're indeed best not working and would probably fail a drink test, but it'd be right to be honest about your error of judgement and take a day's leave or unpaid rather than to call in sick.

* There usually is a limit, but normally it's so high that you'd have to be very seriously ill to get anywhere near it.

 

[td97]

Manchester Avanti cancellations are less than ideal as Crosscountry seem to have fallen apart today. The XC Manchester departures cancelled are at 1427, 1727, 1827, 1905, 1927, 2027 (no XC service from 1705 until 2127). Those passengers will have ticket acceptance with Avanti

 

[Bletchleyite]

Manchester Avanti cancellations are less than ideal as Crosscountry seem to have fallen apart today. The XC Manchester departures cancelled are at 1427, 1727, 1827, 1905, 1927, 2027 (no XC service from 1705 until 2127). Those passengers will have ticket acceptance with Avanti

Sensible way from Euston to Manchester is probably LNR to Crewe and then Northern, avoids both. Not an option tomorrow though!

 

[D6130]

Most UK companies are very generous in providing effectively unlimited* amounts of this on full pay, and in return for this it is only right that it isn't abused. So I don't see an issue with companies reminding people of this if they might be seen as abusing it.

* There usually is a limit, but normally it's so high that you'd have to be very seriously ill to get anywhere near it.

When I worked on the railway - latterly for Northern - the limit for paid sick leave without a medical certificate was seven days. With a medical certificate, the limit for sick leave on full pay was six months....followed by a further six months on half pay. Anyone who was still on sick leave after a year would more than likely be paid off....unless their illness or injuries were work-related and clearly the 'railway's' fault.

 

[Bantamzen]

Completely agree with this, but I've always been of the view that sick leave is for when you're sick and not for other purposes. Most UK companies are very generous in providing effectively unlimited* amounts of this on full pay, and in return for this it is only right that it isn't abused. So I don't see an issue with companies reminding people of this if they might be seen as abusing it.

Totally agree. I used to work in an environment where pulling sickies was seen almost as an extension to annual / Flexi leave. It was very frustrating as someone who would drag himself in with massive hangovers after a works night out to make sure I at least got something done. If someone is genuinely I'll, they absolutely have the right to take time off, but this country does still have a bit of a sickie culture.

Some people think it's OK to call in sick with a hangover, for instance. On the railway if you have gone and done that then you're indeed best not working and would probably fail a drink test, but it'd be right to be honest about your error of judgement and take a day's leave or unpaid rather than to call in sick.

* There usually is a limit, but normally it's so high that you'd have to be very seriously ill to get anywhere near it.

Honestly speaking, should rail staff in safety critical roles even be getting into a state that will induce a hangover the day before a shift? I'd hope not.

 

[Bertie the bus]

Completely agree with this, but I've always been of the view that sick leave is for when you're sick and not for other purposes. Most UK companies are very generous in providing effectively unlimited* amounts of this on full pay, and in return for this it is only right that it isn't abused. So I don't see an issue with companies reminding people of this if they might be seen as abusing it.

Some people think it's OK to call in sick with a hangover, for instance. On the railway if you have gone and done that then you're indeed best not working and would probably fail a drink test, but it'd be right to be honest about your error of judgement and take a day's leave or unpaid rather than to call in sick.

* There usually is a limit, but normally it's so high that you'd have to be very seriously ill to get anywhere near it.

I’m not sure I agree with your analysis. It looks to me as though the management are suggesting some staff are effectively taking unofficial (paid) industrial action by using sick days rather than pulling a sickie when it is self inflicted.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I’m not sure I agree with your analysis. It looks to me as though the management are suggesting some staff are effectively taking unofficial (paid) industrial action by using sick days rather than pulling a sickie when it is self inflicted.

It's quite possible that they are.

 

[XAM2175]

I would suggest that it's very poor form - not to mention inflammatory - to send an email to the whole workforce that effectively accuses them of all being dishonest. It's certainly not one I'd like to receive.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I would suggest that it's very poor form - not to mention inflammatory - to send an email to the whole workforce that effectively accuses them of all being dishonest. It's certainly not one I'd like to receive.

Crikey, some people have thin skin.

If you're not pulling a sickie, it's obviously not aimed at you.

If you are, well...

 

[XAM2175]

If you're not pulling a sickie, it's obviously not aimed at you.

It is aimed at me, because it suggests that any legitimate sick leave that I may need to take will be presumed by the company to be deceitful. Thus it indicates that there is reduction in the extent to which I'm trusted to act professionally.